Game of Thrones 2.07 "A Man Without Honor" 5/13/12 No Book Spoilers

Episode 1: The North Remembers
Episode 2: The Night Lands
Episode 3: What is Dead May Never Die
Episode 4: “Garden of Bones”
Episode 5: The Ghosts of Harrenhall
Episode 6: The Old Gods and the New

This is the thread for people who want to discuss the show without outside information that may spoil the story from either the books or other sources. Discussion about the current episodes and all previous episodes of the series requires no spoiler box. Which means that there should be no need for the use of any spoiler boxes in this thread.

If you are looking for discussions where spoilers are acceptable, please visit the season 2 closed spoiler and open spoiler threads.

Don’t argue about the spoiler rules in the thread, take it to the pit if necesary.

Gukamatz has been moderating these threads because he’s more familiar with the source content than the other cafe society mods. This was his note in the OP of the first thread this season:

We left off with Theon holding winterfell, but the remaining Starks escaped. Dany will be screaming “WHERE ARE MY DRAGONS!?” like it’s “WAAAAAAALLLLLLLLLTTTTT!!!” Jon may freeze to death unless he becomes more receptive to dry humping. A “we love the king!” day is celebrated in King’s Landing.

Is a large battle going to happen sooner, or later? Tyrion seems to be taking over the wildfire stockpile for some end. Where is Asha going in her thirty ships?

Who the heck is Asha?

Excuse me, Yara.

Heretic! He used a name for a character that’s only in the books - burn him!

Seriously, Asha evidently was the name of Theon’s sister, but they changed it to Yara because there’s already a character in Winterfell named Osha.

Yeah, I forgot her name and googled ‘theon’s sister’, hence the mistake. I haven’t read the ooks-bay.

If you had just called her “Theon’s finger puppet,” we would all have known exactly who you mean.

Right. That’s the character in charge of worker safety at Winterfell.

Okay, I don’t believe that Theon actually killed Bran and Rickon. We never see them die and the bodies are unidentifiable. Prior to this when someone major died it all happened before our eyes, no potential ambiguity.

My first guess as to what Catelyn would do with Brienne’s sword is cut out Jaime’s tongue. Or his balls. Or both.

No idea what’s happening with Jon Snow. He seems to me to be in a big pickle. Same with Danaerys.

Yeah, there no way they’re dead. But I wonder if Theon knows that, or if his crew brought him two burnt kids and said “here they are.”

It struck that this episode seemed to made up mostly of long conversations between two characters. I know there’s a lot of those in this show, but there were very few scenes in this episode that had more than two characters.

Nice shout out to the fandom by the Kingslayer when he described Cat as a shewolf. Wonder if he keeps his head?

In other news, Alfie Allen is finally putting the whole “Alfie” business behind him, he is a wonderful Theon. I especially liked the way he portrayed the inner conflict in Theon; there is a genuine struggle in him when he does what he does, although it does not last.

In is great to compare Jon and him; Jon has a conflict too, but he chooses to do what is expected as opposed to what feels right.

Yeah, I would guess they are those two orphan boys they’ve referenced a couple of times.

Can someone explain why exactly they sent the old dude back once they found the shells in the hay?

Presumably so he couldn’t see Theon roasting two random peasant kids.

I didn’t buy Sansa’s handmaid/Tyrion’s lover being dumb enough not to shut the door and then asking Sansa to help flip the mattress with them on opposite sides was even dumber. As much as Tyrion has pounded into her head about castle intrigues I think her first impulse should have been shutting the door behind her instead of panicking and acting even dumber than Sansa.

So it wasn’t actually related to the discarded shells then?

I’m not sure. I think Theon and his first mate took the walnut shells as proof that the peasant had helped the Starks escape, which gave them an excuse to murderize his kids to cover up the fact that they suck at manhunts.

Basically in my mind it’s: dogs have lost the track, maybe we moved too far ahead and the prisoners turned left at Albuquerque => Walnut shells. They actually were here. Well shit. => Torture the old man, he’ll tell us where they’ve gone => He knows nothing because Osha & al. snuck in his larder without his knowledge. FFFFFFFFFfffff => We need to pick up the trail but now we’re super late and the dogs are useless => Let’s not and say we did.
Maester Luwin was taken away before item n°3.

Okay, that makes sense. I wasn’t sure if there was more behind it, such as the old guy concealing something he knew.

Thanks!

When they found the shells they thought they had found the boys, so they sent the maester back so he wouldn’t be there ti either witness or moan and wail while they did whatever they were going to do. That’s my guess.

Re-watching the episode, I wonder why Jaime killed the starry-eyed Lannister squire. I understand that he needed to make the jailer come into the pen, but couldn’t he have just knocked the kid out, or even just told him “I need you to make like you’re dead” in the grand and honoured tradition of Hollywood jailbreaks ?

I gotta say though, I’m loving how they’ve been breaking the ice around Cersei these past two episodes. I like my villains humane and miserable about their being villains.