Gun Law Question-Pennsylvania

My father and I had a disagreement a while back about whether you were allowed to carry a concealed weapon in Philadelphia or Pittsburgh. He seems to be under the impression that those cities are to Pennsylvania what New York City is to New York or Detroit is to Michigan, where concealed carry is generally banned (permits do exist but are not issued to the public at large).

I contend that there is no such distinction (you can carry concealed with a permit in either place), and after looking around I have found nothing concrete to substantiate it either way. I did find the licensing authorities for both Pittsburgh and Philadelphia which lends creedence to my stance, but then again it could be that you have to apply separately to those cities to legally carry there. I just don’t know.

If I have to I will go down to the local State Police barracks, but if I can get a hookup here it would be preferable, and much less awkward than going into the cop shop to ask them a question that, as a license holder, I should already know the answer to. I’m pretty certain I’m right, but if I’m wrong I’d rather not be a criminal in the future.

Thanks.

One other thing, while I’m asking: does anybody know offhand or can anybody find the rules, regulations and requirements for carrying a collpsible baton or impact weapon here in Pennsylvania? Again, I came up empty. I’m sure it’s out there, I’m just not looking in the right place.

Afraid that an Asp might fall into this categorie:

“Any bomb, grenade, machine gun, sawed-off shotgun with a barrel less than 18 inches, firearm specially made or specially adapted for concealment or silent discharge, any blackjack, sandbag, metal knuckles, dagger, knife, razor or cutting instrument, the blade of which is exposed in an automatic way by switch, push-button, spring mechanism, or otherwise, or other implement for the infliction of serious bodily injury which serves no common lawful purpose.”

http://www.packing.org/state/pennsylvania/

http://members.aol.com/StatutesP7/18PA908.html

Statewide carry seems legal:

“(a) General rule.–No county, municipality or township may in any manner regulate the lawful ownership, possession, transfer or transportation of firearms, ammunition or ammunition components when carried or transported for purposes not prohibited by the laws of this Commonwealth.”

http://www.packing.org/state/pennsylvania/

http://members.aol.com/StatutesP7/18PA6120.html

Pennsylvania is a “shall issue” state. Which means that upon application, the offices charged with issuing concealed carry permits must do so unless there is compelling reason for refusal. Several suggestions are made in the law as a basis of refusal:

[ol]
[li] being of a character and reputation that the applicant is likely to act in a manner dangerous to public safety; [/li][li] currently charged with or convicted of certain crimes;[/li][li] being a habitual drunkard or abuser of controlled substances; [/li][li] being of unsound mind or having been involuntarily committed to a mental institution; or [/li][li] having been dishonorably discharged from the Armed Forces[/li][/ol]
Further, as Unregistered Bull has noted, Pennsylvania has enacted what’s known as a “pre-emption” law. This means that jurisdictions smaller than the state itself cannot, as a general case, enact regulations more restrictive than the state’s own regulations.


http://www.nraila.org/GunLaws/StateLaws.aspx?ST=PA

and

Yeah, and Detroit is not exempt (As far as I know) from the CC laws here. We are a “shall issue” state as well. You will be required to surrender your firearm upon entering a sports arena, casino, theatre,or church…which pretty much eliminates the reason most people come to Detroit proper in the first place :slight_smile:

My father in law lives across the street from the Chief of Police (or whatever the term is, there in rural PA). My father in law, when asked, stated that getting a CCW shouldn’t be that difficult.

Now all I need is a decent handgun. Hehehe…

PA, the other end of the country from CA.

I live in Pennsylvania and have a concealed carry permit. Pittsburgh and Philly are not treated differently.

According to Packing.Org it doesn’t look like Philly & Pitt. have any special laws regarding CCW.

Open carry is another thing. It appears that you have to have a permit to OC in Philly.

Some states with pre-emption laws are having a hard time getting local governments to obey it. Colorado, Nevada, & Nebraska have municipalities that are thumbing their noses at the state pre-emption statutes.

Yeah, Ohio, my home state, has a weird kinda pre-emption law, too. It only pre-empts regulations which would seek to impose additional limits on the state’s concealed carry law. All other gun regulations are fair game for more restrictive local ordinances.

Well… this is pure anecdote, not supported by cite or any such thing, but…
When I was living in da Burgh, I had a CC permit and was allowed to carry within city limits. I was warned several times over by various people not to carry in Philly. IIRC, I was told that TPTB in Philly made the city something special under the laws.
Now, I fully admit that I was told all of this by a collection of “some guys”. Perhaps these “some guys” are the same folks that told DadDoors whatever it is they told him. If (for some reason) I wanted to CC in Philly, I would double check the laws before I went. (In addition to a few other minor things, like getting my permit working again - moved away several years ago - and that sort fo fun stuff.)

Thanks, guys. I figured it was something like that.

For a while Philly had a more restricitive statute, but it failed under court challenge. Note that Mr. Street and our Governor are attempting to restore the option of Philly to legislate a more restrictive level or control within the City of Brotherly Something. Personally, I support a statewide carry regulation, not abridged by those in Philly, Pitt, or other major metro areas.

Title 18 of the Pennsylvania Consolidated Statutes (aka the Crimes Code of Pennsylvania)Section 6101 (Subchapter A)-the Uniform Firearms Act:

§6106. Firearms not to be carried without a license. If you have a CCP, no problemo. §6108. Carrying firearms on public streets or public property in Philadelphia. No person shall carry a firearm, rifle, or shotgun at any time upon the public streets or upon any public property in a city of the first class unless: (1) such person is licensed to carry a firearm;

From there you’re into §6109. Licenses. (a) Purpose of license. A license to carry a firearm shall be for the purpose of carrying a firearm concealed on or about one’s person or in a vehicle throughout the Commonwealth.

To me, that says I’m clean from Erie to Essington. :smiley:

I believe that the law in Pennsylvania is that you cannot carry without a permit in a “city of the first class,” which is defined based on population and Philadelphia is the only city that qualifies. So without a permit, you cannot openly carry in Philadelphia, while it is generally permitted elsewhere in PA.

Since Pennsylvania has state preemption of firearms laws and is a “shall-issue” state, Philadelphia cannot place any stricter requirements for issuance of a License to Carry Firearms.

And I think that this was already mentioned, but the same things about preemption in a shall-issue state apply to Michigan.

Tristan, from what I hear, in rural PA you can usually walk into the sheriff’s office, show them your ID and give them the $19 fee, they run the background check then and you walk out with your permit. I like that system a whole lot more than what I had to go through here in Texas.

My first CCP was issued in Bucks County, and involved little more than a background check, but wasn’t a ‘walk in-walk out’ procedure. Complete the form, pay the fee, and my permit was mailed to me. Several CCPs later, I’m in a different county and they have my information on file, advise me that my permit is up for renewal, asking if I’d like to renew it. Once the postcard is returned several months in advance of my current permit expiration, they perform all background checks and notify me of approval/rejection. Then I appear at the courthouse to pay the fee, get a picture and issuance of a laminated CCP.

Still, much easier than Texas. 8 hour class with range qualification and written test ($75-100), fingerprints, passport photos, notarized statements; send all that to DPS in Austin with another $140. They then do state and FBI background checks, and can take up to 60 days by law to issue or deny the permit. If the application is incomplete or fingerprints are smeared the clock starts over.

Plus another class and $70 application fee every 4-5 years for renewal.

I’m not challenging your specific cite, but I want to add that some of the information on that site (ref: Kansas) is woefully out of date, so one may want to use caution when reading it, as their disclaimer says.

CCW in Kansas does not take effect until July 1st, in fact, people can’t even apply for a permit until then. So, as of now, There is no CCW in Kansas, unless you’re a P.I. with the proper license. Sounds up to date to me.

Here in Cumberland County you have to apply in person at the courthouse, fill out the paperwork, get your picture taken, and fork over $25 in cash. They send you a letter telling you that your permit is available for pickup for the next 2 weeks- after that they throw it away and you have to do it all over again.

The whole process takes a minimum of 2 weeks plus a day up to a month. It’s certainly not immediate, and I’m in a very rural county.

Awwww! Boo Hoo.

That’s a political comment. No offense or Flame intended, A.D.U.

Here in Wussconsin theres no CCW permits what-so-ever for civilians. It passed twice but the Governor doesn’t trust his fellow Cheeseheads and vetoed it. I guess it’s easy to say others don’t need firearms for protection when one is surrounded by armed Capitol Police officers 24/7.

If I wasn’t a peace officer I’d have to move away from here.

Do you think there is a chance of it passing and having the veto overridden this year? I know it was close in 2005.

At least you can take comfort in that Wisconsin will not be the last state to pass a concealed carry statute. There is no chance Illinois will pass one before WI.