Hey Straight Folks

To a large extent, I think this explains a lot of it, and it’s sort of a generational thing. Using racism as an example, my parents raised me seeing all races as equal and it’s something that’s ingrained in me. For several years when I was in elementary school, my best friend was black, we only stopped being friends when he moved away. Looking back, I realize it was odd to my parents, not because they weren’t trying not to be racist, but having grown up in the 50s and 60s in a pretty racist area, it had been ingrained that black people just weren’t equal to white people, so even though they’d intellectually gotten past it, some of that training still poked it’s ugly head up every now and then. And I only really realized this after having a conversation with my mom a few months back where she said she was proud of me for having friends of different races and dating women of different races and yadda yadda, and it hadn’t even occurred to me as anything special, it’s just how it is.

And in the same unfortunate way, I was raised with one parent basically being indifferent but the other pressing into me that homosexuality is evil, it’s tearing down society, etc. I never really saw it as more than just a sin and any worse than really any other, but it was definitely still “icky” to me. It wasn’t until I got into my late teens and early twenties and started thinking about it that I realized that was stupid and I intellectually changed my opinion, but it’s difficult to really undo years of training like that, and I still catch a gut reaction contrary to my intellectual beliefs from time to time, though I almost always catch it and it’s gotten exeedingly rare over the years. I think the biggest difference for me was meeting really good people who are gay or transgender or whatever, because it did a lot to dispel that nonsense. And to that extent, I hope that if/when I have kids of my own, raising them believing people as equal, race, religion, gender, orientation, whatever, and as much as I grew up just not even seeing racism as a thing, really seeing all races as equal, I hope I can do the same for my kids in as many or more ways. In short, hate is learned, it isn’t innate.

But again, as a similar story, I used to know someone who considered herself extremely progressive, and went out of her way to talk about a lot of the equality stuff. About ten years ago, when gay marriage and all was really starting to be a part of the zeitgeist, I remember her going off on a spiel lecturing me about how I wasn’t supportive enough because of various candidates I supported or something, I really don’t remember the reasoning, but it was kind of spurious. Nevertheless, about a month or two later, she had gotten a couple new roommates (she was sharing a large townhouse downtown), and she was flipping out because she was concerned one of them was gay and having sex in the house. I was trying to calm her down, pointing out all that stuff we’d talked about before, but she even went on to say that it’s one thing to support it in theory or in other places, just not in her own house. Turns out, he wasn’t even gay, the guy she thought was his boyfriend was just a friend, and he later got a girlfriend and she was totally okay with him loudly having sex with her. I think at that point she realized her concerns were stupid, but only after they were made moot. My point in this story isn’t to bash that person or whatever, only in that even someone who REALLY wants to further these sorts of causes, having grown up in a much more conservative culture than here in the US, where homosexuality was an arrestable offense, she couldn’t just WILL her trained disgust away.

So, I guess what I’m getting at is, society IS changing, but it still takes time. Even for people that really are your allies, we’re going to stumble or fall from time to time. Don’t be disheartened by that, but rather strive to see how far we’ve come in ending that prejudice that has been ingrained in us and in society for so many generations. Hopefully, in your having been out for 40 years, you’ve observed a large shift, particularly in the last 10 years or so. We’ll get there.

^ What he said.

90-something% straight woman here.

One of the six+ main reasons I am still on speaking terms with my mother is that she’s an opinion leader. Through her, I was able to shuffle several dozen grandmothers from “SSM is unacceptable!” to “but of course they should be able to get married!” in a matter of days (I moved her, she moved the catechists from all the local parishes, and the mostly-leftist book club, and the mothers of the mayor and of several other prominent politicians…). They in turn transmitted my arguments to their neighbors, and to other grandmothers, and their children and grandchildren€. I’m always surprised by how little attention our politicians pay to that particular group most of the time, you’d think none of them ever had a grandmother (that could explain a lot).
Many of my generation’s stories of sexist encounters are considered “unbelievable” by younger generations; there’s still a lot of work to be done (and the current “waves of pink” aren’t helping) but things are definitely better. Then again, I was born in Franco’s Spain: there was quite a bit of an “up” ways to come. We tend to think of ourselves as an extremely sexist culture, but IME we’re pretty average for… hm… “the Christian-majority world”.

We’ve gone through having to ask “ok, so are your civil-unionized people ‘married’ for tax and social security purposes or not?”. We’ve gone through changes in language, some good, some bad, and some where I can’t make up my mind either way. From Proposition 8 garbage to SSM being legally valid in multiple countries, including the whole of the US (you guys can now come get married in Spain if you want!*). That shit like these murders in Orlando happens and will happen, is bad. All we can do is work to make things better within those spaces we can reach.

  • The Spanish government will not record a marriage that would not be valid at the country level in the country of which either of the spouses is a citizen. This blocks people whose marriage would be valid in some states but not in others; it also blocks people whose union would get a different name from “marriage”, unless their country-level government has clarified that yes, we should treat the other name as one of our own “civil marriages”.
  • two brothers, two nephews, one sister in law (the other one, I don’t wish her ill but I can’t really care much about her), and this sixth reason

€ at least one of those politicians cut his mother off with “but of course, I just hadn’t mentioned it in front of you because I thought you’d get mad.” “… I would have. An adult is entitled to change her mind. I’m glad you’re for it. So. What will you guys want for lunch on Sunday?”

Straight cis female checking in. I grew up surrounded by gay loved ones. My aunt’s best friend was gay, and I met him when I was six. Then a number of my best friends were bi and gay in high school. I related to them because they were struggling with a part of themselves that they could not change. I saw them get thrown out of the house and threatened and degraded; these things happened to me as well, just not because I was gay. Because for whatever other reason I had a parent who couldn’t accept my existence. The point is, they got me on a deeper level than other people did. We felt weird inside. The fundamental lack of acceptance traumatized us and we had to figure out a way to band together and move past it.

My best friend from high school is still my best friend. My little sister in law is gay. I have friends who are divorcing because one of them realized she was gay. It’s so much a part of my life and worldview that I have a hard time wrapping my head around the idea that people really have a problem with it.

I am a profoundly shy and non-confrontational person, but I have been known to dress down people acting like bigots. In high school I dressed down the most popular kid in my school (I was not popular but not particularly reviled either) for calling someone a fag. I did it in front of the entire classroom and shamed him into apologizing. I left my church over anti-gay bigotry when I was 17. It was my defense of trans people to my Mom that led her to block me on Facebook and ultimately led to the end of our relationship (more over her treatment of me than her position on trans issues, but the point is I rebutted her ignorance knowing it would likely lead to disaster, but the issue was too important to ignore.)

I am the sort of person, I can see anyone’s POV on most issues, and am frequently led to doubt my own position. But not with LGBT stuff. That is gut-level unmoveable, unshakable certainty. Major religions are wrong that being gay is a sin. Period. People who think being gay is unnatural are wrong. Period. Casting moral judgment on a person for being gay is wrong. Period. This sickening cascade of wrongness has resulted in disgusting levels of inequality. Over half of homeless youth are LGBT. Just that single fact in itself is enough to boil my blood. That’s not even getting into elevated risk of physical and sexual assault, major life disturbances, mental health comorbidity, etc.

When Orlando happened, just 90 minutes from my beloved SIL, I ranted and screamed on the internet and it felt so empty. I added ‘‘Do something about LGBT rights’’ to my actual concrete real-life to-do list. The deadline is June 30th to figure out what concrete steps I am going to take in my community.

If there is one place I’m really ignorant it’s trans issues. I know the talking points and I have a number of trans Facebook friends but have never had a really close relationship with a trans person so I don’t have the same level of intuitive understanding about the complexities of gender identity. That is something I intend to change. The stats on trans victimization are appalling. I work for a nonprofit domestic violence/sexual assault org that does active outreach to LGBT people.

It’s a start.

Thanks, Spice Weasel, that was an outstanding post. <–why I love the Dope