space I’ll use to discuss the thread’s spoiler policy…
I’d like to include ‘show’ only people so:
No Spoilers from later on in the story at all. Book info from earlier in the story that is not represented in the show should be in spoiler boxes with some kind of identifying comment.
Book info from earlier in the story that is represented in the show is fine without spoilers (assuming it’s relevant)
There are lots of ways Ned could have saved himself. What about Robb?
We now know what this choice led to. So let’s go back to the conversation in the tent. What are Robb’s other choices?
He’s lost the North
He’s broken his word to Walder Frey and married Jeyne (or Talisa).
True he’s never been beaten in battle.
So what was a better plan? Assuming he suspected that this might possibly happen. (not to that extent, but what if he was more suspicious that Walder Frey would betray him)
Was he painted into such a corner that there was no way out other than this risky deal with the Freys?
Should he have pulled his own red wedding and assassinated Walder Frey? That shit works for the Lannisters!
Could he have crossed the Twins and headed home?
About the only thing he could have done that might have changed Frey’s decision would have been to annul his marriage on the grounds he was already betrothed (assuming Westeros laws are like medieval Earth laws in that) and honor his agreement to marry a Frey girl, and he wasn’t going to do that.
The book version of the wedding, and of Robb’s marriage for that matter, had several major differences from the TV version, so a couple of things this season and at the wedding were as much a surprise to the readers as they were the watchers. I won’t be more specific in the thread, but if you ask I’m sure somebody will spoiler box some of the differences.
So it seems that he lost everything as soon as he broke that oath. His father would be so angry.
“See!? This is why you should always be honorable!” ulp
One thing that was emphasized in the book was that the Frey’s made a point of separating Robb from his direwolf. But Robb was pretty inseperable from his direwolf (until he got married), and was planning on entering the castle with the wolf before the Frey’s made a stink, and Robb agreed to leave it outside. Maybe if he’d had the wolf at his side, they could have fought their way out?
This is hard to answer because we don’t know exactly what the war situation is with Robb on the show. We don’t know if he could have simply slinked back to the north, he didn’t have a big enough army without the Freys and Karstarks to do much and the Boltons were ready to betray him. He certainly did not think he had any better options, running back north and abandoning the Riverlands to their fate might have saved his ass but that would be completely out of character. I can’t think of any in character solution that would’ve kept Robb alive.
Spoilers about the war situation in the books, nothing plot related having to do with the show:
In the book the iron men control moat cailin, an impassable bottle neck to the north and Robb’s plan was to take the Frey army and attack it to head back north and take back Winterfell, not Casterly Rock. If the way north is also impassable on the show then there really was nothing else he could have done besides what he did, maybe head to a strong place and hold out as long as possible and negotiate surrender terms
He shouldn’t have married anyone on the grounds that he was in the middle of the war. Use the army and stall the marriage until after the war and if he still had strong feelings for Talisa, re-neg on his oath then.
My SO and I have never read the books, but we have watched every episode of GoT.
Couple things - it is hard as hell to figure out who is who and what in the hell they are doing and where they are going and why. Still - it is kind of fun to just sit back and watch.
That said, they are killing off major characters like flies.
Is there ANYBODY left at the end of this series?
(Although I do understand the last two books haven’t even been written yet, so maybe there is no answer to that question?!).
Robb had also made detailed plans in the book to work with the Reeds to send a portion of his army through the “impassable” swamp around Moat Cailin and take it from the north, which seemed like a brilliant plan, and made it all the more shocking when the Stark army was suddenly slaughtered at the Twins. I can totally relate to all those people freaking out on Twitter. I felt the same way after reading that chapter. I felt like there was no point in continuing the story, all my hopes were crushed. But by the end of the 3rd book, things got a lot more interesting with some of the other major stuff that goes down. But the show watchers will have to wait for season 4 for that, which is going to make for a BLEAK off-season.
