Last I’ve been informed, witnessing does not involve things like “May your false God burn in His own Hell!”
Don’t try to tell me an inarticulate curse falls below the intellectual standards for “witnessing”! It doesn’t! And I testify that God – that is, the Bible’s God, the God of Abraham, Moses, and Jesus – belongs in Hell and nowhere else!
“…the Bible’s God, the God of Abraham, Moses, and Jesus – belongs in Hell and nowhere else!”
Um…why? That particular diety created that particular cosmos. His house, His rules. Why would he belong in his own dungeon when to get there he would have to spurn himself?
You’re being stupid (apart from recognizing your tendency toward inarticulate) and I’m embarrassed for you. I think there’s another forum for that around here someplace… Where’s the scalding intellect of Susma Rio Sep when we need it?
[Moderator Hat ON]
BrainGlutton, it is generally preferred that you debate the issues raised in a thread; if you want to witness rather than debate the thread topic, I’d rather you opened another thread. Matchka, you’re treading a bit close to directly calling another poster stupid, which is not allowed in this forum.
[Moderator Hat OFF]
Brainglutton,
This isn’t really a witnessing thread and I don’t think FriarTed was witnessing anyway. He was providing an interpretaion of Hell based on scripture which is right in line with what the OP asked for. You can dispute his interpretation or the meaning of those verses but he wasn’t posting them for the purpose of witnessing. I don’t believe in Hell at all (agnostic on the Deity) but I didn’t think Friar’s post was proselytizing or inappropriate. He posted some verses in support of a theory. Even as another non-believer I thought your post was kind of gratuitous.
Sorry to all, didn’t know the “stupid” rule. Glad I toned down my previous response. (Matchka blushes, somewhat ashamed, but also flushed)
Hell is created by the thoughts of those who believe in it. It is a place people go of their own choosing. If they experience punishment there, it also, is of their own choosing. Hell has “counselors” that try to help individuals clear away the guilt and worthlessness that prompted them to go there in the first place. If the counselors are successful the individual leaves hell and continues with their spiritual life. There is nothing eternal about hell. Somewhat like the movie “What Dreams May Come.”
“The Matrix” was a computer program run by evil people, but in reality our world is constructed by collective thoughts. We are prisoners of our thought constructs untill we realize we are not our thoughts. At that point we can change our world by changing our thoughts. Miracles happen when perception changes.
This information is gained from near death experiences.
Consider it and/or work with it or discard it, whatever.
Love
Leroy
Andros asked about a link to an essay called “The River of Fire” that dogface mentioned in an above post. I found the link to that essay for those who would be interested in reading it:
http://www.orthodoxpress.org/parish/river_of_fire.htm
Outside of dreams, oxygen deprived or otherwise, can you give us a cite?
twit- so did I but a great essay like that should be linked more than once G
whew! I was blissfully unaware of BrainGlutton’s swipe & the resulting defenders! I’m loved!
If I quit work, I will not make money.
If I continue to work, I will make money.
Not making money is not a punishment, rather, it is a consequence.
Hell is a consequence, and not a punishment. It was not intended to keep people in line. Many churches, unfortunately, use hell in this way, and this is to the detrement of us all. God is not trying to teach people in Hell a lesson. If you believe in the Bible, then the words “If you believe in me, you will not perish, but have everlasting life.” sum it up. Either you believe or you don’t.
If you don’t believe in God, then you have no reason to fear hell, because you don’t believe it exists. If you do believe in God, you have no reason to fear hell, because you will not go there. I think this is rather simple.
Czarcasm, by the way, if you sin, you don’t go to hell. God forgives all sin and judges people on thier motives and intentions, not thier actions. So stealing the apple and murdering are the same in God’s eyes, because they are both sin. He can forgive both the same, if the person who wants forgiveness is sincere.
moejuck,
It’s been a long time, and I’ve forgotten a lot I admit, but I thought murder was actually the one thing that is not eligible for repentance. Ring any bells?
Also, just for the sake of argument, suppose I DO believe in God, but I just don’t dig his chili (Lucifer is a good example)…I can go to hell then, right? But it won’t suck because it is my choice to be there.
Matchka
Matchka -if you are making fun of my faith i would kindly ask you to stop. 
have a nice day
I ain’t making fun of anything–that would be completely classless! Mangetout painted a funny picture, that’s all. Humor needs to be acknowledged or people will give it up…especially in a potentially serious context.
Matchka,
I have always felt that the words “believe in me” represented more than just acknowledging the existence of God. I feel that the phrase means accepting everything that God says he represents in the Bible. Most people that believe all of that would not then have a problem with his “chili”. Lucifer obviously didn’t buy the part about God being all powerful, so he challenged it. In my opinion you have to take all of it, or leave it.
the words unfortunately translate “believe in” actually mean “trust in/rely upon/lean upon”.
Matchka- actually, murder can be repented of. Ask King David or the Apostle Paul aka the Christian-killer Saul of Tarsus. Granted- God still loaded on the heavy karma even after repentance as part of their rehab.
moejuck:
Hell is a consequence, and not a punishment.
Christ begs to differ.
Matthew 25:46
And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.
This is how I understand “believe in” also. Like - believing that a person who loves you will pull through, rather than does this person exist? - which in my early learning of theolodies, I couldn’t grasp.
The writer C.S. Lewis postulated that we are either becoming more like God (Heaven) or becoming less like God (Hell),in our every day decisions/behavior.
This has been a comfort zone for me when troubled.
I like this thread and the contributors.
I think I’ll add my signature, soon I will change it, but it seems to go with the thread!
- EEK!..forgive me…I’m trying to learn how to use “quote”!
Badchad,
I was not infering that Hell would be a pleasant experience. I was trying to say that God doesn’t use hell to scare people into obeying him. The verse doesn’t say “I will send you into everlasting punishment”.
I am assuming then that you believe that Hell is a way of keeping Christians in line? I completely disagree if this is the case. The punishment of hell is the consequence. It is not a random punishment that God will use like a slave master beating one of his slaves just to show his power to the rest. I am only pointing out that, in my opinion, Hell is a choice made by people, not God.
btw, that phrase “everlasting punishment” is interesting in that the Greek “kolasin aionian” actually means “pruning/correction aion-lasting”