I met a new friend recently. Our children are comparable ages and really enjoy playing together. My friend has mentioned doing sleepovers at some point in the future.
My dilemma is, her husband is a hunter who has something like 10 guns in a glass-fronted cabinet in their family room (plus a stuffed bear that he shot and had mounted). I glanced at the cabinet this evening and didn’t see a keyhole for a lock.
Are gun display cabinets locked differently than, say, a file cabinet?
I really, really like her and I think they’re good parents, but NO effen way am I sending my kids over to play without MY supervision until I know for damn sure that those guns are secured.
Hmm, I’ve several snarky answers, but I’ll save those for some other time.
I would have no problem with someone politely and in a non confrontational way asking “Is that gun cabinet locked?”
If they come back with a smart ass response, like so many obnoxious gun owners do, then you can be fairly comfortable in not letting your kid in the house.
If you get the “They’re perfectly safe”, “I don’t let the kids in there”, “My kid knows not to touch”, “The ammo is in another drawer”, etc., you don’t let your kid go over, because nothing you say will change them.
Good responses include “Of course”, “The cabinet doesn’t lock but the guns all have trigger locks”, then you’re probably ok. IMHO
Then I guess you would really freak if you came over to our place. :rolleyes:
We have three young children. While all of our guns are unloaded, none are locked up, and none have trigger locks. The guns are everywhere… some are in our bedroom, some are in the living room, and some are in the basement.
We often have friends and family over w/ young children. And they usually bring more guns. (I have a shooting range in the side yard, and friends and family often come over to shoot.)
Last Saturday we had militia training. Weapons were everywhere. And so were children. (I counted seven under 10 yeard old.) As usual, there were absolutely no problems.
But then again, we are quite immersed in the gun culture, as are all of our friends. So my advice may not necessarily be applicable to your situation.
I would just be honest, and say something like, “I’m uncomfortable with my kids being around firearms. Can you tell me how yours are secured, or what precautions y’all take?”
I, too, don’t want my kids in any house with guns, mostly because I don’t trust my kids at their ages. I’ve had this conversation with my brother-in-law, who agreed to lock his guns in the garage while my kids were there. A sleepover would make me especially nervous.
My gun cabinet is steel and has two locks. I have the cabinet for the express purpose of keeping others away from my guns. Then again, I have about 25 or so.
I do keep one out in the open, above the door, loaded. It’s there for varmint hunting. My son knows it’s there and also knows he can use it if we’re there. He’s as good of a shot as I, and he’s 9. He’s been using guns since he was five. A month ago he shot his first 9mm pistol from 25 yards. Hit 1" from center on target. We often target practice in the backyard and when we go to camp, we always bring the bb guns and have can races.
It all depends on how you’re raised and where you live. If someone in the city had as many guns, I’d think them daft. Is someone in the sticks was horrified of guns, I’d look at them askance. It’s all how you’re raised and what your opinions are.
I’m not quite sure I understand the objects here. Does it really matter if the glass case is locked or not? It is horrible irresponsible, with or without children, to store or display guns like that and keep them loaded. I imagine they keep the ammunition well secured.
As an anecdote of my own, my father kept guns in the house as we were growing up. He taught each of us the basic safety rules for handling and firing guns at a young age (I first handled a .22 caliber handgun at the age of 6-7). At a later age, I even knew where the guns and ammunition were stored, but never thought twice about touching them, because I’d been taught at a young age to respect them.
Now, obviously, it’s not appropriate to just thrust children into a situation with which they’re not familiar. So, it’s perfectly okay to ask about how they secure the weapons. The vast majority of gun owners are responsible citizens and I’d imagine you get that vibe since you’re friends; thus, I’m sure they’ll be more than happy to talk about it. However, even if the weapons are well secured (say, the glass case is locked, and the ammunition is secured elsewhere, like in a gun safe), it still may not be appropriate to have child there that haven’t learned basic gun safety rules and how to respect them.
Why roll your eyes? You have guns strewn around the house at semi-random intervals and you don’t think a parent has any business being concerned about their children playing around them? Sure, you say you keep them unloaded. And we all know that it’s impossible for a stray round to be forgotten in a gun (I hope you at least lock up the bullets). Accidents with firearms never happen.
You could preface it with “My kids don’t have any experience being around guns and might be curious.” Then, “Is that cabinet locked?” doesn’t come across as anything other than non-accusatory. You’re darn tootin’ though that you’ve got every right to know beforehand.
All joking aside, I doubt even Crafter_Man wants a kid that’s never been around guns wandering his house unsupervised.
I, personally, would much rather know that a visiting child comes from a gun-free house and isn’t really to be trusted around them.
No offense intended, just that kids who grow up with them are far less likely, in my opinion, to screw around with them unauthorized. Most know that all they have to do is ask, and that there are serious penalties for not obeying the rules.
Yeah, I didn’t think I was criticizing them for owning guns or anything, totally none of my business. I just know how kids are, and how easy it is for them to be overcome by curiosity and forget the rules. Mine are almost 4 yrs old and are bright enough to do all kinds of cool things on our computer - but they still do absolutely stupid random shit from time to time.
I am nowhere near confident that they can be trusted to follow rules in a potentially dangerous situation.
I do keep guns loaded and unsecured in my house. I do not, however, allow unsupervised children in my house. In fact, I could not think of a situation in which a child would be unsupervised in my house or have access to my guns.
Well I guess the question is are you comfortable with your kids being around guns period? If it doesn’t bother you, tell the parents that your kids live in a non-gun owning household and you’re worried about their curiosity. As a gun owner I’d have no problem having the kids over prior to the sleepover and showing them the guns, about safety and removing that curiosity. It is something that needs addressed, but once addressed intelligently it can become a non-issue like it is for others posting in this thread. Four might be a bit young however, not personally knowing your kid.
I don’t think my kids had Cooper’s rules memorized at 4, they were still at the “don’t touch” stage and when they were allowed to hold one, it generally was way too heavy, so they weren’t interested for long.
6, on the other hand, is far more mature and often ready to start shooting. Certainly old enough to start learning safety.
That’s a really good approach. As you and others have stated, I agree it’s essential to get the issue out in the open. I just wanted to be careful and polite in doing so.
What he said. Except I can imagine a 10 year old breaking in. Where does my responsibility end?
My solution was to teach my kids about all the different dangers. At 4-6 I knew more about the people they were going to stay with and I knew about their guns or lack of knowledge long before any ‘sleep over’ came up. Just ask. Reasonable people will understand. If they don’t, you don’t want your kids there anyway.
Unless these folks are some sort of seething militia members there’s no harm in simple discussion, so being open and frank is as much politesse as would be needed. It’s that kind of clear headedness that is so often the difference between safety and danger.
Asking if they can be put up for the night isn’t impolite either if you’re still a bit shakey about it.
I don’t see why it should be a problem if you make it clear that the guns need to be locked up because it is your children who can’t be trusted. If it sounds like you are saying his family isn’t to be trusted or that you don’t like how he handles things in his own house, I don’t think you’ll have to worry for long about their friendship.
We have guns in our home. I would not be offended if I were asked about the security of their storage, as long as it was done in a polite, non-hysterical way. If you asked, I’d tell you that all the guns are kept at all times in a locked safe, and all ammunition is kept at all times in a separate locked cabinet.
My brother and his wife are frankly freaked out by guns and don’t understand why my husband has them. They also know how careful we are to store them properly away from young, uneducated hands. They have allowed their young children to spend the night at our home, and the subject never even came up.
It’s probably locked. Even if it isn’t, they are definitely not loaded. What are the chances of your child pulling out a rifle or a shotgun and, while being under supervision, playing with the unloaded weapon for a while and decide that he/she NEEDS AMMUNITION!
Then, while needing ammunition, the drawer to such is most likely found to be locked. If it is not locked, what are the chances that your child will know whether or not he/she is looking for rifle cartridges or shotgun shells? And if by dumb luck, he/she stumbles across the correct one, and the correct caliber/gauge, he will know which lever, knob, or slide opens the magazine of the gun to load the ammuntion?
And if he/she manages to successfully load the weapon (one in a million chance) how will he/she know how to disengage the safety, point the weapon in an unsafe direction, and pull the trigger (the distance from arm to arm is almost impossible for a child under 12).
Now. (Whew) Since I grew up in a rural household, I have a better understanding and respect for guns. You seem to have an irrational fear of them.
Don’t get me wrong. I worry about the unknown as well. I would worry about my kids in an unknown situation. But in your case, you might as well worry about a meteor falling from the sky and killing your kids, or even more realistic, you should question anyone with a backyard swimming pool FAR more closely that you would a gun owner.
But, I will bet that you don’t inspect their gates/locks there, huh?