Hillary is in serious trouble?

Do you have to put the city on a large rotating disc first, or do you use the “bomb, turn it over, bomb again” method?

Actually, it’s a rotating bomb, that way people have an entertaining lightshow to watch as their eyes boil.

You people are really, really, really sick.

No wonder I love the Dope so much.

Ditto. Hi, ETF!

Do I have to comment on Hillary now? OK, here goes: she is loved by few, but the front runner nonetheless. She grates on my nerves, but at this point I’d vote for ANY candidate that repairs our foreign relations and gets our soldiers out of Iraq.

Obama doesn’t have the experience/years - but I predict Hillary will ask him to be the VP.

It could happen!

What does Hillary have that Obama doesn’t? Two more years in the Senate? Fewer years in State legislatures? Oh yeah, she was married to the president. Nobody voted for her. She got to sit in on meetings when she felt like it, but others took the heat for decisions that were made. She has all this documentation of what she did as First Lady and we can see it oh, say in 2009. Screw that. She was NOT Secretary of State, she was NOT Secretary of Treasury, she was NOT co-president. She did write a term paper on health care and her proposals flew like the proverbial lead balloon. What she CAN do is unite the Republican Party and drag a lot of Democrats down to defeat with her poison pantsuit tails.

Guys, I usually don’t get into political debate threads, so go easy on me, please . . .

Was watching the news this evening. Much was made of Oprah Winfrey’s appearance and support for Senator Obama. Commentators speculated that the African-American vote could be split between him and Senator Clinton. He because he is black, she because her husband is well-loved in the black community.

Now, I know this is just in the primaries where the vote could be split. But is there a chance there would be enough black voters to split these two, thus giving an edge to Edwards or somebody else, thus allowing him or somebody else to take the Dem nomination from both of them?

Sir Rhosis

EDIT: clarification

Unlikely, IMHO.

Ah, The Return Of The Vast Right Wing Conspiracy. I’ve been looking forward to the sequel for a long time.

Hillary Clinton’s problem is, in a nutshell, Hillary Clinton. Despite significant disagreement with her views, I think she’d likely make a pretty competent administrator. However, every time she opens her mouth she comes off as a shrill, biting shrew, and if the Democrats have any memory, they’ll recall how poorly that act worked for Michael Dukakis. Add to the fact that there’s a significant portion of Americans who will still not vote for a woman (or someone with too dark a skin pigmentation) and the Democrats would be crazy to run either of the two favored frontrunners at this point.

In regard to her experience; seriously? Not only has she held elective office at the senatoral level, but quite frankly she’s been the driving force, and often the brain trust behind the jovial and charismatic Bill Clinton ever since he started bashing doors in Arkansas. She’s at least as experienced, in any practical sense, as anyone else on the field in regard to getting elected and managing major policy decisions and strategy, but she’s a kingmaker, not a king.

Somebody needs to dust off Gary Hart. Now that the American public is so jadad to extramarital affairs in high executive office we can reconsider the guy who probably should have won in the first place, although perhaps it’s good that he didn’t. “I’m voting for Dukakis,” is a much more amusing opening line than the other option. “You tell 'em, George.”

Stranger

Shrillness may be in the eye of the beholder, but I disagree. I am no fan of Hillary’s, but have been really impressed with her performance in the debates. Cool, calm and collected is the way I’d describe her. I don’t by her phony smile, but we are talking about a politician here. There’s something phony about pretty much every single one of them.

I have to agree with John Mace about the “shrillness”. I don’t see it either. Complaining about stuff like that is like compalining Edwards face is too wiggly or something. I see and hear references to her hair, breasts, laugh and pantsuits way more than I hear discussion about anything of substance.

I agree with you. Most people must know there is corporate media control and ultraconservative talk radio dominates the airwaves. Fox is the most watched network for news information in the U.S.
The reality is that radical conservatives with their hostile language effectively persuade public opinion. Conservatives hate Bill Clinton and Hillary Rodham Clinton. I am sure the thought of a woman, a Clinton, and Bill to boot is far too much for the conservatives to bear.

Ah yes, the return of right-wingers’ bringing up of non-existent “vast right-wing conspiracy” exclamations from non-existent left-wingers. Outside of Hillary Clinton herself a couple of times, Google seems to show that most of the online hits concerning that phrase come from right-wing sources.
If someone here claims that there is a “vast right-wing conspiracy”, I say it’s fair game to go after them. Otherwise, take your meme-building elsewhere, please.

Actually, if anything, rather then shrill, I find her a little too calm and measured. She sort of reminds me of Al Gore in that respect(circa 2000 Al Gore that is, not movie star 2007 Al Gore).

One reason I started my polls on why people hated/loved Hillary (probably still visible in GD) was that meme that she’s unlikable or offputting as a public speaker. I think because she’s a woman, it’s assumed she must be shrill, but really, I don’t see it. She’s kind of unremarkable as a public speaker. Her smarmy husband is the one I found offputting. Then again, I’m used to middle-aged women in positions of authority or as spokesmen, & I probably find an Arkansas accent more wheedling-sounding than a Midwestern one.

I think Hillary scares the conservative pundits because she represents everything they hate. She is strong, a woman, a democrat, a Clinton, an advocate of evil social medicine, and don’t forget she is married to the same man and has a great daughter despite her animal personality. Her morals must be a blow the conservative family values mantra preached by the conservatives. They can’t paint her as the immoral woman.
Now she is not human. Hillary has more humanity in her little finger than every man on the opposing team.

I hope Hillary wins the nomination just so I can sleep at night knowing Rush Limbaugh has to monitor his blood pressure every four hours.

I listen to talk radio more than I should, and they harp constantly about the “lefty” media. I guess the theory is if they say that enough, everyone will believe it. Unfortunately, I suspect that works.

No he spends money like a Republican while claiming to be fiscally conservative. You do not have to be for a smaller government to be a repub. You just have to say you are and the party and voters will follow.

Balls.

Regards,
Shodan

Personaly, I think we are decades away from electing a woman president reguardless of her politics. Same goes for Obama. The only black man who’s ever had a shot at the White House was Powel. And that’s back when he was still riding high from the war, if he ran today he wouldn’t have a chance.

I would tend to agree with you but the numbers simply disagree. There are not a lot of strong candidates on either side.

If you take out Obama and Hillary Clinton, then the only serious contender on the Democratic side is Edwards. Could he do very well in the first few states? Possibly, but I tend to doubt it. People just don’t seem to be as ardent in their support of him and Iowa is a very influential state. People who are less passionate don’t show up to caucuses.

On the Republican side, the religious right will probably all vote for someone like Romney, Huckabee or Fred Thompson who hasn’t a chance in hell of being elected or attracting independent/crossparty votes. If one of them wins the nomination, the Democrats are a shoe-in. They are all too conservative and too religious to win enough support to get elected. If they don’t, who else is left? Giuliani? The religious right hates him and his pro-choice stance. Between Giuliani and a Democrat, they probably won’t vote. There seem to be no middle ground conservative candidates among the frontrunners.

Now, granted, there’s always the chance of a third party candidate mucking things up, but barring Edwards I think it’s pretty likely that Obama or Hillary are it. I would give odds on that Edwards is a VP candidate for Obama or Hillary at this point, probably Obama.

The mood has definitely changed in Iowa. Obama is picking up a lot of support here and I think that his campaign’s strategy of leaning on passion and idealism is going to pay off on Caucus Day.