Homophobic hatred

Great Debates
101

Peace. may I make a quick comment on this.

{to the cute little cuddly baby in the bath water} Out ya go!

Don’t take the misguided teaching of some that are behind a pulpit speak for what the ‘teachings of Jesus’ are.

In Acts we are told a story of the Bereans that listened to what Paul tought, then ‘searched the scripture’ to see what was right.

Also Paul told others to ‘test everything, hold on to the good’

As I said before, I hate Homophobic hatred, and any other hatred of people. It just ain’t right. And it ain’t scriptural either.

A homosexual act is a sin, just like adultry is a sin, and fornication is a sin. Sins of which I am guilty of BTW. (for the a-word, it was a in your mind thing, not a physical thing) So to hate ANYONE for committing a homesexual act, I’d have to be ignoring a BIG log in my eye.

I won’t back down from calling homosexual acts a sin. And I won’t back down from calling ‘bigots behind a pulpit’ … well… bigots behind a pulit!.

Peace.

† Jon †
Phillipians 4:13

102

Robbnn: Okay, so you think that homosexual sex is wrong. Just to go back to the OP for a moment (yeah, yeah, I know, but I assume that Bucky was looking for an answer), do you have an extra-biblical reason for doing so? Besides, “the anus is not designed for that kind of abuse”? If not, just say so.

I’m the someone who asked if two people of the same gender love each other, then what’s the problem. And you say that you think it is destructive. Destructive in what way? And yes, I meant with the erotic dimension added. After all, nobody seems to get their knickers in a twist over sex between a man & a woman. Well, some do, but we’re not discussing them right now.

Or, in other words, you have no proof. Whereas I have no proof, and an awful lot of anecdotal evidence that supports my assertion.

And what sort of euphemism are you making with the hardware/software analogy?

Also, you are right, no trigger has been found. And? Do you think that searching should stop? And ahem yer own damned self.

As far as your third point, well, I’m not a scientist. So I cannot speak with any authority on it. I wish I could, though.

Except that not everyone is allowed to work where they are best suited. And in many instances, people are denied housing because of their sexuality. Yes, in theory everyone has the same rights, and the ability to exercise them, but this is the real world.
Waste
Flick Lives!

103

Phaedrus, no argument that men and women are different. I favor the nature argument here.

And I will not argue against generalizations.

But I will argue that men are the cause of war, and that they are more likely to abuse others. Men have been the rulers and leaders for the most part, and as such are the only people who could be responsible for war.

Saying that only men cause wars is like saying that only prison inmates start prison riots. It begs the question. Only men are in the position to make the decision (except for the Falkland Islands.)

As for abuse, men are more physical than women. It is a matter of style, not agression. Women manipulate and belittle, men hit (sometimes.) Again, since we are larger and stronger for the most part, we are in a better position to use physical violence.

But this is another thread, which I will start.

104

Glad we concur that men and women are different and it ain’t just the plumbing!

I never said only men cause war, but your point is duly noted.

Style? Prove it.

I have known women who were strong than men and still did not resort to violence. And what about the burning bed?

You may “favor” nature all you like but if you cannot produce studies that show that hormones have no effect on behavior your point is moot.

This seems short and possibly like I am but I am starving and gotta eat.

We’ll pick it up later, if you like. :slight_smile:

GlWasteful: On destructive, when a male sodomizes another male it ruptures the blood vessels and causes damage to the surrounding tissue. This doesn’t happen with a vagina. I can postulate that gay men do different things to express sexual love. But I’d really not rather think about it. My experience was bad enough.

105

Phaedrus] wrote:

Au contraire. Try this on for size:

And that’s a fact, Jack.

Most gay men who engage in anal sex are very careful and well-lubricated. For the most part, there is little or no tissue damage in male or female anal sex unless the act is violent or forcible.

At least I assume you meant “consensual anal sex” when you used the term “sodomize.” Please correct if I misread you.

-andros-

106

Bucky,
Has this been of any use to you?
Has the class you referred to commenced?
If so, how is the discussion going?

Thank you for starting the thread.

107

andros: Huh? Well I’ll be!

No, I didn’t know that about rape, but I have intercourse more than once and I never noticed any broken vessels.

Nice quote, where’s it from?

As to men being well lubricated the only way to know that is to participate or believe what you are told. I was told otherwise. Have you participated in acts like that? If you haven’t you are believing what you were told.

Sodomize, yes, that is what I was referring to.

Thanks for the info.

108

andros: I have another question for you.

How come AIDS spread thru the gay community like wild fire and its transmission was slow among heteros?

If what you say is correct I would think that the transmission rate would have been equal and it wasn’t. How come?

You seem to know a lot about this and I really haven’t studied it that much. So, please? Reveal your source and answer the transmission question. Stats are and have been confirmed that AIDS spread much more rapidly thru the gay community. The info I have is came from dotors reports.

109

quote:
Someone else said something about gays not being treated equally by law. Now, I do disagree with that. A gay man or woman obviously has all the same rights a straight does and none of those rights should be abridged.Everyone should be allowed to work where they are best suited, etc. What rights are being abridged at the moment?

Legally, the rights of same sex couples are pretty nill. If you are a hetrosexual couple, you can file taxes jointly. You have next-of-kin rights to make medical descions about your spouse. You can adopt a child. Your spouse can get on your medical insurance. One spouse cannot be made to testify against their spouse in court. Inheritance rights. Housing rights. All sorts of stuff. For more benefits of legal marriage : http://www.cs.cmu.edu/afs/cs.cmu.edu/user/scotts/domestic-partners/mainpage.html

And Jon, I hadn’t meant to slam the institution of Christianity, but the bigotted leaders who preach hatred.

110

matt mcl–good point on pride parades. I still don’t like parades, but I can understand the pride better now.

aviddiva–classes start next week. The discussion has been interesting, but so far the non-biblical anti-gay arguments have not even been weak, they’ve been non-existent. The claims put forth wouldn’t stand up in a junior high school debate.
GLWasteful–thanks for addressing the OP, kind of got lost in there.

Robbnn–brain scans indicate that stright men and gay men have differently configured brains (don’t know if data has been collected on women). Second, babies and infants (and pubescent boys) generally go through a homoerotic phase. So, yes, there is proof for non-choice. Besides, in this society, who would CHOOSE to be gay??? (I think I’ll invite hatred, oppression, and ass-whuppings. Yep, I’ll become gay!!) Alternatively, if it were a choice, who would NOT be gay??? (Gee whiz, girls hate it when you fart and burp and they don’t like to play Nintendo. But my guy friends do! Great! I’ll just choose to be gay, and then we can fuck, too! Hurray!)
P.S. I guess that, like Queen Victoria, you don’t believe that there’s such a thing as lesbians?

Phaedrus–the Dept. of Justice’s most recent figures indicate that half of all domestic violence is caused by women. Battered men (and children) don’t speak out for the same reaons battered women don’t: fear, shame, lack of support systems, manipulations into feeling that they’re to blame, etc.

Bucky

111

You have had consensual, enjoyable sex, I imagine. Thus no tissue damage.

The quotation was from you, slightly edited. Sorry, I thought you’d get it, but I should have cited it anyway. Mea culpa.

My sex life is certainly none of your concern. Thanks for asking, though.

Unfortunately, my work ISP blocks me out of most of the links I have to information on the physiological effects of anal intercourse, so it’ll have to wait until I get home tonight. Unless you feel like doing some web browsing on your own.

-andros-

112

quote:
You seem to know a lot about this and I really haven’t studied it that much. So,
please? Reveal your source and answer the transmission question. Stats are and have
been confirmed that AIDS spread much more rapidly thru the gay community. The info
I have is came from dotors reports.

In the 70s and early 80s, when AIDS was being transmitted without control, it WAS spreading more rapidly in the gay communities. Two reasons for this. A.) Gay men are likely to not be having sex with women, therefore largely containing the transmissions and B.)AIDS is transmitted (as we all know) through bodily fluids. Now this gets dirty, so don’t read on unless you really want to know.

When a man with HIV has sex with anyone, male or female, the risk for infection of the partner is exponentally higher than when a woman with HIV has sex. The reason is mechanics. A man has a defacto seringe, filled with semen that has LOADS of the virus in it. A penis goes in an oriface, and injects this semen into the partner. A vagina is mucus membrane lined, which leads to easy entry into the body for the HIV virus. And as someone else posted, if there isn’t proper lubrication, anal sex can cause rips and tears in the anus, which also leaves the HIV virus a way to enter the system. Gay men were not using condoms back then: why should they? Not like the risk of pregnancy is high. And now that the gay community is all-too familiar with the dangers of unprotected sex, women are the most-at risk group, not gay men. As for sources, read “And the Band Played On.” I learned most of this stuff in my high school health class. Incidently, for those who think AIDS is over, it is reaching emergency security-danger levels in Africa. The UN Security Council is devoting discussion on what to do about it this week. AIDS isn’t over. But it is NOT a gay disease.

I’m honestly not this long-winded on the norm…

113

I’ll get to your transmission question presently.

114

LOL I should have known the quote was from a good source. :wink:

No, sometimes I am VERY dense and don’t get the joke.

I wasn’t trying to pry I just thought you might know from experience, if you did, it give your statements more weight than mine. I have never discussed matters like this with my gay friends. I thought they might think I 'm prying. They have never talked about it in front of me either so maybe they think it would offend me, I dunno.

I guess on this topic we just silently decided, don’t ask, don’t tell.

They “lock” you out? Bizzare, that seems archaic! Freedom of speech, man!
Thanks for answering, I’ll look around on my own too!

Ken :slight_smile:

115

Thank you for getting to it when you can. I read SwimmingRiddles and I can pretty much dismantle that argument with a couple of well placed questions. I look forward to your answer.

116

quote:
Thank you for getting to it when you can. I read SwimmingRiddles and I can pretty
much dismantle that argument with a couple of well placed questions. I look forward
to your answer.

So place them. Trust me, being a teenager in the middle of the AIDS epidemic in America, I got a LOT of education on the matter.

117

SwimmingRiddles:

“But it is NOT a gay disease”

I agree but they did help spread it in its first stages in the U.S.

It IS a disease that spreads among people who participate in promiscious sex and drug use involving needles though. I view the linkage the same as I do cancer and heart diease and smoking. Behavior can cause disease. Can it make it so you NEVER get the disease, no. But it can greatly reduce the risk. So if you are gay, don’t play around IF you want to decrease your chances, same with heteros, same with I.V. users. Don’t use the needle! It can kill ya! Will anything totally prevent you from getting AIDS? Yes, stop breathing.

118

SwimmingRiddles: You are new here. IF you want to remain liked and have fun it isn’t wise to start off on a bad foot, take it from one who knows. You said, “Be gentle” and that is what I intend to do. I am not going to argue the point with you.

:slight_smile:

Ken

119

Phaedrus, I would love to rebut your last post to me, but we are woefully off topic. I started a new thread on our discussion. You are very welcome to join the discussion already in progress.

120

Phaedrus:

SwimmingRiddles:

Phaedrus:

SwimmingRiddles made some good points in response to Phaedrus’ comments about gay men and AIDS transmission. I think it is ruder of Phaedrus to dismiss SwimmingRiddles as he/she did than for SwimmingRiddles to challenge him/her on the above claim.

If you’re “not going to argue the point,” than don’t bring it up in the first place.