Fucking terrorists

The BBQ Pit
61

No, goddamnit, this is war, total war. It’s not going to be a police action, not a law enforcement question of “apprehension of those responsible”, not something for grand juries and world opinion.

This is an act of war committed on the United States, it’s way of life, and her people. This is, like many observers have pointed out, is our Pearl Harbor. The pictures of the World Trade Center are our USS Arizona. We’re going to war, innocents will die, that’s what war is all about. If you could talk to a member of that Greatest Generation that stormed Omaha Beach or Iwo Jima, they won’t shed a tear over the victims of Dresden or Hiroshima. And I dare you to chastise them for it.

Mods, you can ban me for “spewing hatred or bigotry” or whatever you choose. I have other things to worry about now. Shout your message of tolerance in the ruins of the World Trade Center and lets see how your words carry among the ghosts of 200+ dead firemen, 35+ dead NYPD cops, and countless thousands of dead New Yorkers, tourists, friends, family, etc. Shout out your message of not killing innocents in Kabul or Khartoum or Baghdad and let’s see if you can walk out of that area alive.

Pearl Harbor changed our world view and our country, and you don’t have to be a professor of political science and international relations to figure out that Sept 11, 2001 will change us as a nation as well.

In the meantime, I stand by my words previously. Destroy these people and those who support them. Destroy their nations and cities. Burn them down, their families, friends and all they hold dear. I hate these people, I want them to die before they can harm anymore people in my country. I don’t care, anymore, if it makes us look “bad”, I don’t give a flying rat fuck. If their civilization and way of life are dead, like the Nazis and Imperial Japan, then my children can grow up and pursue their hopes and dreams.

For that, I care not one bit, shed not one tear for the ruins that I expect Kabul, Baghdad, Khartoum, and the East Bank of Palestine to become. No more than my grandfather cared about Tokyo, Dresden, Berlin, or Nagasaki.

Ban me, or chastise me for being a narrow-minded hatemonger, like I said previously, I will wear it with pride.

62

I’m fairly certain that there’s a federal law against it.

But laws can be re-written or repealed.

Fenris

63

That does not make it right. Not even close.

Exactly what will causing another tragedy accomplish? Or are you saying that the death of an innocent brown-skinned person is less of a tragedy than the death of an innocent white-skinned person? This attack was caused by the exact same thinking, “I hate America and I don’t care who dies as a result.” I have no interest in becoming a terrorist to satisfy your (or anyone else’s) blood lust.

64

Bluepony is Asian American, Dr. Lao, so your comment is really off-base. It’s not about race; it’s about demanding revenge for an attack on America.

Afghanistan IS the enemy; they have harbored and supported Bin Laden and are as guilty as he is. Nobody wants civilians to die, but that didn’t stop us in war before. Should we not have bombed Germany and Japan because innocents would surely die? How many more would have died if we had not fought? Would you have us do nothing to keep this from happening again?

65

Regardless, I resent the implication that it is OK for kill innocent people as long as they speak a different language, or have different colored skin.

I don’t know what we should do, but I am certain that targeting innocent civilians just because they happen to live in Afganistan is wrong and unproductive. It will not stop the terrorists from killing Americans, it will in fact inspire them to further their attacks. History has shown that stragtegic bombing of civilian targets does nothing to weaken the resolve of the enemy. It strengthens it.

66

Nobody wants to kill innocent people, but you would have us, what? Give up? Surrender? Should we not hold the government of Afghanistan responsible for what happened? There will be more attacks on America if we do nothing because the terrorists will know they can hurt and kill Americans with impunity.

67

In many ways this is much worse than Pearl Harbor, which was primarily a military strike. But we knew the power - the nation - that was responsible for it. This is more complicated. No one is saying here that the perpetrators of this terrorist strike shouldn’t be punished. But the natural helpless outrage we feel can easily lead to racist generalizations. It’s understandable, but it’s counter-productive (to say the least) in the long run. Innocent, loyal Asian Americans faced terrible discrimination and were even interred in “relocation” camps in the US after Pearl Harbor. Many of them lost their homes and livelihoods. All Arab people - all Muslim people - are not to blame for this tragedy any more than all Christians were to blame for Waco. So feel your anger, express if you have to, then work to focus it where it belongs. Otherwise, you’re no different from those who committed this crime.

68

Would people PLEASE stop putting words in my mouth? At no time, in any thread, have I said “All Arabs” or “All Muslims.” The government of Afghanistan has harbored and supported Bin Laden, and I say that a state of war exists between the US and Afghanistan. Either the Taliban hands Bin Laden over to us, or they face an all-out attack.

69

I don’t know what we should do, but apparently neither do you. Bombing Kabul, Bagdad, or Tehran will not stop these terrorists. The results of any of those attacks will be a fulfillment of some sort of need for revenge and more attacks on US soil. I can absolutely guarentee that.

I don’t think we should do something simply because we can’t think of anything better to do. Let’s gather intelligence and wait to see where that leads us. Perhaps it will point us to a way of capturing or eliminating the terrorists. It is much too early to start making political decisions.

70

For the record, I was not just responding to your remarks in this thread. - Jill

71

That’s never stopped them before!

But let’s not start this, okay? We’re only going to destroy ourselves.

72

Umm, only Kabul is in Afghanistan. Bagdad is in Iraq (they didn’t do it) and Tehran is in Iran (they’re trying to be our friends now). I said Afghanistan, that’s one country. And yes, we should demand they hand over bin Laden or suffer the consequences.

73

Racism accusations are a little off base here…

If you hate the man who raped your wife, are you racist because he’s white? Several people in your building are raped by men from the building across the street, and the residents there cheered them on, will you let them get away with it if they are the same race as you?

Most Americans and Britons are of anglo-saxon blood, linking us with the Germans…English is based on German…yet we bombed the living hell out of Germany and made no apologies…well killed thousands upon thousands of German soldiers and civilians…we destroyed their civilization, then split up the peices and doled them out to victors…And, yes, we hated them…you have to hate the people you are fighting…You can’t very well say “Normally, we would be friends, but I’m going to shoot you in the head now…”

Unfortunately, we are at war now with not a single country, but an entire culture…the Fundementalist Arabic culture is at war with the Democratic Western culture as embodied by the US, and has been for sometime…While race may be a factor (its easier to objectify someone who looks different than you), it is not THE factor…THE factor is that members of this culture, supported by a majority of the rest of the culture, tacitly or overtly, killed thousands of our people…

This is not about white versus brown…

74

I know that, of course, but all of those countries are definitely on the scape goat list and they could harbor Bin Laden in the future if Afganistan refuses to.

75

No, but if you want to punish all innocent white-skinned people because the person that raped your wife is white, then you are indeed racist.

76

Where, in anywhere I posted, did the subject of race come up? As Gobear said, my skin color and the slant of my eyes have nothing to do with how I approach this. Call off the old white, liberal, guilt please, among many of us Asians, this is becoming tiresome. My wife is 4th-generation Irish, I sometimes, lovingly, remind her of that. Promise, we won’t hold it against you! :rolleyes:

BIG NEWS FLASH: My Asian culture and heritage is a history of vendetta, violence, internecine, and genocidal warfare. This is Asia in all its brutal honesty and glory for the past few thousand years. In my native country this is how an attack upon the community is settled, not with consensus opinions, newsgroups, or bulletin boards, but with mind-shaking, vengeful violence. Peace exists because of a promise of continued violence and vendetta. Period. Nothing noble or enlightened about it. End of Story.

In most cultures, non-European/non-American, what you would term “people of color” this is the reality. The continued attacks on America are the result, IMHO, of the fact that we will always play fair and by the rules and the rest of the world does not have to. Interesting to note, during the Vietnam War, the areas of pacification and relatively sparse VC and NVA activity were in the areas patrolled by the South Koreans and Thais. I don’t think this was accomplished with leaflets and teddy bears.

Asia understands weakness and non-action. I am an American by adoption, but my heart and soul beats with an innate Asian awareness and mind-set. My face is Asian, and my attitudes and impulses come from the East. America is my hearth and home and I love it dearly and with a passion some of you native-born Americans may not understand because it is your birthright and what you take for granted. I had no such advantages.

I served and retired honorably and proudly from the US military. There, but for the grace of God and a few twists of fate, I could’ve been an enemy of America. I speak out of survival of a way of life and a country I hold dear, I don’t have any lofty principles or abstract conceptions here. In most of Asia, you can’t afford these luxuries.

Those are fellow Asians, for the most part, who are doing this to our country. This is irrelevant. If they had purple skins and horns, the results are still the same. That they are Asian means little to me either. Kill them, show no mercy, destroy their havens, sanctuaries, their ability to produce war, and, most importantly, their will to wage future war. Then, continue to make sure it will never happen again. Anything short of this shows weakness. In many parts of Asia, the meek do not inherit the earth. They just die.

Sun Tzu observed that the most successful battle is one where the shots are never fired (loosly paraphrased, my apologies to the Master). Instill fear and let it remain until their world-views change. This is Asia in its raw beauty and terror. The ways of the sword still hold true, no matter how Westernized we become. What did you think it was, all peaceful gardens and paper lanterns?

If you scorn my observations and are repulsed by my statements of blood and revenge, restoration of honor and face, so be it. I am not apologetic to anyone of my cultural views, deal with it.

As I mentioned previously, but for a few twists and turns in my ancestral history, I could’ve been your enemy.

77

Having traveled some in southeast Asia and knowing some Chinese and Japanese people, I guess I’m surprised at how you describe “Asia” as one culture.

78

I’m a mutt. My native country is the Philippines. The intermingling of bloodlines is usually due to war, pillage, and conquest in this neck of the woods. . My ancestry on my mother’s side is Philippine-Japanese-Spanish, my father’s is Chinese-Malay. My childhood is a mish-mosh of many ideas and viewpoints. Fair enough?

Shall we digress from the topic of “terrorism” to “Asian studies”? I’d really rather not.

79

The first important point to think about here is this: The American President is the single most open, ‘available’ leader in the world. If we start paying for the assassination of world leaders, even if they are terrorist leaders, then we can expect the same to happen in return. And our President cannot be protected from that kind of threat, unless he stops making public appearances, etc. Yes, the secret service is very good at what they do. But they cannot stop everything.

Secondly, assassination is against the overall laws of most civilized countries. Do we really want to drop to their level, and condone murder by secret attack, just to get rid of someone like this? I agree, from a personal perspective, it is REALLY TEMPTING…but from a political point of view it is not something we can condone, much less encourage or actively participate in.

Just my 2 cents.

And yes, this is only my third post. :slight_smile: Hi everyone.

-Stil

80

Disclaimer:
I don’t really feel this is the answer but since I’m wallowing in a fit of rage as many others are at the moment,
it’s gonna be good to vent the following impulsive “solution” to the terrorist problem.
Here goes.
palestine does not and never will exist. Anyone who professes to be palestinian should be interred and imprisoned for the rest of their lives.
They also should be rendered sterile so as not to continue the bloodline. After a few years, the true Final Solution.
Rather humane. No one is actually killed.
They just become extinct.
A very sad footnote in history, but peace prevails.
That felt good.