House Passes the Anti-Heretic and Infidel Association Act?!?!?!

I really hope this is some sort of bad joke. Apparently, the government is passing/attempting to pass laws that allow religious discrimination for certain organizations in regards to who they hire/fire. They claim that Bush issued an executive order authorizing federal agencies to discriminate against Jews. Check this out:

Is this shit real? If so, I have not been quite so disgusted for quite a long time. I really hope this one gets debunked.

DaLovin’ Dj

I’m having trouble finding any language in the bill itself that suggests this is true, although I must admit I keep glazing over.

Detail is pretty scant in the link.

Here’s a link to the Head Start Act, or at least to a cached version. (Site seems to be down.)

Yeah, I have trouble reading through the the two links (School Readiness Act & Workforce Reinvestment and Adult Education Act) as well. Legaleese just doesn’t compute with a quick read. I wish they would have quoted the pertinent parts.

DaLovin’ Dj

Here is another article on the subject. I am slightly comforted by this quote at the end:

But I’m still shocked that any of this is real.

I’m about half-way through the bill, and so far the only thing that leaps out at me is that the word “community” is being amended to “any community-based and faith-based organizations.” So perhaps the fear is that a Christian organization could say, “Sorry, Mr. Jew, you may be otherwise qualified to teach, but we’re Christians here” and still get federal funding.

I wonder if there are pertinent parts?

It’s pretty common for opponents of legislation to make unsupportable characterizations of its implications, depending on their audience’s assumed laziness.

Here’s a real common claim about a currently proposed ammendment:

People work very hard at spreading this meme, in spite of the fact that the legislation the bill would amend says very clearly:

My general rule of thumb for this sort of thing is, if they don’t offer anything more than a blind assertion up front, chances are it’s a load of horse hockey.

Googling for “Head Start” + “Discrimination”, produced mainly somewhat manky-looking sites, none of which seem to quote any relevant language. The most solid-looking one is probably this MSNBC article. They only go so far as to say “Democrats say the bill allows religious discrimination in hiring.”

I’d like to see some real poop.

There are already employers permitted to refuse to hire practicing, religious Jews for some jobs. And there are already employers permitted to only hire practicing, religious Jews for some jobs.

Did the OP find the site from which the quote came to be credible, even-handed, and worthy of trust?

  • Rick

The linked article is a bunch of alarmist nonsense. Religious organizations are already exempt from Civil Rights requirements regarding religion in most circumstances; this is nothing new. The real culprit here is that religious organizations receive any government funding at all.

Its all bluster, smoke and mirrors. The Bushiviks need to reassure the Religious Right, and for the most part, they can’t deliver on thier promises. Whats driving those folks nuts is the 20 odd years of social change as regards abortion, gay rights, etc. etc. The Bushiviks keep them in line and voting by promising to roll that back, which is simply not possible. So they’re left with window dressing type of programs, and blaming the Libruhls for thwarting God’s will.

The fragile hope nurtured in thier withered bosom was to dump social aid programs off onto the churches, with some smatterings of assistance from the ever-shrinking Gummint. But if you think some Methodist Republican is going to sit down and write a check to the Nation of Islam, you’re outa yer cotton-pickin’ mind!

I see that so many are interested in this and wondering if it’s true or whether it’s nothing new.

To get the details, you need to look at 42 U.S.C. 9849 and the exemption to it authorized by H.R. 2201. 9849 says that federal dollars do not go to organizations that discriminate on the basis of race, creed, etc. 2201 says that 9849 does not apply.

The reason you don’t see any specific wording of it in the bill for the School Readiness Act is because most of that act talks about modifications to existing law.

Your best bet, if you want to see whether this is true or not, is to read some reputable newspaper articles. Here’s a link to one from the New York Times (and no, it wasn’t written by Jayson Blair):


Sorry, nothing to add but thats a hell of a good first post. Thanks LyricalReckoner. Welcome aboard!

Welcome, LyricalReckoner. Congratulations on your brilliant first strides at fighting ignorance!

Now, wait a minute. Once you check my stuff out, you might not be so complimentary. I mean . . . a lot of folks wish I’d just shut up.

Why? Because I focus on religion. I point out things like . . . someone will say that God can do anything . . . and so I ask . . . well, can this god make a rock so big that he can’t pick it up? Most people find that rude. They don’t like to consider that the ability to do anything is a pretty silly notion. It’s much more comfortable to believe without thinking about what you believe . . . at least, that’s the way it is for so many of us.

I write a monthly column on Religion in the News. Here’s the link to it if you care to check it out:

(Bolding mine)

Why the switch to ‘Bushiviks’? I was just starting to like ‘Bushista’!


  1. Welcome
  2. You’ll have to do better than that giant rock question if you expect to stand up to the theological brilliance of Polycarp.
  3. Your degree in Mathematics and your teaching experience in linear algebra and computer graphics scarcely argue against your mother’s astrological prediction that you’d be a geometry teacher.
  4. Excellent first name and a nice story. Sounds like I’d’ve liked your mom, the wiseass.


Welcome aBoard. I’d do a search in Great Debates before you start such threads - there have been dozens of them. You’ll also find that we are fortunate to have many sophisticated religious folk here who hold their own pretty effectively.

The real question is Can this god make a burrito so big even he can’t eat it? And if that starts to bore you try giving logical proofs (of god where god is not “God”) a whirl. Theology and philosophy are discussed in depth in the Great Debates forum all of the time. I’ve never seen another place with such consistently high levels of quality discourse, debate, and knowledge. Enjoy, and welcome.

Re the OP:
It seems like this is for real. I agree that religious/“faith based” organizations recieving tax dollars absolutely blows, particularly when they are allowed to discriminate. I find it disgusting. Justifications for giving cash to faith based organizations (ones which claim that it is not state supported religion) look like outright lies when they also try to wrap it up with giving people the ability to spend our cash on the only religion of their choosing. Something tells me even if this goes through we’ll never see a government check issued to a Muslim headstart program. It is hypocritical and so I say fuck the politicians who are trying to make this a “Christian” country. It is a free country and I don’t want any religion in my government, and I damn sure don’t want one cent of any taxes that I pay to be used to bolster, support, or endorse any particular religion. I’m rooting for a nice filibuster. Go to whatever church you want, pray as often as you want, believe whatever you want, but respect the freedom of religion this country guarantees and keep that shit out of government programs, buildings, and spending.

DaLovin’ Dj

Thanks, LyricalReckoner– the specifics you provided made it a lot easier to find the contentious part of 2210:

I also figured out why we were having such difficulty finding the wording before:

The link that we were looking at, (taken from the link in the OP,) actually omits that part. I’m not sure exactly why they left out the bit that is at the center of the controversy, although I’m tempted to believe that it may have something to do with them leaning ever so slightly to the right, editorially. Remember kids, choose your cites carefully! (This directed at the absent blogger more than dalovindj.)

My condolences to the American people for the passage of this execrable bill in the House of Representatives. Give your senators an earful before they vote in September!

Heh… Now I notice that our “absent” blogger is LyricalReckoner.

Allow me to offer another voice in the chorus of “welcome.”

(But seriously, change that link if you don’t want to leave people scratching their heads.)

Here’s a pdf file from the horse’s mouth, and Google’s html version of it. :smiley:

Stick around!