Heeeeeeeeey FATTIES

[Dangerosa]

@Lobsang

Are you an alcoholic?

An alcoholic doesn’t have control over it. It’s not someone else making him drink. It’s the war going on inside his or her own head. If you are not an alcoholic then you are not qualified to make assumptions about how alcoholism works. Your implication that it is as easy as not bothering to drink displays an incredible naivety and lack of understanding. I would advise you to drop your line of reasoning until you know more about the subject.

Really? Then why are there so many successful alcoholics in recovery? Because they decided to take control over it.

Same thing with diet - if you decide to take control over it, you can. There are a ton (no pun intended) or formerly heavy dopers as well.

It isn’t easy. I’m not saying it is easy. And yet there are a ton of people right here on this board who have managed to beat their addictions - to food or to alcohol or to cigarettes or to worse.

Frankly, you seem to be whining that “its too hard!!!” which is frankly pitable. Instead, just admit that you don’t choose to try and accept yourself for what you are - once you accept yourself for what you are, no excuses, you’ll stop making an idiot of yourself in these threads - because you won’t see any reason to justify yourself to someone other than yourself, and you won’t need to justify yourself to yourself having accepted that you are just not willing to put in the work.

[Lobsang]

@Dangerosa

Really? Then why are there so many successful alcoholics in recovery? Because they decided to take control over it.

I fail to see how this is a counter-argument to what I said. I myself am in recovery. I don’t den that there are successful alcoholics in recorvery. I meet them every tuesday.

Maybe I mis-said something or maybe you didn’t understand what I was saying.

Same thing with diet - if you decide to take control over it, you can. There are a ton (no pun intended) or formerly heavy dopers as well.

It isn’t easy. I’m not saying it is easy. And yet there are a ton of people right here on this board who have managed to beat their addictions - to food or to alcohol or to cigarettes or to worse.

Frankly, you seem to be whining that “its too hard!!!” which is frankly pitable. Instead, just admit that you don’t choose to try and accept yourself for what you are - once you accept yourself for what you are, no excuses, you’ll stop making an idiot of yourself in these threads - because you won’t see any reason to justify yourself to someone other than yourself, and you won’t need to justify yourself to yourself having accepted that you are just not willing to put in the work.

I’m not justifying myself. I’m not a ‘fattie’ and I’m not a drinking alcoholic. I keep my weight under control and I am sober.

All I am trying to do in this thread is point out the existence of psychological difficulties for fat people and Alcoholics. That it is not simply a case of “Deciding not to do it any more” It is a decision that people are capable of making. But it’s not easy.
And if I’m saying things that give people the impression that my main motive is to whine and say “Oh it’s so hard for us fatties and drunks” then I am clearly not using the right words.

[Gfactor]

@Jackmannii

But the rock verdict is in, and fat is where’s it’s at.

Contra: Frank Zappa - Big Leg Emma lyrics | LyricsFreak (she was my steady date until she put on weight).

and see: Led Zeppelin - Black Dog Lyrics | AZLyrics.com (a big legged woman ain’t got no soul)

[SenorBeef]

@Shot_From_Guns

As I said upthread, I don’t have any issues with people who are fat and happy with their bodies.

This seems very unlikely to me. If this is an issue on which you are so gleefully hating on people, it’s more likely it’s fueled by a legitimate disgust with those sorts of people in general. You dress this up as “I only hate the ones that say it’s out of their control!” but I think this is just a way for you to feel like less of a bitch, because now you are attacking a specific idea - the idea of (false) fat victomhood - rather than just expressing hatred towards a specific group of people. I have a difficult time believing that you indeed don’t “have any issues with people who are fat and happy with their bodies” - I’d imagine they repulse you and you think something is wrong with them.

And that’s a valid enough view to hold - you can both hate fat people and hate generally people who play victim when they could exert some control over the issue. So go ahead, embrace it, and drop the whole “I have no issue…” bullshit.

PS. Don’t lock this thread. I’m kind of enjoying this as a spectacle of old-school Pitness. Fatties, pedophiles, and even abortion insults. Good stuff. Also, I wish you could let us fly free with the “cunts”, cause there are a lot of valid uses to be found. I’ve never been all that into the Pit, but this is more like what it should be like.

[What_Exit]

@Jamaika_a_jamaikaiake

Much of this thread is a hijack by those 2 nimrods going back and forth. As far as I can tell, it’s because Sleeps is obsessed by Claude’s alleged paedophilia. It’s threadjacking pure and simple.

Well I agree it is a hijack but this is hardly a thread that makes sense of needs protection from hijacks is it? It is a strange pitting that was mostly against a handful of people and not “fatties” despite the OP. Also known as the OP backtracked a bit.

@Lobsang

I don’t get why I’m being attacked here. The OP is being a heartless dick about overweight people. I’m trying to defend the reasons many, not all fat people get fat.
+
I’m not saying the unhappy-about-being-fat fat people are blaming something other than themselves. And I resent the over-simplification of the points I’m trying to make.

These people know they are fat because of themselves. But ‘themselves’ could be weak-willed, always hungry, never satisfied by normal meal sizes, and I sympathise with someone who has to go through life feeling that way and I understand that they will give in to the cravings.

I am just saying that many fat people have different psychology than a typical thin person who isn’t always craving food.

OK, I get your point, but when you came into this thread it sure seemed like the tune you were singing was “It is not my fault”. Which proved the OPs really annoying point. I sympathize with anyone with a weight issue as I can’t seem to win this battle myself. There are reasons and excuses but in the end it boils down to lack of will power to prioritize weight loss, eating right and especially exercise.

So if you did not mean or intend to say “it is not my fault” I apologize for bashing you. If you reread your own first few posts and see why I thought that was what you were saying then understand why I got annoyed with you along with the Op.

[Starving_Artist]

@SenorBeef

Also, I wish you could let us fly free with the “cunts”, cause there are a lot of valid uses to be found.

The moderators can’t let us fly free with calling each other “cunt” even if they want to. It’s bannination (at least when it comes to name-calling among posters) is official board policy according to the new rules that went into effect last spring.

[Lobsang]

Thankyou WhatExit?. I do understand why you got annoyed from my early posts in this thread and I apologise for the way they probably came across. I myself was annoyed at the OP for the way he went about his pitting. I guess I went too far in defending excessive eating in an effort to ‘win’ the argument against the OP.

Just to be clear in case anyone else still thinks I’m being whiny and defending gluttony and alcohol over-consumption (for the sake of it) - I don’t have much sympathy for people who let their weight get out of control but don’t care. Nor do I have much sympathy for people who drink too much and are completely unapologetic about it. When I drank I hated myself for it. I honestly believed I wasn’t capable of pulling myself out of the nightmare.

Desire to do something (eat too much, pick up a drink) is powerful, and I have huge respect for people who successfully stay sober or eat sensibly despite those desires. (The desires get smaller over a period of time not giving into them)

And I also acknowledge that there are people who simply play victim. But there are also people who really are a victim of their own overwhelming desires. Nothing is as cut-and-dry as the oversimplifications of the OP and some of the other posters in this thread.

[Dangerosa]

@Lobsang

I fail to see how this is a counter-argument to what I said. I myself am in recovery. I don’t den that there are successful alcoholics in recorvery. I meet them every tuesday.

Maybe I mis-said something or maybe you didn’t understand what I was saying.

I’m not justifying myself. I’m not a ‘fattie’ and I’m not a drinking alcoholic. I keep my weight under control and I am sober.

All I am trying to do in this thread is point out the existence of psychological difficulties for fat people and Alcoholics. That it is not simply a case of “Deciding not to do it any more” It is a decision that people are capable of making. But it’s not easy.
And if I’m saying things that give people the impression that my main motive is to whine and say “Oh it’s so hard for us fatties and drunks” then I am clearly not using the right words.

You are clearly not using the right words, and quite honestly, in these threads have never given, at least me, the impression that you are doing anything other than whining “but its SO hard.” Yes, it IS hard. No doubt about it, shaking any habit is hard. Denial is hard. But I don’t think turning up your nose at carrots to fill you up is a psychological issue.

[Crafter_Man]

@Lobsang

All I am trying to do in this thread is point out the existence of psychological difficulties for fat people and Alcoholics.

I would agree.

Twenty years ago I was on the verge of being obese. I then decided to permanently lose the weight. I’ve kept it off since then. Not to brag, but I am one of the very few who has succeeded in doing this. I would estimate that 95% of people who try to permanently lose weight ultimately fail at it.

On a couple occasions I have had coworkers ask me how to lose weight. I tell them what to do. Armed with this knowledge, they… fail.

I have come to the conclusion that fat people are not fat due to ignorance. You can provide people information on how to lose weight, but it will be for naught. In other words, education won’t solve the problem.

The fundamental problem is mental in nature; obesity is basically a mental/psychological problem, not a physical one. And the problem is how they relate to food.

An obese person has a very primitive and juvenile relationship with food. They eat like a six year old. They derive immense pleasure from eating. So much so, that they couldn’t care less about the consequences. It is no different than someone addicted to nicotine or alcohol… they derive so much pleasure from it that they couldn’t care less about the consequences.

The very small percentage of people who have permanently lost weight learned that they must make a fundamental change in how they relate to food. Instead of having an emotional relationship with food, they learn to have an unemotional and scientific one.

I no longer feed my face out of pleasure; Whenever I go to a restaurant, for example, I pick foods based on calories, percent fat, percent protein, etc. Throughout the day I ask myself, “Approximately how much protein have I eaten? Approximately how many carbs have I eaten? How much fat have I eaten?” If I think I haven’t eaten enough of one of these, I will eat it.

So there you have it… I learned to no longer have an emotional craving for food. My “secret” is to look at food in an objective, cold, unemotional, scientific, and calculating way. And I’ve kept the weight off. Teaching someone to think like this is next to impossible.

[Lobsang]

@Dangerosa

You are clearly not using the right words, and quite honestly, in these threads have never given, at least me, the impression that you are doing anything other than whining “but its SO hard.” Yes, it IS hard. No doubt about it, shaking any habit is hard. Denial is hard. But I don’t think turning up your nose at carrots to fill you up is a psychological issue.

You are just misunderstanding my intentions. On the carrot subject I was merely pointing out the objective fact that a bag of carrots doesn’t make one feel anything like the same afterwards as a packet of chocolate biscuits.

I wasn’t defending the idea of choosing to eat the biscuits! I know the carrots are the sensible thing to have. I was merely trying to point out that carrots aren’t the answer to the desire problem.

[Rumor_Watkins]

@bump

People can’t do that with food- the best they can hope for is to regulate what and how much they eat, which is a LOT harder to do long term than just avoid something like a cigarette or alcohol.

really? if you have a basic command of the english language, arabic numerals, and a rudimentary knowledge of arithmetic (specifically, addition) it’s not at all difficult. unless you are a chef, or have access to a private one, most people generally eat the same groups of foods. after a while, you can easily estimate caloric content of whatever food you’re preparing without even needing to read nutrition labels.
i think this is what irks people like the OP about fatties: they make up horrendous excuses that are just weak, argumentatively, to absolve them of their inability to stop shoving food in their mouths and walk around for a couple of minutes a day.

[Dangerosa]

@Lobsang

You are just misunderstanding my intentions. On the carrot subject I was merely pointing out the objective fact that a bag of carrots doesn’t make one feel anything like the same afterwards as a packet of chocolate biscuits.

I wasn’t defending the idea of choosing to eat the biscuits! I know the carrots are the sensible thing to have. I was merely trying to point out that carrots aren’t the answer to the desire problem.

Of course they don’t! Do you think that thin people think that they do? Perhaps the issue here is that your stating the obvious is patronizing.

[Lobsang]

Rumor_Watkins It is easy to calculate what the right amount of food is, and find out what the right kind of food is. That’s not the issue. The issue, and the point bump is making, is that it’s not easy to follow the rules that your factual brain knows.

Many fatties really do make up excuses. That’s like blaming mobile phones for people on mobile phones being dicks. It’s the fault of the dickhead holding the phone not the phone. In the case of a fat person making excuses it’s not the fault of fat people, it’s fault of the dickhead that chooses to blame his problem on something other than himself.

BUT. NOT ALL FATTIES ARE THAT PERSON! Some of them really do have legitimate reasons for eating more than they wish they did/ desiring food more than they wish they did.

[Lobsang]

@Dangerosa

Of course they don’t! Do you think that thin people think that they do? Perhaps the issue here is that your stating the obvious is patronizing.

Well I apologise if it was. But it seemed like I needed to make the point. because the person (I forget who) seemed to be suggesting that you can solve the hunger problem just by eating carrots, which to me came across as very naive.

If all an obese person needed to do was eat carrots instead of cheeseburgers then there wouldn’t be a problem.

The problem is *wanting *to eat the burgers despite *knowing *the carrots would be the better option.

[tacoloco]

@Starving_Artist

The moderators can’t let us fly free with calling each other “cunt” even if they want to. It’s bannination (at least when it comes to name-calling among posters) is official board policy according to the new rules that went into effect last spring.

You won’t get banned for using one of the prohibited insults.

Use 'em enough and I suppose you get suspended.

[KarlGrenze]

@Nzinga_Seated

Full disclosure:

I’m a big mama, and I have no one to blame but myself. I actually embrace my big mama-ness, however, I love to over eat the wrong foods so much that I actually must work very hard to keep it under some semblance of control or it would be much worse…worse to the point where I didn’t feel big and sexy, but just fat and sloppy. And I wouldn’t like that.

All that confessed…

I get where Shots is coming from, because I hear it a LOT. A LOT from big people giving every excuse in the book for being overweight. The thing is, I do sympathize with folks to the point that I cringed a bit at the OP, because the OP is asking folks to do something that is very hard, and takes a lot of work and self reflection…to admit to weakness and personal failing on something that actually makes them feel…repulsive.

I can understand how if someone is large and feels unattractive or gross…I can understand how hard it would be to admit that goddamit, they just love food. It’s not genetics, it’s not big bones, it’s not the way carbs intereacts with their fat cells, it’s just that the love of overeating the wrong foods is stronger than the will to lose the weight. Along with the whole excercise thing.

I can understand the posters that are saying it is time for the whiny fatties to stop whining about the shit, cause it aint helping. But at the same time, I can sympathize with how hard it is for a fatty to say, “I don’t want to be like this, and I am still this way because I haven’t been strong enough to change it.” I know that is hard to do.

Once a person learns self love, there is nothing to hard to say. You learn to express yourself freely and you learn to laugh at yourself, and you learn to take it in stride when others laugh at you. But if you don’t have that self love thing working yet, it hurts to hear the cool kids so nonchalantly make judgments. It makes folks strike out and say dumb shit to the cool kids, to protect their own egos. No one that saw that pic of Shots thinks she’s unattractive. She’s clearly fine. But folks will say things to protect their own egos.

I don’t claim to speak for all fat women at all, obviously. Mostly because my own culture has helped me to embrace and revel in my own big body in a way that this society as a whole doesn’t do for overweight women. So I just imagine it must be very hard to not make excuses. But, that’s no excuse.

Because in this interesting mess of a thread, this needs to be repeated.

[Rumor_Watkins]

@Lobsang

BUT. NOT ALL FATTIES ARE THAT PERSON! Some of them really do have legitimate reasons for eating more than they wish they did/ desiring food more than they wish they did.

such as? what are these legitimate reasons?

short of some medical problem that necessitates them eating more calories than their body utilizes (if that’s even an accepted affliction) the reasons that fatties eat more than they wish they did comes down to a simple lack of willpower and a lack of resolve to exercise.

and what percentage of obese people have these reasons? I think another reason the OP was bringing up the 1995 vs 2008 comparison (or whatever years it was) is to make the inference that these “reasons” can’t just, biologically speaking, sprout out from no where. it’s all about the people themselves and the attitude they take towards their own personal responsibility for the food they consume.

[Rumor_Watkins]

@KarlGrenze

Because in this interesting mess of a thread, this needs to be repeated.

the only problem with this is that, of course, self-love is another form of excuse.

being happy with your morbid obesity, well that’s just fucking swell, but it doesn’t mitigate the costs you’re inflicting on everyone else (and everyone else’s eyes )

[KarlGrenze]

@Rumor_Watkins

the only problem with this is that, of course, self-love is another form of excuse.

being happy with your morbid obesity, well that’s just fucking swell, but it doesn’t mitigate the costs you’re inflicting on everyone else (and everyone else’s eyes )

I took it as self-love may actually help you combat obesity and deal with it, even if you do not end up as a typical “hottie”. And at least you’d be less of a jerk (to others and yourself).

And if self-love includes masturbation, hey, that’s extra exercise!

[Lobsang]

@Rumor_Watkins

such as? what are these legitimate reasons?

The desire for food is very high. To paraphrase Nzinga, Seated - They “Just love eating”. It is another way of saying the desire is strong. It’s difficult to ignore that desire.

So there’s a reason for you.

short of some medical problem that necessitates them eating more calories than their body utilizes (if that’s even an accepted affliction) the reasons that fatties eat more than they wish they did comes down to a simple lack of willpower and a lack of resolve to exercise.

Or to look at it another way (I feel like I am banging my head against a wall here as this is the point I keep trying to make) - There is an excess of desire to eat.