The quote comes from this speech: https://piedmontexedra.com/2022/06/former-u-s-ambassador-to-australia-jeff-bleich-delivers-phs-commencement-speech-on-courage-in-difficult-times?unapproved=4631&moderation-hash=e6724e6490a2e9e5f47211f192f3ca4b#comment-4631
I am accepting the quote as factual, but of these firearm deaths for ages 0 to 24, how many are gang related?
Can I ask why that would matter and also for a definition of gang related? Is a child hit by a stray round from two criminals shooting count as a gang death?
This is FQ. That would be a discussion for another forum.
Okay yes I will include collateral damages.
I think gang related is self explanatory, isn’t it?
This site has some interesting stats. More than 50% of gun-related deaths are suicide, but I don’t know how that breaks down by age. However, suicide is a major cause of death for younger people.
So, potentially, less than half of those gun-related deaths are not suicide. Of those, I imagine there are a lot of gang-related deaths, but I can’t find the stats.
No, it’s not, which is why I asked. And I think why it matters is relevant too. Because there seems to be an attitude that black kids killed on the streets of Chicago by crossfire don’t count somehow. A dead kid is a dead kid.
If you can’t define what you mean by gang related, then there isn’t any way to provide meaningful data.
OK, that same site says that 59% of gun murders use a handgun, and 36% were “type not stated.” Let’s guess that half of the type not stated were handguns, and I imagine most gang-related deaths use handguns.
Assuming suicides are at least 51%, then among the 49%, 78% of those are handguns, maybe, and maybe 70% of those are gang related?
So, maybe 25% are gang related?? That’s a pretty rough estimate. However, I feel comfortable stating that less than 50% are gang-related, given the high rate of suicides and the high use of suicides by gun.
Would you count the LAPD (is it the LAPD or the sheriff, I can’t remember) operating as a gang? They meet pretty much all the same criteria?
I’m not a mod or anything, but it seems like a lot of these answers aren’t really FQ answers. Anyway, I doubt LAPD contributes a significant number of the nationwide youth deaths due to firearms.
This goes to the definition of gang. The OP stated that they felt the definition was obvious, but I don’t think it is. And it will have huge impact on the statistics. The LAPD by itself won’t change the numbers too much, but clarifying the definition of gang violence will.
In the world of crime statistics, I don’t believe anyone defines the LAPD as a gang.
In the world of crime statistics, I don’t believe anyone defines the LASD as a gang.
There were literal gangs operating within the LASD (thank you TriPolar). My understanding is that by any reasonable outside observer, they would be characterized as gangs.
But they were a gang. And so while we are in FQ this becomes necessary to discuss.
With 4 flags in almost no time at all. I’m closing this thread until a FQ mod can sort it all out. The thread will reopen later.
This is FQ for the record.
[Moderating]
The question does depend inherently on precisely how “gang” and “gang-related” are defined, and the definitions of both of those terms are going to be inherently political. This thread will remain closed; feel free to start a new thread either here, with a clear and explicit definition of terms in the OP, or in Great Debates, where users can debate what definitions ought to be used.