New Yorkers are actually pretty nice. It’s just that we are usually going somewhere in a hurry and don’t have time to talk to the 10,000 people we see on the way. Because of that, we generally view it as odd when someone starts talking to us out of the blue. Also, you aren’t supposed to look at anyone.
That reminds me of a little anecdote…
I was in NYC for the first time, visiting friends. My then GF (now my wife) and I were on the subway platform, looking at an about-to-depart train, wondering if it was the one we needed. The doors had closed. The driver stuck his head out the window and asked “Hey, you lost? Where you going?” We told him and he said “Yeah, this is the one.”, then opened the doors and let us on. Being used to the Metro in DC, I was absolutely flabbergasted.
I don’t know, but my coment about by definition is due to the Mason-Dixon line being the geographical separator between the North and the South, and that is the Northern border of Maryland. As far as I can tell the Eastern Shore is the most rural and Southern acting part of Maryland. Having spent many summers in the South as a girl though, I know they don’t act Southern in the same shared manner that people from Arkansas, Texas, and Louisiana acted toward me. Marylanders lacked the civility I expect in the South. Also, the the most casually, openly, and crudely racist people I have ever met were Marylanders.
I meant “can’t”. I asked for more detail in the course of the conversation. All I got out of it was just that such snubbing was something of a form of social suicide, and that’s just the way it was. I’m sure it’s not something that can be explained logically, anyway.
You’re right; I should have added more detail. On my average day a trip to the store is 1-3 blocks depending on what I’m after. I’ll encounter on average 5 or so people in said trip. At least half my greetings would be of the non-verbal type as described by Askia kind of a nod and a “wassup” then chit-chat with the counter person. If I happen across someone of a different race (I live in one of the most diverse neighborhoods in Oakland) it’ll more likely be a quick “hello” or “hi”.
If I’m on my biweekly trip to the bookstore that rule goes out the window. The bookstore is downtown where to loosely quote Redd Foxx ‘I’ll see enough black folk to make a Tarzan movie’ in such a situation even a quick nod isn’t very practical. Once inside the bookstore, I’ll revert back to quick greetings or more chit chat if I happen to be sharing an isle with someone with a similar taste in books. Make sense?
I don’t consider Maryland or Delaware to be in the South, but if if my ancestors had been enslaved there because of their skin color, I might consider another definition of South other than Mason-Dixon’s line or whether they fought for the Union. 
The whole being verbally greeted by people thing surprises me as well, So much so that by the time I get over the shock, process what they said, and get my voice engaged the time has passed by.
I grew up in the Mountain West; Colorado, Wyoming. It was one of the unwritten cultural things that it was somewhat to waste words. Women would greet each other with conversations, but men didn’t. A polite nod of acknowledgement, but no stopping. And if two guys were forced to interact because their wives had stopped for a conversation you had a classic converstaion like this.
guy1: /nods
guy2: /nods
both look around impatiently for 2 minutes.
Guy1: Might rain.
Guy 2 yep.
Three more minutes standing around importantly.
Guy2: New truck?
guy1: Nope, just got it repainted.
5 more minutes
Guy1: Havn’t seen Jack in a while.
Guy2: Dead
Guy1: /understanding nod.
At which point they have to start herding their wives away from each other before people might think their Californian.
So a guy greeting me is just a shock, and if a chick wants a random meeting conversation, she should just realize from my curt one word answers that I have to go do something manly and have no time to waste 
That sentence actually means something when I include the key word.
Hey, we understand…you’re just too busy doing something manly to include unnecessary verbage. It’s all implied.
/nods head, gets in truck, goes off to shoot some small furry thing for breakfast
Stranger
I usually smile or say hello when I meet someone’s eyes. Even if that person is a stranger. White or black. In Miami people tend to avert their eyes away from strangers’ faces, but occassionally I’ll see someone who’s not afraid to look at me and we will greet each other either verbally or non-verbally. I like this.
I admit that if I see a person and he/she does not reciprocate my acknowledgement, it stings. And for some reason it stings more if this person is a black person and we are the only two black folk around. But I don’t judge a person harshly if they leave me hanging, so to speak, unless that person is someone I see often. If I bump into you enough for you to recognize my face and mine yours, I eventually expect there to be some acknowledgement of this fact. I don’t like feeling invisible. And when I encounter “regulars” who don’t even smile at me when I smile back, I feel worse than invisible. I feel disrespected, like that person thinks I’m not worthy.
I think a lot of black people are sensitive to disrespectful behavior. Maybe it’s insecurity…I don’t know.
For what it’s worth, I’m a very shy person. I can say “Hello, how you doin’?” to stranger, but beyond that I want to run away.
I have a black neighbor who shops where I do. I didn’t know his name nor he mine, we just said one word, “Hi”, when we’d passed previously on the sidewalk.
So anyway in the store he spots me first and instead of saying Hi he says “What, I’m not good enough to talk to?” That was when I first noticed him.
I replied, seriously, “Have we met?” I ddin’t remember him right away. He threw a fit and I ran away. The next few times I saw him on the sidewalk I crossed the street. He still creeps me out.
Ha, he told me about that! Now we all hate you!
Bwah ha ha ha ha!
Several people have mentioned not knowing what to do when someone refuses to acknowledge you on the street when you say hi. Try what I do, say in a cheery and slightly louder than normal voice, “Yeah, I understand, I think ignoring me is probably the best way to go.”
I’d agree with this. I lived in Texas during my HS and college years, and lived in a predominantly Latino and Black community. Generally, you acknowledge the presence of a brotha/sista whether you know them or not. If you do not - you have transgressed a major social rule and people will see you as “uppity.”
We used to do an orientation session for students of color at the University of Texas. Invariably, the question would come from the crowd - “Why don’t Black people talk to each other here?” My experience was that a), I ended up knowing most of the Black folks at school, either personally, through reputation, or just seeing them around, so it would be rude not to acknowledge them (or for them to acknowledge me) as we pass. B), some Black folks were just unfriendly or unfamiliar with this cultural norm, so I’d let it go. I still do that to this day, especially when I’m in an environment where that Black person and I are clearly in the minority.
I think there is a split second when you make eye contact with another person and you can tell by their expression whether they are likely to respond. You notice each other and give a nod or a smile. Sometimes people avert their gaze, or look preoccupied (cell phones are doing a great deal to kill this tradition). But I’d say 80 percent of the time I get the nod and the “hi,” “what’s up,” or “how ya doing?” (I should also point out that I work in academia, in predominantly White institutions, where it is abundantly clear that there are few people of color present.)
I’d also add that the class thing that Askia (great response, btw, I agree with all you said brotha) mentioned is huge. I was a summer school principal at a school in a Black community a few years ago. The teaching program brought in top-notch college grads from across the country - in fact, a large number were from Northeast elite schools - and were overwhelmingly white (80% of the 64, I’d say). The first thing I did when “taking the reins” from the school year principal (Black woman) was to do the rounds of meeting the staff, from custodians to cafeteria workers to the teachers. I always made sure I greeted them in the morning by name and with a wave, even if they didn’t respond or appear to have seen me.
A few weeks later, one of the school-year teachers caught me in the hallway and told me that the new teachers were creating a bad impression because the vast majority of them did not acknowledge the “regular” teachers as they trundled in the building at 7:30 am. Now, as I live in New England, I’ve become familiar with the “don’t say hi to me until I have my coffee” attitude that a lot of folks up here, and I will say in my experience, they tend to be White. I believe a large number of the teachers had this mindset, so in our school meeting that afternoon I mentioned to them that in a Black Texas community, verbal acknowledgement of people in the community is the only way to gain their respect. A few days later that same teacher told me that she thought that the new teachers were doing a great job, were friendly, etc. The new teachers had always been courteous in their one-on-one interactions but acknowledging and greeting the mostly Black, all female teaching staff paid off in general goodwill about our program.
I would also add that among my circle of Black friends (yes, we’ve had this conversation many times) the one that grew up in the 'hood or “'round the way,” or experienced what we call “home training” or “knowing how to act” tend to be the ones to initiate, respond to, and become offended if they are not spoken to. Black folks from environments where they were the only family in a community, for instance, tend to be unaware of this, or learned it later in life, usually after a bad experience of being perceived as stuck-up.
The Black-White dynamic is a little different, though. Personally, I wouldn’t necessarily expect a White person to give me eye contact and a head nod, and I wouldn’t likely initiate it unless I knew them (by look). However, if I noticed a White person greeting other people they didn’t know and then ignoring me, I would think that person might harbor some racism - or was just plain rude. I don’t expect White folks to know how Black folks act in that situation! (Well, not in Boston, anyway…)
carnivorousplant writes:
> Did slavery continue to be legal in Maryland during the Civil War as it
> was in Delaware?
We’re discussing culture in this thread, not history. Culturally, most of Maryland and a little bit of Virginia are more like the Northeast than like the South, while some of the Eastern Shore and Southern Maryland are more like the South. Incidentally, in my opinion the best book on the true cultural divisions of North America is The Nine Nations of North America by Joel Garreau. If you Google on that title and name, you’ll find a website for the book which gives a map with Garreau’s division of all of North America into nine socio-economic/cultural regions which are better explanations of current culture than historic or political divisions.
What Wendell’s Talking About. I think I’ve found my daddy’s birthday present.
Wikipedia map of the Nine Nations. Wiki has everything these days.
Who know? I’m living’ in da Islands, mon!
And a digression as to how one defines regions such as North and South.
Thanks!