Hanging would be too good for these fuckers.

Squish-

There are fucked up things that teenagers do that may conceiveably injure themselves but that are not premeditated to cause harm. Supposing that they had decided to spay paint some graffiti on an overpass. There are countless ways in which one could injure themselves or others here without any intent to cause harm.

This isn’t an admission that her children are engaging in serious mischief.

I only hope with regards to the last quote that she misread the quote. In any case this happened in Canada so there is no death penalty. In any case I’m not sure that even here in the U.S. this kind of thing would rise to the level of Capital Murder.

All I’m saying is lets give Kambuckta a chance to clarify her statements before we start accusing her and her progeny of something that they didn’t do.

I once pushed my brother off of a 5 foot high slide in my back yard, when I was 8 and he was 5ish. He broke his arm, just barely, and was in a sling for 2 weeks. That is the closest I have ever come to killing anyone.

I have never done anything even remotely close to this sickening crime, or anything like it.

If this is true, and by your own admission it is, AND it was only by the grace of god (again, your own admission) that you didn’t seriously injure someone, then by not preventing your children from doing the same, not only are you a bad parent, but you are a bad person.

In this case, there obviously was intent to cause harm.

Too bad it did happen in Canada. Hanging is too good for them (oh, wait, maybe hanging them off a bridge…)

Regarding the OP, I agree. These fucks had to have known what they were doing would cause either serious bodily harm or death. I hope that they are caught and they get long sentences.

No folks, I NEVER threw rocks from overpasses, nor do I in any way condone the actions of the teenagers* who did.
*(In my reference to them as teenagers, I was following the lead of the OP who assumed as much. I have NO IDEA of the ages of the perpetrators.)
I never engaged in any activities that I believed could have endangered a life.

No do my children throw rocks, and they have never been involved in any other serious activities (to my knowledge anyway!)

So I would appreciate it if you could refrain from casting aspersions about my parenting abilities and their characters.

My opinion (and it’s ONLY an opinion, and one that I believe I am entitled to hold) remains the same however.

Invoking the death penalty for something that MAY have been the result of STUPIDITY is wrong. And adolescents are notoriously stupid and not known for always considering the consequences of their actions. Certainly they SHOULD think before they act, but as any parent of a teenager knows, they do not necessarily think things out as an adult would.

I am NOT saying that the culprits in this case should NOT be punished. They should, and severely too.
I am saying that the death penalty may not be warranted here…
While I understand that my stance may not meet with your approval, I do NOT understand your lynch-mob mentality, not your need to denigrate me as an individual for holding an opinion that you do not share.

Oh, and the ‘mischief’ I was referring to in my youth was general skylarking…there was no intent to cause any harm to any person at any time but that is NOT to say that some of my actions could NOT have harmed someone. Firecracker use (now banned here) is a good example of something that COULD go horribly wrong but luckily for most kids, does NOT.

(Please note, I am not in any way comparing the use of firecrackers with rock-throwing, just the way in which children and teenagers especially may not consider the consequences of their sometimes negligent behaviour.)

kambuctka, would it also be considered stupidity to push your friend in front of an oncoming train? To play chicken with an old lady on a crosswalk? To gang up on a fellow classmate with 15 of your friends and beat her until she has internal injuries?

How much responsibility are you willing to absolve someone of due to their age? Hell, 200 years ago a 15-year old was considered mature enough to run a household and raise her own children… would you have called that the blind leading the blind?

Stop making excuses for them because of their age. They knew they were going to hurt someone, period. THEY WANTED TO HURT SOMEONE. That’s what they did. Do they deserve to die? Perhaps not. (ONLY perhaps. That’s only because I consider myself a better person than that sort of SCUM.) They won’t get the death penalty - the country that Feynn, and I, live in does not have it. Do they deserve to go to jail for 20+ years? Hell yes. I’d prefer if they didn’t come out at the other end, to be quite honest. I’d also like to see them given 20 lashes… but I guess that’s a big no-no in today’s humane society.

:slight_smile:

**kambuckta[/a], sorry, but your arguments are irrelevant. These teens did something that is so completely beyond the pale, so utterly sociopathic, so lacking in normal human empathy for the fellow man, that comparing it to the kinds of pranks normal teens to is akin to comparing the firebombing of Dresden to a schoolyard scrap: A difference not only of several orders of magnitude, but of several qualitative leaps. It is qualitatively different from anything you have done.

It also demonstrates a complete inability to live in a normal society. If these teens would consider for an instant that dropping a thirteen-pound rock onto oncoming traffic would be fun, they were not demonstrating momentary stupidity. They were demonstrating severe, profound dysfunction of a type that medical people call ‘sociopathy’: A lack of empathy and, therefore, morality. If they were stupid enough to not connect heaving the rock at people with people being hurt, they would have been too stupid to dress themselves or live outside a hospital. So, obviously, the connection was made. They simply didn’t care. Killing them would be a mercy, both for them (saving them from a lifetime measured in prison terms and parole stretches) and for us (preventing who knows how many more homicides).

I don’t see the problem with it. I have a hunch a round of interviews with random prison inmates would reveal a veritable flood of stupidity. There is surely some stupidity involved when someone says “Hey, I know! I’ll go steal a car/rob a bank/sell drugs to an undercover cop/drive drunk/kill someone for looking at me funny. The police will never catch me!” It’s not a defense to crime.

Well, I have a confession to make. When I was a kid - somewhere around the first grade, I guess - some older kid told me that if you placed a pile of rocks underneath a train rail you could cause the train to derail. The older kid casually mentioned that he’d seen it happen. I had to cross railroad tracks on my way home, so naturally I wanted to test the claim and made my pile of rocks.

Nothing happened, of course, and I only tell this to illustrate the enormous disconnect between a child’s mind and reality. The consequences of actually derailing a train never entered my mind. My only experience with derailed trains was from my toys and that wasn’t a big deal. Wouldn’t a real train be just like my toy train except on a larger scale?

For both kids and adults, the greater the distance between the act and its consequences, the less real it becomes. That’s why dropping bombs from 30,000 feet somehow seems less horrible than blowing somebody’s brains out with a shotgun at point blank range. The distance between the bridge and the car may not seem like much to you, but to these kids it may have seemed like 30,000 feet.

I’m not suggesting that these kids go unpunished or that their actions be brushed off, but I do have a problem with the kind of blood lust I’m seeing on this thread. I’m seeing a lot of assumptions being made on this thread about the motives, evilness and stupidity of the perpetrators. Those of you who are proposing such extreme punishments are, in my opinion, demonstrating the same qualities that you are railing against. The big difference is that you should be old enough to know better.

Kambuckta said

The crime happened in Canada. Canada does not have the death penalty. Furthermore, even here in the U.S., this would not be a capital murder trial. In most states, Capital Murder is reserved for a specific set of crimes. I see that you are a foreigner, and are probably not familiar with the death penalty. Here in the states, the death penalty is only applied by statute, and under a limited set of circumstances. Regular murder doesn’t rise to the level required.

VA Capital Murder Statute

The behavior described in the OP, while incredibly despicable doesn’t rise to Capital Murder. If VA couldn’t charge them with Capital Murder, then chances are that it won’t happen.

I remember putting nickels on train tracks as a kid thinking they would do the same thing. The thing is, as a child, the concept of derailing a train never considered the fact people might get hurt. Trains to me back then carried coal and lincoln logs and stuff, not people. But again, that’s the thoughts of a child…one who hasn’t even considered the concept of death because they’ve never been faced with it.

Anyone able to lift a 30 lb rock over a fence and hurl it over a bridge wall isn’t the age of a first grader, and I’m guessing has a better grasp of the idea of “consequences” than your average seven year old throwing mushrooms at cars passing by the bus stop (my own evil actions of the past come to haunt me).

The act of dropping ANYTHING off of a bridge into traffic is done for one specific reason: To cause an accident. It doesn’t matter if it’s a heavy rock that ends up collapsing a man’s skull, or a water balloon designed simply to startle yet leave no damage…the result is the same: The shock of whatever hitting one’s car will cause them to panic, swirve, and quite possibly, wreck. Whether they turn into oncoming traffic, hit the railing, or just spin out is unforseen, but the fact of the matter stand, when you drop something off a bridge into oncoming traffic, shit’s going to hit the fan. That was the desired result of this action. Whether someone died or not, most likely these people didn’t care enough to think about it, and therein lies the real crime. This disrespect for human life.

Kids being kids is one thing when it’s limited to simple destruction of property. Keying cars, toilet papering houses, putting dog shit in mailboxes…all mindless fun. But when it starts to affect human life, that’s where it becomes a real issue, and that’s the issue here. Whoever did this knew that someone was going to get hurt. How bad the injury would be, they didn’t care. They should be punished and made to understand what thier actions have cost this man and his family and made to care.

The death penalty is a sticky situation. I agree with long, long, LONG term of imprisonment. The only time’s I feel the death penalty is warrented is when the “assailant” shows no remorse for what they’ve done and gives the impression that similar crimes will come about from their freedom. In this case, though, we don’t know who did it or why. Perhaps they were all drunk or stoned and upon hearing about what happened have been huddled together terrified with guilt and fear of being caught. I’d like to think that. I’d like to think that eventually they’d come forward to the authorities and the victim’s family, show their remorse and accept what comes to them. Unfortunately, people these days don’t seem that caring anymore, and most likely, they’ve forced themselves to forget about it and are working on moving on with their lives. At which point, I hope the authorities find them, expose them in the most humiliating way (pull them from work or school or whatever), and subject them to whatever the harshest punishment the law allows.

Dare I ask if anyone participating in this thread truly believes in giving the death penalty to Teenagers Who Throw Heavy Objects Off Bridges At Passing Vehicles (whew!), or are we merely talking about folks who are venting steam out of anger and frustration?

Obviously I have not been participating but yes, I do believe they should be put to death. The actions of this person or persons caused a death. Why should they be allowed to live?

I know I started a post on the death penalty back when the Andrea Yates trial was a hip-happinin’ story. I don’t know how to post links, but search my name back a few months and you’ll find it in IMHO or General Questions, and you’ll find a slew of reasons why people don’t think this action should result in the death penalty. No reason for a hijack.

Sorry, the board keeps telling me the server’s down, so I repost. Forgive me.

brujo, I happen to be aware of the Canadian legal system as it is almost the same as the one where I live (Australia). I was not talking about the official invocation of the death penalty, rather the way many of the posters in this thread were baying for blood.

And bnorton, I share your sentiments wholeheartedly. I think if the posters who claim to have led totally angelic lives were to be honest with themselves, they would possibly realise that they too had done stupid things that could POSSIBLY have caused some harm to someone else.

Derleth, as my second last post said, I WAS NOT COMPARING schoolyard pranks with the actions of the person/people who killed Mr. Stanley. Rather, I tried to show how sometimes a ‘prank’ can turn into a devastating tragedy and, especially in the case of kids, without ‘malice aforethought’.

No hijack here. I’m just answering the question posed by rjung. Also let me say that I do not practice any form of religion. Having said that, I do believe in eye for an eye. Why should the family and friends of the bus driver suffer while the person or persons who committed this crime go free? I’m not saying scott free. I mean what’s the big deal in going to jail for a few years and then getting out and being able to live your life? In that sense you really haven’t lost much except for a little time. Meanwhile, the family and friends of the victim still suffer…

Not to pick on you, but I really don’t understand the inability of people to post links. There are two really simple options:

1: copy and paste the url of the link into your post, and check the “automatically parse URLs” box (which is the default anyway, I think)

2: use the “http://” vB Code button above the reply box and follow the simple prompts.

IMHO anyone who can’t figure these things out is just being lazy.

Kambuckta, thanks for the clarification of your earlier remarks. But

I’m being totally honest. To clarify my own position, I was raised by old-fashioned and strict parents.

The only two things I’ve done–both as an adult–that could have endangered someone else were:

  1. Drove home drunk. Scared the shit out of myself, so badly that I’ve never done it since.
  2. Put a lit cigarette out on the neck of the speed-crazed hulk who was trying to strangle me. Since he was at least 6" taller and 75 pounds heavier than me, I did what I thought was necessary to get his hands off my throat. For the record, the altercation started when he pushed me to the ground during a concert and I got up and yelled at him for it.

I’ve never been arrested, never become addicted to drugs or alcohol, never been in any physical fight other than the one mentioned above, never had an STD, never stole from or cheated anyone. I do have a big mouth and I can be meaner than catshit upon occasion.

An angelic life? No, not at all. A life where I don’t engage in activities that might injure someone else? Yes.