I wasn’t sure wher to post this. I figured if I posted in the pit, it would be become to civil and get moved here, if I post here it will prbably become uncivil and go to the pit. ah well, let’s see what happens.
This isn’t a rant. More a question for other dopers, and questions fro certain people. Maybe it’s just because I live in SF, but I seem to notice a large level of sexism and hostility towards women on this board. And frankly, it pisses me off. Not only that, but many people who should no better, and who would frankly call someone into the pit for a FREAKING GRAMMER ERROR let it slide. It doesn’t make me angry, just sad and a little disapointed. I’m tired right now, my connection is slow, and for some reason I can’t find any of the threads I’ve been thinking of, maybe some others can help me out. But, here are some of the most recent quotes I’ve found.
“Whores, the lot of them, all whores”
“There’s only one bitch in the world, man… one bitch with a million faces. Dump her like last weeks bongwater.”
"Alternatively, you could detach yourself emotionally and milk the relationship for all the sex it’s worth. "
And there are other instinces in other threads? Am I too sensitive because of my Left Coast upbringing? Is that it? Or do you people need a readjustment?
It’s probably more of a reflection of the shift in power of social interaction. The increased awareness of female sexuality lead to a series of developments which has seen women become more predatory sexually. This has, IMHO, been a good thing, however many men struggle to adapt to this new way of life (which is still transitory btw).
Left feeling confused/unsure/angry/impotent at the increased female control of relationships many of these men express their ignorance/insecurities in the primal manner: slag 'em. After all it can’t be their fault can it? They’re manly men. It must be women’s fault.
Normally I’d agree with you, but not with that quote as evidence. You’re taking this one so far out of context that you can’t even SEE context from where you are. Jay, in the Kevin Smith movies, is used as somewhat of a comic relief–and in NO way is it even implied that he does anything other than talk out of his ass. For the real way that Kevin Smith felt, quote Silent Bob’s speech on that issue. But using Jay as a source on everyone else’s attitude toward women is kinda silly, considering Jay is SUPPOSED to be a misogynistic pig, and the audience is SUPPOSED to see how wrong he is.
That’s what I get for thinking Kevin Smith’s a talentless hack (oh please lord above, do not let this debate turn towards kevin smith). Let me post the rest of what MadPoet wrote. I was trying to avoid specific names, as i saw this as a more general problem rather than a problem with a few specific posters.
“You got one of two things going on here. Either she’s a slut, and she wants to feel like you don’t care if she cheats, or she’s mental and wants you to get mad so she feels loved. If you feel seriously about her, dump her, she’ll just rip your heart out. If she’s just a fling, well - less to be worried about. Better the devil you know, and all…”
OK. I think from the resrt of the quote that his intial line was not meant in jest. As I’m unfamiliar with Mr. Smith as a director, I was unaware of the history behind the quote. I’m williing to be MadPoet meant it for what it is too.
I think dpr has a good finger on it. With women demanding that they can be sexual creatures, men are feeling a bit off the mark. The rules aren’t there anymore. It is no longer universal that men have to treat women a certain way. With individual treatment comes confusion, and resentment, anger, whatever. For every guy that has followed the old ‘be good’ rules there are ‘liberated’ women who have shoved them down his throat. That smarts, understandably. Of course there are women who need to do similar exploration of the rules, i.e. learn that liberation does not make treating people badly okay.
I’m pretty sure humanity will work it out eventually, by people like you, oldscratch, picking up on it and calling them on it.
In my efforts to remain concise and avoid gross generalisation I may have left out (I just implied) an important point that Medea’s Child has just picked up on. The ‘rules’ and gameplaying.
We’ve always had rules of social behaviour and interaction and for quite awhile there we had it easy. However the aforementioned liberation of women and their sexuality ahs changed the rules but alas not completely or obviously. There are still women who want to be wooed, just as there are women who want to be the sexual predators that the male gender has been typecast as for so long. Sadly there’s no easy way for a typical malke to tell the difference between these types. How do you act upon meeting a girl? One action will in all likelihood provoke two contrasting reactions from each of the above types. Confusion reigns supreme.
And medea also touches on other subject: that of the responsibility of the ‘liberated woman.’ This could devolve into a hijack but this new-look female sexual predator quite often is quite insensitive to other’s feelings, has no sense of responsibility and is all too responsive only to her own ego. Liberation? The fight for equality seemingly only gave these women the right to act as badly as the men.
I have noticed a bit of this also; more often with trolls and sock puppets as Monster104 mentioned. I did and do object to the word slut. It carries a much more vicious conotation than any male equivalent word, including the ones posters in that thread brought up. Here is the link to that thread.
As to the female sexual predator phenomenon, I had not heard much of this and I don’t condone hurtful behavior for either sex. But I still think women get more flak than men over these issues, and it may partially date back to long ago when women were still chattel; the property of men.
Until the thread which contains the statements oldscratch quotes came along, I had noticed some resentment towards men and some resentment towards women. The seemed to be roughly equal, with resentment towards men slightly more predominant. However, I never really paid close attention.
I agree that many statements made in that thread seemed very unsympathetic towards women in general.
Most of the quotes can be found in Crispix’ “Is my girlfriend a tramp?” thread. One day I will learn to make those attachments, or whatever you call them.
I think many of the men in question are young, and as such, easily frustrated and lacking the experience to deal with it. Hopefully they will out grow of the “every thing I touch is mine forever” attitude and realize that the behaviour of young women is remarkabley like that of young men, occasionally boorish. Most of them, male and female alike, will gain experience and adjust. Some will go on to be assholes.
I think what you see on this board is not a representative sample of adults.
Yep, oldscratch, I’ve noticed it too. Found myself physically shaking with anger while reading the “Is My Girlfriend a Tramp?” thread – the first time I’ve ever felt this way in over a year and a half of reading the boards. I cannot BELIEVE how many guys I had thought of as intelligent and fair-minded have rushed to pass judgment on a complete stranger.
Needless to say I am having second thoughts about posting certain personal revelations in that thread, but it’s too late to do anything about that now.
Actually, sex has much less to do with anything than classic feminists have long claimed. Most guys LIKE women to be “sexual creatures;” note the fellatio thread.
It is not these “men” who have changed but society. Hostile men were hostile toward women before “women’s lib” and nothing has changed their attitudes since. What has changed is the acceptablity of their attitudes. Where brutality toward women was frowned upon when I was young it is now felonious. Where even today bullies like these guys can talk like that in bars they are considered abberations here, a place somewhat more enlightened (usually) than the bars I’ve hung out at.
oldscratch, it’s “GRAMMAR,” not “GRAMMER.” We can discuss this further in the Pit.
