How do I professionally phrase "shut up and do what I'm hiring you to do"?

Fair warning; this thread is about equal parts rant and question. For those not interested in hearing about my woes, skip to the paragraph above the quote tag for the actual point. :slight_smile:

I occasionally hire people via sites such as ODesk and Rent-A-Coder to perform one-off tasks. Over time, I’ve come to dread doing this, because every project more complex than “change A to B” results in the same problem when selecting a bidder. Doomed effort though it may be, I’m looking for a way to head this off at the pass whenever possible.

Essentially, it seems that nobody is much interested in completing any given project in the manner specified the project description. My bid requests almost always include very specific requirements for how the project must be done; these requirements might be (usually are) counterintuitive on their face, but in each case I have my reasons for requesting that it be done in that manner. Inevitably, bidders will design a “solution” that achieves the same end result, but completely ignores the method requirements.

For (fictional and oversimplified) example, let’s say I request a program that reads a Word document one character at a time, copies each character, and pastes it sequentially into a new, blank Word document, unless that character is a capital D. I state very specifically in my requirements that that’s what the program must do; ambiguity, in other words, is not the issue. Without fail, the bidder will note that the end result is a copy of the document with all instances of ‘D’ removed, write a program that does that instead, and try to claim that the project is completed. What the bidder doesn’t understand is that I have a process that I intend to use in tandem with this program that [seventeen pages of unnecessary and none-of-the-bidder’s-business-anyway explanation snipped] and thus requires the new document to be created one character at a time.

For a real-life example, see this thread. The “other boards” I mention that I’ve asked are actually contractors I tried to hire; I was ashamed to admit that at the time. The thread also contains a pretty good example of the sort of lengthy explanation for my requirements which I see no reason to provide to a one-off contractor. I went through five coders — bid accepted, money escrowed, failed solution, polite correction, refusal on the coder’s part to complete the project as originally described, formal dispute, full refund (every time; again, my descriptions are not unclear) — before finally accepting that I apparently could not give people money to actually do as I asked.

Currently, the only way I can avoid this is to go through a fifteen-round song and dance routine with each bidder before accepting their bid (Have you read the description; have you REALLY read the description; state the purpose and method of the project to me in your own words; please post something that indicates that you have actually read the description; can you complete the project exactly according to the description that you’ve now claimed five times to have read and understood, etc, etc).

What I’m looking for in this thread, besides an opportunity to vent my frustration (thanks for reading), is a well-phrased piece of boilerplate to add to each project description that states, as professionally yet unambiguously as possible, the following sentiment.

I don’t want to it come off as adversarial (hence the need for just a tad bit of a rewrite to the above), but I do want it clear that I will not tolerate the deliberate ignoring of my requirements. So…any suggestions?

Yeah. Don’t use ODesk and Rent-a-Coder.

I’m a professional developer; so is my husband. We’re both self-employed, and at times have had free time to take on one-off tasks. I’ve looked at ODesk and Rent-a-Coder as potential sites for finding work.

ODesk is a joke; the amount of crappy spyware they want me to run while working for them is completely unacceptable. Something that takes pictures of my screen every 15 minutes is not something that a professional programmer wants to run - what if I get a confidential email from another client? Not to mention the whole issue of trust. If someone wants to hire me, I will prove I can do the work by… doing the work, in a reasonable time, for a reasonable amount of money, and with good quality. You don’t have to spy on me to make sure I’m really, truly working.

Rent-a-Coder doesn’t have that kind of spyware (or at least didn’t, last time I looked) but it seemed to cater to students and other non-professional coders.

Unfortunately I don’t have any other suggestions as to where to find coders; the best work I’ve found is through word of mouth and networking with people I’ve worked with in the past.

I like it just the way it is. :smiley:

ETA: If you’re willing to fly my brother-in-law in, he might submit a bid for you. He’s a very bright guy, and he gets how to listen to a customer (as far as I know). He’d probably appreciate that description. :slight_smile:

See, the thing is, I’m perfectly happy with the work I get from RAC coders when I finally find one that doesn’t ignore me…and I know that they cater to a less-than-top-notch brand of worker, which is precisely why I use them, because I neither need nor want to be paying some Comp Sci MS $250/hr for a one-off program to make Flash buttons that play noises. There have been maybe two RAC projects I’ve ever paid over $100 for; I’m never asking for the world, just piddly little apps to do some whatzamajigger that I want done. Most of it is stuff I could do myself if I had the time.

What I’m looking for here is a bit of language that I can put at the beginning of each bid request that (metaphorically) says in bold flashing letters “DO NOT IGNORE ME”, while also NOT saying “I am a huge flaming asshole who will disapprove of anything you could possibly give me” (because I’m not and I won’t). It won’t solve the problem entirely, I know, but if it got even one bidder to say “huh, maybe I should actually read the project requirements”, it’d be worthwhile. If nothing else, it’d give me something else to point at during the inevitable argument.

I get it; you want reading comprehension!

I got nothing for you. I’ve dealt with very high level people in very big companies quite a bit at my various gigs, and the ability to read an email with more than one question in it and respond to all of it is something I’ve only rarely seen. Read a proposal and follow the directions the first time around, without multiple emails/calls/etc where you say the same thing ten times? Heh, good luck.

I’ve learned to write simple emails, with one question per email, and preferably no more than 3 or 4 sentences in the email. If I have two questions, I send two emails. When I find someone who can read multiple paragraphs and understand them all - much less follow the directions in them - that person is my friend for life.

Oh, and as a side note, Athena, RAC recently added the option for the buyer to pay the coder by the hour instead of a lump payment for deliverables, and it works as you describe…screenshot every few minutes, and so on. Being an amateur developer myself (well, I suppose I’m a “professional” in the sense that my day job pays me to program, but I wouldn’t call myself a true dev), I do the occasional RAC project for extra cash, and I refuse to bid on projects where the buyer selects that option, for the same reasons you do.

A little less sarcasm, a lot less aggressive, and perhaps an easy to understand analogy might go a long way. But, your disclaimer as presented at the very least (IMO) makes it very clear what you don’t want. Maybe you should post it on oDesk for one of the copy writers to fix up for you? :stuck_out_tongue:

oDesk only requires the software/screenshots for hourly projects, presumably as a trade-off to the fact that hourly work is guaranteed by escrow, while flat-rate is not. Also, regarding your privacy concern, as a provider you have the option to review your screenshots and remove any you like. I had this happen the first time I used the hourly software, and was able to remove the screenshot almost immediately after it happened.

I have no experience with RAC, but upon preview I see they’ve recently followed suit.

What about some sort of disclaimer in the contract language that failure to comply* exactly* with specifications outlined will result in nonpayment?

Better yet, about about a penalty for noncompliance? My former company used to tie themselves in knots to avoid performance standards penalties. If the contractor fails to comply precisely with specifications, they owe you money.

Do you think something like that would send the proper message?

It’s been years since I looked at oDesk, so it’s quite possible that feature wasn’t there or I missed it.

Regardless, I have plenty of work that doesn’t require me to install any sort of spylike software, and I’d have to be MUCH more needy to want to work with a company that required it.

Probably just as likely that the option wasn’t there then, and has since been added due to community feedback. There is plenty of non-hourly work available there; I’ve been using it fairly regularly for about 18 months and have take on hourly work less than half a dozen times.

At the risk of further hijacking the thread, my real complaint about oDesk is that the obscenely high Provider:Buyer ratio forces the rates on most projects below minimum wage. But, on days when it’s either low-paying work or no work at all, what can you do!

Buried deep in your project description, you should place a single line saying that the coder must place a bowl of brown M&M’s on your desk on the first day of the project. Then if you don’t see your M&M’s on that first day, start looking for another coder.

Ummm…
Let me get this straight - if you pay me by the hour, you Really want me to PROVE that I am actually working, and not playing games? And I HAVE to submit screenshots EVERY F*****G 15 MINUTES?!
I slung code (and requirements, proposale, RFP’s, configuration management, et. al) for over 20 years. That is the absolute most insane and offensive requirement of which I have ever heard. If you can’t trust me, don’t hire me. We both have better things to do than play with screenshots all day.
As far as people not performing to micro-management level, well, there is another reason I’m glad I’m not in that bizarre corner of the market.

Just for giggles - if/when you want to take a chance and trust an hourly - how much do you expect to pay the agency for that coder’s time?

Notice the mention of working on proposals? I did that for a contract shop (we did what your agencies do, but we were grown ups and worked without spyware). When we got a RFP which demanded a fixed price, you can believe we came up with a number which guaranteed our profit, even if the boss wanted to not only tell us what/when/where but friggin’ HOW to write a program.

I suggest you pay real money, get real professionals and then you can micro-manage all you want. Contractor’s mantra: It all pays the same.

You want to get your point across, try this:
Top of Scope section (you do have a Scope section, right?) put this:



*************** WARNING **************

I micro-manage all my projects. This one is no different. 
The persons hired will be required to follow my micro-instructions, 
including fundamental program design. 
I expect the work to be done according to instructions - your professional opinions are of no interest to me. 
I'm paying, you work. Period.
If your coders want to be creative, they do so on somebody else's dime.
If you cannot provide what are known as "head down coders", 
please do not waste any more of your time or mine - simply discard this Proposal.
An email to me at 
managerfromhell @ yourworstnightmare.com 
informing me that you will not be responding to this Proposal would be appreciated


Do you tell the bidders this?

As in:
“Please note: This program will run in tandem with another process that requires the new document to be created one letter at a time. Therefore, the program MUST perform exactly as specified.”

In other words, you don’t have to tell them what the other process is, but you should give them some general idea of why the end result is less important than the process by which it gets there.

Maybe even that is none of their business.

p.s. -

I had the misfortune to, on two occasions, work for people who really, really thought their mastery of FORTRAN (it looks a lot like BASIC) 20 years earlier (or equally impressive qualifications) made them qualified to specify how. It met the design demands - it didn’t work (as I told the moron at the start), but it avoided using the feature of th language DESIGNED to do what he wanted - because FORTRAN genius didn’t have a clue what/how CICS task/trigger processing worked.

Oh, yeah… these two actually thought they could do a better job of the work, but were too busy and/or important to do so.
That attitude is soooo charming…

p.s. - one jumped ship in time, the other actually had no clue what was going on. Until they canned the moron’s ass.

Roland, welcome to the wonderful world of subcontractors.

Seriously though, it’s not the coding skill you really pay for - ultimately, that kind of thing can be learned by any halfway-bright human being. BUt things like listening skills and honesty? Priceless.

usedtobe, please calm down and read the thread again. I pay for deliverables, and I refuse to get involved with that by-the-hour screenshot business. That was brought up by Athena as an example of why she doesn’t like working for oDesk. I’ll delay my response to your insults until after I’m sure we’re on the same page, if you still feel the same way at that point.

Green Bean, I’ve tried that in the past, but all it’s ever led to is demands for greater specifics until I hit something that I either can’t reveal, is too complicated to explain, or both. I do add a generic line that I have reasons for being so specific in my requirements that I can’t disclose, but that doesn’t seem to make much difference, hence my desire for a more strongly-worded version of same.

It seems like the best way to head this off is to explain upfront that you need it done this way for a REASON. You don’t have to explain the reason in detail (or at all, really), as long as you make it clear that a reason exists. Tell them in the bid request not to try to simplify or alter it, just say you need it done THIS WAY, and that you don’t want them to change it.

This sounds right to me. These sites are about contracts for money. Don’t follow the contract, don’t get the money. "This proposal is for a job that is to be done in the following manner: XYZ. Completing the task in this manner is imperative and deviations will not be accepted. If the job is not done in this manner is it not completed and you will not be compensated. "

usedtobe: Roland isn’t asking for hourly screen-shot work. He’s not even looking to micromanage - he just needs the right thing produced in the right way. The screen shot thing is an optional feature of the types of services he is employing and he has agreed that he hates the screen shot feature and won’t use it as a coder or a buyer.