[Charles Montgomery Burns]
Excellent
[/Charles Montgomery Burns]
I don’t get it.
Was I whooshed?
NOTE-Please don’t let this totally derail the thread
Nah. I just have a long memory for useless information. Maybe I should have provided a link.
In a thread on the weirdest food you’d ever eaten, Gobear mentioned this sushi experience. The octupus was taken out of the tank. One of its tentacles was removed, placed on a brick of rice, etc. The still-living octopus(septapus?) was put back in the tank. I am a carnivore. But this struck me as cruel.
G-d as revealed to me through personal experience doesn’t care what your sexual orientation is. But does care about causing an animal unnecessary pain.
Ugh - thanks. Sorry I asked!
Alright. I’m not going to argue anymore, and since all of you guys know I don’t hang around here 24/7, I’m just going to tell you the truth, and whether you accept it or not, or demand cites, whatever…
God DID put in all of us a desire to love and be loved. But He created sex for two people - a man and a woman - to have in a marital relationship. I don’t know what’s up with the “born gay” folks, but do what you want, you only have one life, and when you die we’ll all know what God intended. I’m content to find out 100% of everything then. No, I don’t know everything (DUH) and I DO NOT think I am superior to anyone. I don’t know why people think they are born gay. I don’t know every situation. Only God does. And He knows whether it is right or not. I, nor anyone else, can be the judge on who is right and wrong. God is our judge. He will not send you to hell JUST because you are gay… We are ALL sinners, and the only way we can get to heaven is to believe Jesus is our Savior. If we don’t we’re sent to hell. It’s not all just about gayness and sex.
There’s much more I want to say, but I can’t because people will find some way to disregard it or demand cites 
Ladies and Gentlemen, give it up for ElbaliavanU! Wasn’t she wonderul? The way she prevaricates, backpedals, and even pulls whole cloth out of thin air? Truly a marvel to behold.
Impervious to facts, oblivious to reason, her moral standards are a bulwark against compassion and humility, though they are sadly ineffective against hypocrisy.
Hopefully she’s better at following through on promises to exit from arguments than other posters of her ilk.
As to our demand that you back up your argument with actual facts, as opposed to your personal communication with whatever deity you happen to be communing with, well, we’re pretty proud of that around these parts. You may think it’s rude, but we think it’s the only thing that raises the quality of the arguments around here from “Did so! Did not!” to actual debate. If your argument doesn’t live up to that standard, perhaps you should consider, very seriously, the argument’s foundations. On what, specifically, do you base your opinion? If there are no facts behind it, and people keep telling you that you’re wrong, and producing facts which refute it, then maybe a rethinking is in order.
Ok, we’re ready…when are you going to tell us the truth?
You say you don’t know everything, yet you’ve said repeatedly that you know the truth. You say only God knows everything, but you purport to speak with His authority.
You are blinded by the box you’ve tried to place God in.
And Jesus wept (or at the very least went :smack: ).
Esprix
Yes, Esprix, He did go :smack:
Its right in Revelation 22:22.
God against homosexuality? What about, “Thy rod and thy staff, they comfort me”?
The Bible is cite enough for me, friend. But there are some problems with what you say that matter deeply to me, because they affect strongly people that I care deeply about, and might be such as to judge me as well.
Whether or not you choose to accept the statement, the fact is that the homosexual orientation is one that is not chosen but discovered by the person who has it. Now, knowing that God loves all men and desires not the death of a sinner, but that they may find Him and live, I’ve been forced to take a good hard look at what the Bible has to say about gay sex and what it does not say. And my conclusion is that God considers gratifying one’s lust by gay sex sinful, just as he considers gratifying one’s lust by straight sex sinful. But He does not condemn the people who He made or allowed to be gay, any more than He condemns the rest of us. Rather, He loves us and calls us to Himself.
If you would be so kind as to take off the Biblical blinders, you would see any number of posts on this board saying precisely the same thing, particularly by gay men and women. They fall in love and desire to live a happy married life with the person they fall in love with, just as you and I do. The difference is that the person they fall in love with ordinarily happens to be the same sex as themselves. I’ll refer you over to MPSIMS, where scott evil has announced his engagement to his boyfriend jeremy. I’ll point you to any number of threads where gobear has spoken of his spouse. And I’ll refer you to Skepto Lesbo, who rarely posts lately out of putting a commitment to her partner ahead of the enjoyment she gets from these boards.
I stand by the idea that if one believes in God and is not gay, the proper step in dealing with a gay person is to understand who they are, what motivates them, how they feel, and then deal with them according to the second half of Jesus’s Summary of the Law (Matt. 22:34-40, Mark 12:28-31, and Luke 10:25-28) and the New Commandment (John 15:22). The reason for this is that He will count how we behave towards them as how we behave towards Him Himself (Matt. 25:14-30), and not lay burdens on them that we do not have to bear (cf. Matt. 23:4-36).
If they sin, they sin out of love, whereas the sin that we commit in judging them as sinners is one based in hatred and rejection. The Jesus I know is much more inclined to forgive the former than the latter (see John 8:1-11).
You may do as you see right, and may God bless you in the doing of it. It took bravery to witness here, as I have reason to know. But as for me and my house, we will serve the Lord, and serve Him by speaking of His love for all men and women, without regard to race, creed, color, national origin, or sexual preference.
Could you please clarify this statment, Poly? Are you saying that Christian should abandon the Bible in favor people’s desires and feelings? Are you saying we should ignore what God’s word says about certain things if we don’t like it?
Your statement strikes me as rather odd. Take off the biblical blinders? Hmmm… Are people who believe what the Bible says about a particular issue blind? 
I mean, look at the world around you, and apply the truth of your faith to what you find in it, His. And my point to ElbaliavanU (did I spell that right?) was that gay people were not “choosing” to be gay nor elevating their sex life to the only thing important in their lives. “Blinders” are the black cards mounted on the sides of a horse’s head that keeps it focused on what’s ahead of him, e.g., during a race or in a parade, obscuring its peripheral vision; they are not things that cover one’s eyes entirely. And while one should be focused on God, one should also take into account the world in which one is to apply the teachings of Scripture, hence “take off the Biblical blinders” means “stop looking solely at the Bible and see the world in which God has placed you.”
You want to read the rest of that post now, and tell me where you disagree? (Though that may sound contentious, it’s meant seriously – if I can identify where we disagree from your response to that, I may have a better idea of how to carry out the task that God has given me – something I know you will support.)
Thanks for your clarification on that statement, Poly. That’s the only reason I posted in this thread. While I do support your wanting to carry out what you believe God wants you to do, you know that our stances on the subject of this thread differ greatly and won’t be reconciled so no point going there. Nor do I know that I can accept your statement that we should not look solely at the Bible but to see the world where God has place us. Depends on what you mean by that statement. What has the ultimate authority? What God says or what the world’s view is? In my view, we can’t change the word of God or interpret it differently just because of the modern society in which we live. That’s twisting the scripture to support what we want imho. It’s truth still is still applicable today, just as 50 or 100 years ago. Now for two people to agree on what it teaches is sometimes another story. 
I’d rather listen to the still small voice, personally. But then, I don’t believe that God stopped speaking after the Bible was written.
That is what the Reader’s Digest calls a “Quotable Quote” if I’m not very much mistaken. A very nice summary of arguments, Polycarp.
I’ll have you know, Poly, that the other day, volunteering at the local GLBT community center, I interrupted a person who was engaged in putting down Christians, angered by what they saw as Christianity’s continued persecution of gay people. I pointed out that judging all Christians by the worst examples of Christianity was as bad as their judgement of us, and that if we end the hatred of gays in this country at the expense of increasing hatred towards religious people, we’ve gained nothing.
I just want you to know that what you say, how you treat people, who you are… it’s affected me, and how I see people, and how I see religion. In as much as I can make a difference in these things, you’ve made a difference.
Thank you.
[quote]
In my view, we can’t change the word of God or interpret it differently just because of the modern society in which we live. That’s twisting the scripture to support what we want imho. It’s truth still is still applicable today, just as 50 or 100 years ago. Now for two people to agree on what it teaches is sometimes another story.
I would strongly urge you, Hi to read that last sentence and think about it. It negates everything you have ever said about the inflexibility of “God’s word.”
Now maybe after I die your deity will toss me into his private torture chamber where he can torment me for all eternity. Frankly, any god that wants to inflict eternal punishment for loving a man is nothing more than a sadist unworthy of worship. Certainly He has no moral code worthy of the name.
I used to be angry at you, His, but now all I feel is sadness and compassion. It’s obvious you’ve got your issues with love and it’s painfully clear that you live a cramped, narrow, joyless life. I wish you could be a happier person.
Besides, why would I want to go to your heaven? Who wants to spend eternity sipping cold gruel at an everlasting church service with a bunch of pious clodhoppers whose idea of recreational reading is Reader’s Digest Condensed Books?
Me, I want to my spend my apres-vie where the gin is cold and the jazz is hot. I want to hang out with the great gay (and therefore damned by your standards) artists, writers, and teachers. I’m going to be hanging out with Shakespeare, Kit Marlowe, Cole Porter, Michaelangelo, Leonardo da Vinci, Oscar Wilde, Noel Coward, Marcel Proust, Virginia Woolf, Andre Gide, Jean Cocteau, Aubrey Beardsley, Rupert Brooke, Socrates, and Plato, to name only a few gay celebrities (I know you’ve never heard of any of these people, but trust me, they’re famous.).
Right now, it’s 1:08 am, and my partner wants me to come to bed, not because we’re horny, because we are both way too tired. He wants me beside him because he sleeps better when I’m next to him. He loves me and I love him. We cuddle on the couch and watch “Sex and the City” while we sip Merlot spritzers. We go to the theater; we play with our cats, we shop, we cook, we pay bills. We have a life together.
If you could know some of the happiness we have, then you might find other, worthier causes to pursue.
Zoe asks:
“What does the Catholic Church teach about sex for people who cannot have children?“
I am speaking as a postgraduate Catholic (an apostate? quite close). Human sexuality has a dual objective, namely, in the order of importance: for procreation and relief of libido. Ideally it seems to me in my years of Catholic instructions in the university, every sex act should not be done with the explicit exclusion of the procreation objective; if procreation is not possible then libido is all right for the couple. Should you ask me for my present view, I would agree with Bryan that Catholic sex teachings are nutty; one answer opens up more questions than the one intended to be solved.
Susma Rio Sep
Wow - you read the original Bible in its original language, no translation? That’s pretty impressive!
Esprix