Have you ever meet a racist/bigot in real life?

In My Humble Opinion
21

The head of the Roger Williams University College Republicans regularly writes articles for their newsletter in which he claims that Islam is an inherantly evil, violent faith. He also was personally insulting to the one muslim who wrote a response to one of his articles, a doctor from Bristol. The college republican head’s choicest quote from his response to that letter was “Did Allah tell you to say that?” He was also instrumental in bringing Ann Coulter to lecture at our school - for those who don’t know of her, she’s a fairly prominent ultraconservative who suggested after 9/11 that all muslims should be forcibly converted to Christianity. He choice quote at her lecture, which got a standing ovation from the College Republicans, was “We don’t need gun control, we need Muslim control.”

So yes, I have met bigots in real life, and the most remarkable ones have been in my school’s College Republican club.

(Please note: from my conversations with friends at other schools, RWU’s college republicans are NOT typical, the ones at other schools are almost always much much much more moderate. So I know this isn’t the fault of the organization, it’s just the people at my school, and I don’t think all - or even most - college republicans at other schools are like this.)

The thing that scares me about the RWU college republicans, especially their leader, is that they aren’t the “stereotypical” bigots at all. They’re very intelligent, articulate, oftentimes charismatic people. They aren’t ignorant hicks - their ignorance is well-cultured, with a thick veneer of sophistication, and they can make themselves sound almost reasonable, unless you really think about what they say.

Some of them are even people I’d be pleased to call my friends, if it weren’t for the fact that they’re so darned scary. One of them, for example, is a bright, friendly fellow who is absolutely convinced that different ethnic groups are NOT equal - he hastens to add that they’re not “worse” or “better”, just “different” - but the implication is that some ARE worse or better. He claims that this is why Europeans colonized so much of the world, rather than some other group. Needless to say, he’s never read “Guns, Germs and Steel” - that book would pretty much blow his argument out of the water.

I don’t have any copies on hand, but it anyone wants to see what I’m talking about, I’d be willing to scan the College Republican newsletter and post it when it comes out in september. Scary stuff.

22

When I lived in Denmark almost 15 years ago, just about everyone was prejudiced against Middle Eastern immigrants. I saw girls say nasty things to a completely inoffensive young mother, and the mother of my host family would often express hostility to them.

One time I was very surprised when talking on the phone with a woman I liked and respected. She was telling me about a well-known black conservative writer, and said she had heard him speak once. She said, “and you know, he spoke very well and sounded well-educated.” It took me until after the conversation ended to figure out what she meant, and I’m still angry at myself for not being able to pick up on it soon enough to call her on it. I feel like I must have sounded like I agreed with her, when really I was wondering what she meant by putting in such an apparently meaningless comment.

23

Okay, this had me floored, and is -totally- on the mark. That is -exactly- how I would have described young mister Hale.
BTB- when I first met him, he was trying to get school funding for a campus white-supremacy group. :wally

24

My guitar teacher is a born-again Christian, and has a lot of the views that come with the worst sides of fundamentalism–homophobia, bigotry against other religions, etc. He is an amazing guitarist and seems like a good person in most other respects, so I continue attending his lessons. When I first started, he occasionally tried to witness to me, which infuriated me so much I almost stopped just then, but I didn’t want to go to the trouble of finding another guitarist, so I made my position clear. He has stopped since then and I enjoy my lessons. It makes me feel guilty that I don’t protest his occasional bigoted statements, but I don’t think he is a bad man, really, just ignorant in regard to people who are different. I certainly wouldn’t call him ignorant or stupid–he knows just about everything there is to know about guitars, and not just playing and repairing them; he knows theory inside and out. But he hasn’t had much of a formal education and I suspect he was brought up in a very white, non-diverse environment.

Many older people in my family are casually bigoted, but none are virulently so–I’ve never heard anyone use a term like wetback or spic or anything along those lines. I actually feel proud of my family; my grandparents and aunts and uncles have all been raised very conservatively, very Catholic, but when my cousin came out to the family there was no hate or disapproval at all directed towards him. I’ve heard all the horror stories and it could have been so much worse; I don’t know how I could possibly have conversed pleasantly with my grandparents or relatives if they had disowned him or something.

25

I work in a supply yard where the payload operator is pretty much an “equal opportunity” bigot - which simply means he hates just about everyone of a different race, nationality, sexuality or religion. or sex equally.

He’s a diligent & hard-working employee, an ex-con & a member of the Hell’s Angels.

Ironically, he works & gets along fine working side-by-side with everyone here (Black, Mexican, Irish & Italian) but wears his bigotry on his sleeve (and on his prison tattoos). He’ll call anyone any racial slur he feels like right to their face and has no problem taking it as well as he dishes it out.

This may sound bizzare, but the fact he’s so open and honest about his prejudices makes it more palatable (or easier) to accept him. There’s not an ounce of phoniness or sensitivity in his demeanor.

As far as his intelligence level: Mechanically, the man’s a genius. Street smarts, he’s as sharp as a tack. Sense of Humor, likewise.

The last time I can recall challenging him on one of his racist statements was his opinion on a black police officer being killed in the line of duty. Upon reading the story during lunch, he matter-of-factly blurted out:

“Good riddance, & two birds with one stone. The perp took out a cop and a nigger with one bullet.”

I reminded him to keep his shit to himself and pointed out we had alot of co-workers who were black and that my father’s a cop.

Since 9/11, I myself admit to holding a bias, or prejudice (or whatever you wanna call it) against arabs and muslims. I ofter wonder if I was more vocal and open about it perhaps it would be easier to overcome

26

My college roommate’s family was like this. I was over at his house one time and overheard his aunt (IIRC) complaining about “all the colored shows on TV now.”

Also, a few years ago, I was visiting Vancouver B.C. (I live in Seattle) and my car broke down. I rode in the cab with the tow truck driver, a youngish (late 20s, maybe) guy with a frosted mullet. On the way out of the garage, he had to stop suddenly when a car driven by a Chinese woman pulled unexpectedly in front of him.

“Man, can you believe these people around here?” he said.

I thought that was troubling, but not definitive, so I gave him the benefit of the doubt, and steered away from specificity to a general characterization: “Well, we have bad drivers everywhere.”

“Yeah, that’s right,” he said, remembering that I had mentioned where I was from. “Down there in Seattle, you’ve got the Chinese and the blacks.”

It was a very quiet ride after that.

27

You haven’t lived until your mother makes a racist remark about not having married your father if she had known he had native american blood in him. Right in front of us (her children, with that same blood) and a Nigerian visitor.

I once knew a black Vietnam vet, a very intelligent guy otherwise, who dated white women exclusively and had parties at his house that were almost all white, but could spew forth for hours about how white people were the source of all evil in the world.

28

My grandparents are anti-Semitic. I hadn’t realised that until recently because they never really said anything, but the past year or so they’ve been starting to make some comments that just made my jaw drop. It’s probably just as well I wasn’t present for an incident a few months ago that my mother told me about, when they actually denied that the Holocaust ever happened, because as much as I love my grandparents, I’m not sure what I would’ve said.

29

Oh yeah, I forgot all about mentioning anti-Semitism…which is pretty mild, I guess. Both my parents seem to find “New York Jewish women” to be loud and annoying. They use this phrase like an epithet. This is one my mother isn’t ashamed of saying.

Come to think of it, it doesn’t have anything to do with their religion. It’s a prejudice against what I guess I will describe as a “subculture,” for lack of a better word. I know he likes Jewish men and “non-annoying” Jewish women. :confused:

It’s kind of amusing when the bigots start feuding over religion, though. Mom and Dad are rabid atheists; Grandpa and the rest of Dad’s family was raised strictly Lutheran; Grandma and Aunt Alice became Jehovah’s Witnesses.

Grandpa almost divorced Grandma over the conversion, and they still get little passive-aggressive digs in against each other. Grandpa sends out Christmas cards and signs Grandma’s name (JWs don’t like Christmas) and at Alice’s son’s wedding, the officiant pretty much came out and said all the non-JWs in the family were going to hell as a lovely addition to the ceremony.

Dad told Grandpa that he thought organized religion was a crock. Grandma started sending him “The Watchtower” when she heard that. Finally he yelled at her to stop. She did, but when she got us kids alone, she told us she was worried about our parents because they smoked cigarettes (a JW no-no) and didn’t believe in God. We were all 8 and younger. Real nice, Gramma. Trying to scare the grandkids. :rolleyes: (Didn’t matter, though, because we were all budding little atheists ourselves. We got back at her, though. We taught the baby of the family, age 3, to say all kinds of curse words and then sent her in to talk to Grandma. :smiley: )

The JWs and the non-JWs make bigoted and intolerant remarks about each other at family get-togethers. The Lutherans aren’t too religious anymore (I guess it’s out of fashion now) so they team up with the atheists.

Fat jokes are always good for a laugh with this group (even though many of them are fat.) Dad’s brothers are all misogynists.

Family reunions are so much fun.

30

Racist bikers – yeah I’ve got a story about that.

For the record, I’m a biker, but not a 1%'er. More like 15% – owned several Harleys, got into them before the Evolution engine came along, etc.

Several years ago, I was a geographical bachelor working in SoCal, with no scooter down there. I hooked up with an old friend who happened to be storing an old FXE for a friend. So my friend, Bob, offered to let me borrow this other friend’s bike. Now, normally, that just isn’t done – someone’s ride is sacrosanct, no one else touches it without permission – but in this case Bob had full authority to do as he wished with the bike, and in fact was supposed to be sure it got ridden once in a while.

So I spent a great weekend in SoCal riding out to Point Fermin, up to the Rock Store on Mulholland, all the great things. Which brings me to the racist biker story. We were out in Point Fermin, and hooked up with some guys who wanted to ride to some beach bar up the coast. We were up for that, for sure, so off we fly down the freeway. I had no idea where we were going, so concentrated on keeping up with the 10 or so other bikes. Not an easy task, as this FXE was kind of ratty – not well maintained at all, which will play into the story.

We pull into this residential neighborhood somewhere south and east of central LA, and pull up to this house where there are about 8 guys working on Harleys and hanging out. There was a pool table in the garage, and a fridge full of beer. Everybody was cool, and very friendly. Several of the guys seemed especially nice to me – got me a beer, acted deferrential – it’s hard to explain, but they were very respectful and friendly to me. More so than the other guys we were riding with, guys I didn’t even know, except Bob.

I didn’t think much of it at the time. After a while, they fired up their scooters, we fired up ours, and about 14 bikes headed out to some beach bar. We had a good time there – priority parking, excellent seats on the patio – it seemed that we were adding some street cred to this place as being a cool place just by being there.

While we were there, several of the guys got a little loud, and started talking shit about latinos and blacks – talk that I wasn’t comfortable with, both because I make a distinct effort to be tolerant, and because I didn’t want to get in some bar fight. So, in a moment of either bravery or stupidity (or both), I called them on it: “I don’t think this is the right time, or place for that kind of talk. If ever.” You could have heard a pin drop at the table, then one of the guys who had been so nice to me said, “You’re right, brother. Be cool, fools – think once in a while.” And everything was cool again.

We headed back to the suburbs, and on leaving the guys, everyone made sure to shake my hand. Later that night, Bob called to my attention that those guys sure seemed to like me, confirming my feelings. He didn’t know why either.

The next day, the primary belt on the bike I was borrowing broke. It wasn’t until I took off the primary cover that I noticed that ‘SS’ cutout in it. Looking at the bike more carefully, I saw several iron crosses. But what really freaked me out were the swastika nuts on the license plate holder.

That’s why those guys were so nice to me. They figured anybody with enough balls to ride around in south east LA with that kind of decoration on his bike must deserve respect. I’ve since referred to it as 'My Day as a 1%‘er’.

31

I just want to ask a hypothetical question if I could.

Let’s suppose he had said

Would that be a bigoted / prejudiced or racist statement?

In my opinion, the answer would be no.

True, making generalizations about a person because of their race in rude and ignorant. Saying them to a stranger is boorish.

I’m sure there have been threads on racial stereotypes in the GD forum, I just can’t recall ever seeing one. I can’t see how stereotypes become popular & widely used (and/or held) within a society unless those traits are more prevelant than the aggregate norm.

Am I saying every Oriental woman is a bad driver? No
Am I saying all Germans are cold? No

All Scots frugal?
All Mediterreans hot tempered?
All Irish big drinkers?
All blacks & latinos better suited to play baseball in the heat?
All Jewish businessmen employee arson as a liquidation technique?
No. No. No. No. No.

But what I am saying is that unless the Masons secretly meet on an annual basis and and decide which stereotypes to introduce into our culture, generalizations about racial characteristics weren’t just formed out of thin air.

Whether it’s polite to restate them depends on the circumstances. I see alot of people laugh at their use in comedy shows.

But if one who thinks or verbalizes a stereotype could be branded ignorant, bigoted and racist, couldn’t the argument that avoiding teenage drivers (who are more reckless than society on a whole) and senior citizen motorists (who are more apt to be oblivious) be described as stereotyping and ageist?

32

When Mr. Adoptamom and I adopted transracially I discovered my grandmother is a racist. The first comment came as we were driving along in the country while she was holding my infant biracial son in her lap (he’d been crying for miles and miles and she couldn’t stand it - that’s the ONLY reason he was out of his carseat!) We passed a couple of houses side by side and black and white children playing together in the front yard. She said, “Those children shouldn’t be playing together - they shouldn’t mix”. Stunned, I reminded her that my son is biracial. She said that was different because he was being “raised white”. I was speechless and we began to slack off attending family events. We adopted a black daughter.

A couple of years later we became foster parents and one of our daughters dated interracially. Grandma told me in no uncertain terms that her boyfriend was not welcome in her house and that if he ever showed up she would turn him away. I told her we loved the boyfriend and would be proud to call him our son in law, and we love our black and white children. She then told me that blacks and whites dating and mating were akin to horses and cattle - two different species that didn’t belong together.

I’ve since given up completely having a meaningful relationship with my (childhood) favorite grandma. We see one another at rare family get togethers and frankly, I still love and respect all that she’s accomplished in her life. I’ve had to accept that at 80+ years old, she’s not going to change her way of thinking.

Paradoxically, she is always interested in how our children are doing, proudly hangs their pictures in her living room and snuggles them whenever she sees them. They are fully aware of her beliefs, are puzzled her feelings and feel a bit of pity for her. I’ve given up trying to figure it out.

33

In Montreal, I’ve seen first hand a lot of language bigotry. I used to work in a videostore, in an english neighborhood. I would say “Hi” to people as they came in. One guy decided that this was an insult to him, as he was a francophone and I was trying to isult him and that it was just like an english company to disregard his language preferences and he never wanted to be addressed in english in the store again. I think he rented “Terminator 2”.

It happens alot where I work now, as we send our clients bilingual invoices and they call up and swear that it’s completely improper to get anything in a language other than their own.

34

Lots. Lots and lots over the years.

By far the worst, at least in my experience, was a fellow I had the misfortune of meeting back in 1978. He was a tugboat captain in Philidelphia. His tug was taking my dad and myself out to meet my dad’s ship. Dad’s a merchant mariner and at the time was the Master of a container vessel for Delta Lines - I was going aboard to ride with him from Philly to Baltimore.

Anyway, we met the tug at one of the docks and went aboard. The captain seemed like a nice guy. He laughed and joked about the weather, made us coffee and had fun messing with a couple of his deckhands. His son was one of the crew and came aboard about 15 minutes after we did. When he did, he was apologizing to his dad about being a little late - he had run in to a lot of traffic on the way in. He mentioned that at one traffic light, he had been accosted by a window washer - you know, the kids (and adults sometimes) who run up to your car at a stoplight, squirt your window, wipe it with a filthy rag and then ask for money for this “service”?

The son had mentioned to his dad that the kid that had done this was black. Dad had one dismissive comment at that point that burned itself into my head and locked the entire morning into my head for the rest of my life.

What was the tugboat captain’s comment? A comment tossed off as casually and effortlessly as saying “good morning”? The captain said, “Well that explains it, son. Ni**ers aren’t human. They’re f*cking animals - a whole different species.”

I was 17 years old. I went to school in a suburb of Baltimore, and due to the presence of several federal offices nearby like the NSA, Fort Mead, etc., we had a student body that included almost every nationality, religion, color, culture and so on that there is. I had never heard anyone speak about another human being like that in my life - yeah, maybe I’d led a sheltered life until then, but Jesus. I couldn’t help but think that I was being carried to the ship by the single biggest asshole on the face of the planet. Since then, I’ve seen many other examples of real bigotry and racism, but to this day, that one 45 minute tugboat ride sticks in my mind as my perfect example of the stupidity, idiocy and ignorance that some are capable of.

35

On more than a few days, I have wished to have had the lack of experience conveyed by Aslan of Narnia.

I am Jewish, but my last name and my appearance don’t particularly match many folk’s stereotypes. Thus, throughout my life I have experience bigotry in a variety of contexts.

As an adult, I have tended to experience bigotry and outright anti-Semitism at the workplace. More often something stupid or mean is uttered by a manager rather than a peer. Sometimes it is my manager.

To answer the original query, these folks are all fairly intelligent, some more so than I in some ways. That said, their bigotry reveals them to be not very smart.

I am sure some of you are wondering how I respond to these little episodes. Usually, I put in an email (for the record and no CCs) my feelings of offense. That always leads to an apolgetic talk on their part. What I don’t say in the email is whether I will take any action and what type. All of the work settings I am referring to are within corporate structures with lots of fair anti-harassment policies.

Usually I keep it between both of us. Though I somewhat sacrifice the establishing of a “pattern” that helps prove harassment, I prefer the outcome of the illusion of my holding a bit of serious power over my manager. Since we all work together everyday, I also believe in dropping these issues and rebuilding some trust between us. Until the next time.

36

I don’t consider myself racist, but I often make race jokes. This is because I grew up around people of other cultures. Up until around third grade (I’m technicaly white, but my Hungarian descent gives me olive skin so get a lot of Mexican jokes) I was in an inner-city daycare filled with blacks, Hispanics, and all manner of religious variety. I got a lot of white and, as said above, mexican jokes, but 99% of the time it was all in good fun. I didn’t start joking around like that until a few years ago, but I find that one way to truly see that you and another person are friends is if you can rip on each other without meaning it but still take it in a positive manner.

When I’m around people that either are or I’m not sure if they will be offended by these jokes, I don’t make them because I understand that a lot of people are sensitive to issues like that. I also can’t stand it when I’m joking with somebody and they turn around and start seriously hating somebody. It disgusts me.

Which answers the question. I’ve gotten quite a few.

37

I have met more than I wish I’d met. I met more than a few at a group of college-aged (associated with a college, whodathunkit?) religiously-based organization. Most of them were at least passably intelligent otherwise, but when it came to matters of sexuality or alternate religion or, in a few cases, race … well, they didn’t quite possess the ability to think well in that area.

38

Guess you had to be there; it may not come across in mere text form. Based on the tone of voice, and the way he emphasized these people, the implication was very strong. That’s why I said I gave him the benefit of the doubt, and gently offered an opportunity to clarify whether he was judging her by her race, which, as related, he was. The way he said “you’ve got the Chinese and the blacks” was absolutely unmistakable.

39

Maybe it’s me, but I wouldn’t call him a bigot – he’s just a mean ol’ ornery cuss. :wink: At least he’s willing to (1) slam everyone equally hard, and (2) take whatever slams he gets from others. He sounds a lot more agreeable to me than most of the other bigots I’ve read about in this thread.

40

I had called a cab to the airport. The 40ish white guy who arrived on time was quietly courteous, and addressed me as “Sir”.

As we drove along, a car driven by a young black male pulled out in front of us from an intersection. Nothing heart-stopping, but the young black male was clearly at fault, and it was annoying enough that the cabbie had to slam on the brakes.

The cabbie didn’t say anything, but to acknowledge that I knew it wasn’t his fault, I muttered, as if to myself, something like, “What a jerk!”.

The cabbie responded, “Like to put a bullet in him. I never met one of them that was worth a dime.”

When we got to the airport, I tipped the cabbie… a dime.