I don’t believe in alien UFOs, but whenever a group of us has a debate, someone always quips, “Well, I don’t believe our government could keep a secret like that… look at Iran-Contra, Lewinsky, etc.”
Then I thought about it: **Area 51 and Roswell are certainly not secrets! ** Everyone and their dog knows Area 51 holds UFOs that crashed in Roswell. While not everyone believes it and the proof may be lacking, I would not call those secrets by any stretch.
Except for the fact that we know intimate details about Lewinsky, almost to the point of her ability to swallow. By comparison, the “UFO” details we have out of Roswell happen to match the claims made by the government: That it was a baloon, made of sticks, tape and rubber.
Compare this to the fantastic tales of fancy spacecraft and miracle technology told by “Area 51” authors and you begin to see that you have a government that is amazingly able to hide details about a large UFO crashing, while at the same time is unable to cover up simple things. Its a classic conspiracy story: amazing skill at times, combined with unbelievable bumbling ont he other. Note that everyone is not going to be consistant in their work, but this is like having a truck driver who weaves his truck through a traffic jam on one day, then flips his truck on an empty road the next.
Yes, if I understand what you’re saying, UFO’s don’t exist because no govt could keep the secret that long, is a flawed argument. Plenty of people, supposedly in the know, have come forward to tell their story. They simply aren’t believed and no mainstream media will investigate seriously because of the perpetual climate of ridicule. Maybe for very good reasons given the frauds around, like Lazar.
I’d love the Disclosure Project to get its wish and have the alleged witnesses released from oaths and fear of prosecution so they can put up or shut up. If they’re fantasists then lets give them enough rope.
If not, if there is something of substance behind the various phenomena, or if govts have been deliberately fostering a mass delusion just to hide their shiny toys, then citizens of democracies have the right to know the truth, IMHO.
The government can keep secrets.
It is not 100% effective at keeping secrets but it can keep some secrets.
Now you may think a “UFO Secret” could not be in the subgroup of kept secrets, but, it very well could be.
We know about Monica because she talked to someone else who talked.
The President kept his damn mouth shut about it. Then another part of the government and the mainstream press did everything in their power to drag the secret into the light of day.
I don’t see that happening with UFOs.
Can you tell me more about what the Disclosure Project is, and what witnesses are bound by oaths not to talk about it? 'Cause I’ve read some pretty detailed accounts about the whole balloon program from the people who worked on it.
Governments can keep information from the general public if there is sufficient reason to do so. The computer used for the Enigma Bombe was built in my home town and it was many years after the end of WWII before anyone new about it.
Speaking strictly about Roswell, that was a well kept Gov’t secret. It was originally passed off as a weather balloon when in fact it was a photo recon balloon used to spy on the Soviet Union.
What is not kept secret are the observations made by military personnel regarding UFO’s. These are observations made in regard to airborne objects that were not identified. How that information is interpreted has lead to speculation that they are not man-made.
True.
here is one example that I don’t believe was public knowledge:
I read an interesting book recently about the history of submarines up until fairly current times (can’t remember the name). It was compiled from now declassified info and personal interviews.
One fun detail was that we had tapped a Soviet communications cable that was on the floor of the Barents Sea in Soviet waters. We continued to tap it during the 60’s, 70’s and early 80’s. It describes how one of the first duties of an incoming President was to get briefed on the operation and give approval for continuation.
Regardless of how good the U.S. government is at keeping secrets, I think we can all agree that some governments are not as good at it – or not as committed to doing so. Some governments, in fact, are downright ineffectual. If alien space travelers have been visiting the Earth – and if sometimes they crash – then they might crash anywhere, mightn’t they? If it were really happening, the secret would get out as soon as a ship crashed in a country where the government was not both quick and effective in covering it up.
The argument is fundamentally flawed because there’s no way to know if the government can keep secrets. We can only observe the secrets that have NOT been kept. So for all we know they keep 99.9999% of all secrets secret.
Really? I thought Project Mogul consisted of floating balloons to high altitude and using them to detect radiation and/or shockwaves from Soviet nuclear tests.
I’ve always liked the “foil-like pieces [of metal] easily crumpled by hand which completely recovered their original shape and showed no signs of wrinkling when released” observations of Area 51 debris when it was probably aluminum foil, which may have seemed really keen and futuristicky in 1947, but ten years later would be commonly used to wrap sandwiches.
They claim to have testimony from hundreds of people who have worked in area that bought them into contact with UFO’s, including a couple of astronauts. Gordon Cooper claims to have seen a UFO on two occasions, once landing at an air base and he further claims there was a film of the incident.
As most of the Disclosure people are military or otherwise bound by draconian secrecy laws they want to be released from such laws and testify in the open before an investigative committee and won’t do so while facing prosecution.
I’ve no idea what the truth is, beyond the fact that something is going on beyond simplistic explanations of the planet Venus variety. I say, let these people testify. If they’re fantasists let’s expose them.
“Blind Mans Bluff” by Sherry Sontag and Christopher Drew?
Interesting book, service on a submarine must have been one of the hairiest jobs during the Cold War.
Sounds more like aluminized Mylar to me; it´s good to know that I use alien technology on my model planes, it tickles my geek side.
[sub]Besides, everyone knows that Area 51 is just a façade for the real secret, UFO laden base: Area 52[/sub]
Yes, thank you, that’s the book.
If that doesn’t do: better argument.
WHy would the government cover it up. It’s not like it’s their problem. They’d already have to have hundreds if not thousands of people in the know.
If the government has captured UFOs where’s our FTL drives? Where’s our quantum computers? Why hasn’t the military been corrupted absolutely by having weapons that use technology that’s probably a hundred years or more ahead of anyone else?
They came in peace.
Doesn’t matter. A drive system which can propel a ship FTL should be readily adaptable to powering a kinetic energy weapon which would have a destructive capability greater than any nuke. (Imagine a 1 oz rock slamming into the Kremlin at the speed of light. I doubt that there’d be much left of the commies.)
Exactly.
Although he continued to hound-dog around, which ensured that it would eventually become public.