Going to the movies on Christmas or other big holidays makes you an asshole.

The BBQ Pit
121

[QUOTE=VCO3]
It was closer to your “cerebral” choice, though without the self-righteousness and all of that. It was this - “This is a college town in the middle of nowhere in a rural area, where there are very few jobs to go around. Literally everyone you employ is a student, yet you have the audacity to enforce an unreasonable policy such as this because you know you can get away with it because there are no other jobs open anywhere else. Because everyone you employ is a student, and because this is in the middle of nowhere, you’re keeping them from ever (as long as they want to have a job) being able to go home to see their families. You are a fat asshole, you smug piece of garbage.”

I can’t stand this predatory, exploitative attitude in any person, but especially a smug fuck that knows he can get away with it. We need more people to extend the bounds of social censure to direct, uncomfortable confrontation - like if I had pushed the guy or gotten in his face and told him what an asshole he (knew he) was being - rather than just quite, politely complicit avoidance.
[/QUOTE]

Again justifying physically attacking another person because they believe/represent/??? something that differs from your life view. 'Cuz we all know that a restaurant managers is THE MAN, and THE MAN should not get away with this! :rolleyes:

As even sven has shown us, not all employees are reliable. After all this ridicule I’ve poured on ya, could you possibly take a second to think about WHY that policy was there? Or do you really believe that it was a random power-trip that this guy pulled to make himself feel better (assuming that he is the one, in fact, that created the policy and is not just implementing it because the owner told him to)? I worked in restaurants while in college - I know what goes on. Students are FLAKES. This policy might just keep the flakier ones away. Secondly, you ever schedule the running of a restaurant? I have. It sucks. You get a little basket of torn pieces of paper with all the dates that people are requesting off, and you have to somehow juggle all of this and make sure that everyone still works enough hours to support themselves. You have to balance those that want time off with those that want to work. Sure, you could have that one employee that was willing to work 3 hours one week and 60 hours the next, but they are rare. Most people want a normal schedule so they can plan their lives around it. So let’s say a normal week (not Christmas!) requires 30 people - 10 cooks, 10 bus-boys, 10 wait-staff to fill in all shifts (no, it is never that exact). Let’s say most people want to work 5 days a week for 8 hours (your standard 40 hour week). Now let’s say just one individual wants to take a 4 day weekend to visit mom. Those additional 2 days of vacation represents 2 extra 8 hour shifts that need to be filled by someone doing the same job. So 9 people now have to juggle their lives to fill an extra 2 shifts (because the other 2 would be a normal period of no work and thus considered beforhand). Not that bad - I’m sure someone wants the extra time and will work 7 days/shifts that week. Plus, hey, maybe we can hire a part-time person. But the moment that 2 people want similar 4 day periods off you really start running into scheduling problems - you now have to fill a total of 8 shifts of work between the remaining 8 people, 4 of which you weren’t really planning on. And because you are ALL students, as you say, I’m betting that outside of the restaurant your lives are all pretty similar, so the chances that people ask for the same days off are high. And I’ve only gone into one section of the restaurant needing to juggle the schedule around your long weekend. What if the cooks were down 2 (long weekend and sickness) and the busboys were down 3? Now the manager is facing the real possibility of not having anyone available for a shift on Friday night! So what are the choices? Have a bunch of people on the books that will only work during the vacation days of others (yeah, right)? OR MAYBE YOU IMPLEMENT A POLICY THAT TREATS EVERYONE EQUALLY, FAIRLY AND HONESTLY THAT SOLVES THE PROBLEM? What do you think Mr. Smug manager will do when a great cook that is always on time and doesn’t screw the orders up asks for 5 days off? You think Mr. Smug is going to just let this person go and face the risk of hiring someone new that might not be that great? Or will they say “Hey, you’re great! I understand you need to visit mom this week. But I still have to follow policy…however, I’m sure if you re-apply wink wink you have a good chance of getting hired again. See you next Thursday!” That policy exists to get rid of the poor performers, the complainers, the ones that will show up late and try to leave early, take multipe days off while complaining they don’t get enough shifts to pay rent, and lastly the ones that physically threaten others when they disagree instead of politely avoiding them. Otherwise put, that policy exists to easily get rid of people like you and even sven.

You are an idiot and a bully if you justify physically attacking others that disagree with you as a rational response.

-Tcat

122

[QUOTE=Martini Enfield]
I can see the OP’s point, and the comments from a lot of the posters in this thread have caused me to raise my eyebrows quite extensively.

It must be a cultural thing, because in this part of the world it’s generally accepted that everyone should have Christmas Day off (excepting essential services, of course). Even if you’re not Christian, it’s still seen as The One Day A Year Which Everyone Can Stay Home From Work.

Most (all?) retail establishments are closed for the day here, and everyone who is working will generally get either massive penalty rates and/or a paid day off in lieu (depending how good your Union/State Award is).

Often, places like Movie Theatres will start with the Matinee Session rather than the 9am one, too.

I do, however, agree with the idea that there are certain days of the year in which it is not really necessary to be purchasing designer clothing/appliances/DVDs/motor vehicles, going to the supermarket, or getting your film developed.

On the other hand, actually trying to reach a consensus on which days those should be will probably be the catalyst for the events leading up to The Postman and A Canticle For Leibowitz…
[/QUOTE]

Well, things here are pretty much as you describe them: On Christmas day, all retail establishments close except for a few gas stations, movie theaters, and restaurants (many run by non-Christians)… and those usually open in the afternoon, around 1:00pm. To purchase the items you listed, you would have to go to the Internet

… which means that you are making work for people who work to support the Internet.

However, the point really is that merely for society to function, hundreds of thousands of people in the US have to work on Christmas Day, therefore the OP is completely sub-moronic.

123

[QUOTE=JohnT]
Well, things here are pretty much as you describe them: On Christmas day, all retail establishments close except for a few gas stations, movie theaters, and restaurants (many run by non-Christians)… and those usually open in the afternoon, around 1:00pm. To purchase the items you listed, you would have to go to the Internet

… which means that you are making work for people who work to support the Internet.
[/quote]

One would assume the people manning the Internet also have good enough unions or paycheques not to care. There’s a world of difference between being Supreme Overlord Of The Central Internet Server and being a minion of Pizza The Hut or the local MegaPlex.

More importantly, I wouldn’t be buying any of that stuff on the internet anyway, Public Holiday or otherwise. :wink:

I’m not quite sure how the very functioning of Western society would be devastated by the local cinema being closed for the entire day, though.

124

“I’m not quite sure how the very functioning of Western society would be devastated by the local cinema being closed for the entire day, though.”

It’s not. Nor is having it open on Christmas day a “blow against workers”.

125

I work with an elderly gentleman who is the last surviving member of his family. On Christmas Day, he goes to a movie, finds an open resturant, goes to whatever stores are open and generally tries to keep himself busy on what would otherwise be a very sad and lonely day for him. (I have invited him to share the holiday with my husband and I but he declines because, despite my objections, he feels it would be an “intrusion.”)

My family has a policy of always celebrating Christmas on December 18th. That’s when we gather for a meal, exchange gifts and visit with one another. The holidays are a busy time with many competing obligations: in-laws, parties and yes, work. So, we schedule our gathering earlier in the month so that everybody can be reasonably certain of being able to attend. It doesn’t make the day any less special that it’s not on that Certain Date.

My husband often has to work on Christmas and many of the major holidays. He works at a prison, and the upper-management takes turns among themselves working specific holidays. Mind you, he’s on salary, so we don’t even get the time-and-a-half.* Somebody’s* got to be there to make the decisions.

I’ve had to work Christmas a few times in my life. Once was when I worked at a power plant as security. (Criminals don’t always take Christmas off themselves.) Another time was when I worked in one of those Big Box stores which sold merchandise and groceries. I didn’t mind and I got a lot of fervent “thank yous” from people who panicked because they didn’t have a gift for Cousin Mike who showed up unexpectedly or they had forgotten to purchase whipped cream to top the pie.

126

[QUOTE=Martini Enfield]
I’m not quite sure how the very functioning of Western society would be devastated by the local cinema being closed for the entire day, though.
[/QUOTE]

That would be hyperbole, right? Well, the very functioning of Western society wouldn’t be devastated by the local cinema being open for the entire day either.

It wouldn’t be for the entire day anyway. There are no morning movies, at least not in Chicago. Christmas morning is the traditional time when most people who celebrate Christmas open presents and ooh and aaah at each other.

127

Meh. Have Christmas on your next day off. Wha’s the big deal?

-FrL-

128

[QUOTE=VCO3]
Because everyone you employ is a student, and because this is in the middle of nowhere, you’re keeping them from ever (as long as they want to have a job) being able to go home to see their families. You are a fat asshole, you smug piece of garbage."

[/QUOTE]

From EVER being able to see their families? What, did he say he kept them chained in the stockroom on their days off?

129

[QUOTE=Martini Enfield]
I can see the OP’s point, and the comments from a lot of the posters in this thread have caused me to raise my eyebrows quite extensively.

It must be a cultural thing, because in this part of the world it’s generally accepted that everyone should have Christmas Day off (excepting essential services, of course). Even if you’re not Christian, it’s still seen as The One Day A Year Which Everyone Can Stay Home From Work.

Most (all?) retail establishments are closed for the day here, and everyone who is working will generally get either massive penalty rates and/or a paid day off in lieu (depending how good your Union/State Award is).

Often, places like Movie Theatres will start with the Matinee Session rather than the 9am one, too.
[/QUOTE]

In what way is this different from where anyone else lives? The OP was ripping people for going to movies in the afternoon. Apparently, everyone in your neck of the woods CAN’T stay home from work, if they work in an “Essential service.” Or at a movie theatre in the afternoon.

130

[QUOTE=Seven]
As I was reading the rest of the thread this came to mind - and then I saw your post. It really is true.

In a relationship with two people, you’ve two different sides of the family. Not all of these people are going pile into a house on one day. My brother and his wife split the days - her side is Christmas Eve, his side is Christmas day.

[/QUOTE]
Heck, it’s even more than two people’s side of the family. Now that my sister and I are grown up and in committed relationships, jockeying to position one “family day” for the holidays is crazy! There’s me and my immediate family, my fiancee and her immediate family, my sister’s girlfriend’s immediate family, my finacee’s sister’s family… We are all family, and everyone expects to see us at some point, so there’s a lot of visiting happening all over the place between Dec. 24 and Jan. 1.

Even if the entire world was on holiday on Dec. 25, I wouldn’t possibly be able to see my whole family gathered in one place that day. We’d have hold it in a banquet hall if we tried to. (Oh, can’t do that, banquet hall staff on holidays…)

We don’t squabble about December 25, that would be silly. “Oh, noes! My mom doesn’t get us Christmas Day because her mom wants us for ‘family day’? There’s gonna be a fight a’brewin’!” Rubbish!

We take advantage of the holiday season to work our schedules together. As non-Christians (or non-practising Christians) the actual date doesn’t matter. I don’t care about working the 25th. It makes no difference to my family day at all. I’m defintely going to have a big holiday meal and gift exchange, regardless of the actual date.

131

I spent Christmas and New Years in Baghdad, so time and a half at the multiplex doesn’t sound so damn bad.

132

At my workplace, holiday pay is different than what most of you are describing.

It’s a factory, and it’s 24/7/365. So most people end up working during any given holiday.

If you do not work on the holiday, you get 8 hours of straight holiday pay.

If you do work the holiday, you get 8 hours of time and a half holiday pay.

So, if you work 40 hours but not the day of the holiday, you get paid 48 hours straight time.

If you work 40 hours including the day of the holiday, you get paid 40 hours straight time plus 8 hours time and a half.

In other words, the “holiday pay” is money that comes in above and beyond the actual worked time. Just being an employee when the holiday occurs means you get holiday pay.

133

jsgoddess

Maybe I’m missing something, but something doesn’t make sense to me-

  1. Say you don’t work the holiday and you make $10 an hour
    You work 40 hours and make $480.00

  2. Do work the holiday-
    You work 48 hours and you make $520.00

So If you do work, you work 8 more hours than the person that doesn’t work and you only make $40 dollars more?

Who in their right mind would do that? Unless they don’t have a choice. But it’s not a very big incentive to get people to work the holiday.

134

How about going to church? Don’t pastors, priests and reverends have the right to spend time with their families? So does going to church on Christmas make you an asshole?

If no one committed crimes on Christmas cops wouldn’t have to work, true. I guess only assholes get sick or hurt on Christmas. Only assholes have to pump gas on Christmas Day so they can get to work to save lives, arrest people, defend freedom, or sell beer. People who need diapers or Tylenol are also assholes according to the OP.

Sgt Schwartz

135

[QUOTE=Caridwen]
jsgoddess

Maybe I’m missing something, but something doesn’t make sense to me-

  1. Say you don’t work the holiday and you make $10 an hour
    You work 40 hours and make $480.00

  2. Do work the holiday-
    You work 48 hours and you make $520.00

So If you do work, you work 8 more hours than the person that doesn’t work and you only make $40 dollars more?

Who in their right mind would do that? Unless they don’t have a choice. But it’s not a very big incentive to get people to work the holiday.
[/QUOTE]

Close. If you don’t work the holiday, you work 40 hours and get 8 hours holiday straight time.

If you do work the holiday, you work 40 hours and get 8 hours holiday time and a half.

Everyone still works only 40 hours.

So person A works 40 hours and gets $480.

Person B works 40 hours and gets $520.

(Our wages are higher than that, but the math is easy at 10!)

Most of the employees will end up working, since on any given day most of the employees are scheduled to work.

(Because we have glass furnaces, we can’t shut down for holidays.)

136

Warninig: hijack ahead.

jsgoddess: Do you mind me asking what is it the company makes? I hear “glass furnaces” and I’m intrigued.

137

I think it’s kind of funny how people will say “If you don’t like working holidays, quit the job”, but then when somebody says “I didn’t like working holidays so I quit the job” they are suddenly lazy and ureliable.

FWIW, when I’d do this, I’d give a full thirty days notice and dicuss my decision with the managment and it was all very amiable and agreeable. They couldn’t give me holiday’s off because of corporate policy, but they couldn’t do without me. Usually I’d get rehired with a pay raise. Capitalism in action- it works both ways. All of them will and have given me stellar references. I’m a hard worker, but my family is worth more than nine dollars and hour. There will and have been other jobs, but some of my family members didn’t survive past those Christmases.

Part of the reason why jobs give people holidays off to be with their family and not just random days is that the whole “family gathering” thing doesn’t work if everyone kind of has random days off. If nobody is working, then everyone can be together. And maybe this isn’t a big deal when most your family lives close by, but many people have family members that can only make it anywhere near home once every year or two, and having synchronized holidays gives them a chance to see the entire family during this short time. Perhaps not a perfect system, but it’s the one that Western society has been using ever since they decided the sabbath was a sacred day to not work and to be with your family.

I am all for voluntary holiday work. And I am all for essential holiday work. And I have nothing against people that patronize workplaces on holidays- I think the whole “you are causing someone to miss their chance to be with their family thing” is something that doesn’t even cross through most people’s mind and certainly isn’t something they can control.

But I feel like giving people the choice to be with their families on holidays without losing their livlihood when it is possible is just- I don’t know- one of those things people should just do out of respect for each other. I guess I’m an idealist or hopelessly naive, but I don’t see why simple respect and regard for each other’s lives and humanity isn’t something that can’t cross the boss-worker divide. We have a saying here- Nous sommes ensemble- we are all together. Friends say it to friends. Strangers say it strangers. Workers say it to customers. Bosses say it to workers. We ARE all together, and I think we ought to act like it.

and um Tomcat before you start calling people names, why don’t you tell me what you did for Christmas this year, and then I will tell you what I did.

138

Boy, when I was a teenager, I used to LOVE working holidays - that way I could avoid everybody at home. Our fast-food joint was closed on Christmas, so my sister and I would hop in the car and drive around to see if anyone was open (this was before the Internet). ANY excuse to get out for a while.

We just had our annual family holiday get-together yesterday. Fortunately I like them all a lot better now. :smiley:

139

[QUOTE=Seven]
Warninig: hijack ahead.

jsgoddess: Do you mind me asking what is it the company makes? I hear “glass furnaces” and I’m intrigued.
[/QUOTE]

We make fiberglass. Nonwoven mats for use in composites and construction materials.

140

[QUOTE=RickJay]
In what way is this different from where anyone else lives? The OP was ripping people for going to movies in the afternoon. Apparently, everyone in your neck of the woods CAN’T stay home from work, if they work in an “Essential service.” Or at a movie theatre in the afternoon.
[/QUOTE]

It’s against the law here to force people to work on public holidays, or to fire or otherwise penalise anyone who exercises their right not to work public holidays.

There are plenty of people who do want to work Christmas, of course- for whatever reason.

At a previous job, the boss announced that the shop would be open Christmas Day, and no-one was getting penalty rates because, basically, he didn’t feel like paying them because none of us apparently worked hard enough anyway.

That plan lasted about 15 minutes before literally half the staff- myself included- told the boss that we were going to resign on the spot unless he retracted his comments and closed the store on Christmas Day. It was a most excellent and well deserved Day Off, I can assure you.

All the staff involved left (again, including myself) within a month or two of that incident, unsurprisingly…