Gosh, it’s really hard to tell here who knows what the state of the law is. Should I pay attention to Bricker, who not only went to school to learn law stuff, but actually practiced in the field of criminal law for years? Or SHAKES, who is related to some cops and has watched episodes of Cops on TV?
Sorry, Bricker. I mean, maybe if you posted that you watched a lot of Law and Order or something, but SHAKES has it all over you.
Well, ok Champion I can take this to the other extreme from my own personal experience.
I’ve been caught as a teenager with small amounts of pot IN my car. Not just once, not just twice, but MANY times. I even got caught once with a piple AND pot.
Not once did the cop ever haul my teenaged ass off to jail. The most they ever did is make me dump the pot on the ground and sent me on my merry way.
For the OP to worry that he might get into some serious doo-doo over a joint being passed around in a car that wasn’t even his (the car) to begin with, is as some one has stated before: being slightly hyper-sensitive.
I mean I can just picture it now:
“So what are you in for?”
“I was in a car where people were smoking pot but not me…”
"OH really? That’s weird because I’m in here for ripping that tag off my bed mattress… Who would’a thought? "
Meanwhile back in the city; Johny-Crack-dealer still walks the streets selling crack to America’s young boys and girls…*
Man, SHAKES, your ignorance is staggering, or maybe it’s just a few brain cells you’ve dulled from smoking a lot. A lot of people stand to lose their jobs – and worse – if they’re even seen *in the viscinity * of pot or pot smokers, and it behooves those people to want nothing to do with it. It’s a stupid risk to take and a stupid way to get in trouble, and most importantly, people DO get in trouble for it… innocent people in similar situations to what we’ve been discussing. I work with cops, lawyers, judges, and interned in the country’s first and largest Drug Court, so I’ve seen it go down. If you want to smoke, that’s all well and good, but don’t act like other people are wrong or weird or hypersensitive for not wanting anything to do with it… or you.
Well, there are two questions: what the state of the law is (theory) and what, actually, law enforcement will do (practice). Bricker gave a good theoretical legal analysis (which I have no reason to doubt).
But Bricker didn’t speak about what cops would actually do if they stopped a car where a joint was being passed around. In that case, the best perspective isn’t a lawyer, but a cop. So perhaps I’ll listen to SHAKES on that (not as the absolute answer, but certainly as one data point).
Herein is demonstrated one of the cruelist aspects of the marijuana laws, and one of the strongest arguements for the laws to change.
He’s right, I know people who have had a similar experience, cop stops car, dumps the bud, wags his finger, gives teenagers what for, and sends them on their merry way.
The point is that another cop you encounter, could enforce the letter of the law and rain down the consequences as laid out by others here.
That the law is enforced without consistency is one of the reasons it should be changed. Some kids are getting let off, repeatedly. Some other teenager is suffering severe consequences. 'Taint right.
That just cries for you to break out the vacuum cleaner!
The other option- a well-timed sneeze would just scatter the offending substance & enable him to leave & call the cops on you. “They started doing lines in front of me, then someone sneezed! You can collect the evidence with a feather duster!”
Now my answer to the OP-
I was in the car with some friends. One handed me an unlit joint by surprise. I tossed it back at him so he had to search for it once the car was parked & joked that at least I didn’t toss it out the window.
I visited an long-time galpal from college, every day her drug buddies would come over & I’d take a stroll throughout the neighborhood. There was a used bookstore around the block.
I bought more books than necessary that week!
Btw, years later after she stopped doing drugs, she & I tried to get a romance going twice (once in 2000, once in 2003)- her boozing aborted both attempts.
Good luck… you’ll need it. The experiences I’ve heard about line up with Bricker’s much more than SHAKES. Things will depend on the mood of the officer, and I’m sorry… I’m not counting on a cop being in a good mood for me not to go to jail.
Back in my late teenage years, my circle of friends got rather seriously into cannabis (not in the sense that they were necessarily addicted, but in the sense that they weren’t ever interested in much except staying in and getting very stoned).
I tried going along with it all, but it only ever made me feel terribly ill - I was a tobacco smoker at the time - it wasn’t the smoking that was making me ill, but the physical and psychological effects of the drug. Eventually (after an unreasonably long time, in fact), I decided I just wouldn’t smoke the stuff any more and I would take along a couple of cans of beer instead; I experienced quite a lot of social pressure and open persuasion to conform with the group, as well as a fair amount of disdain for my (very moderate) consumption of alcohol (apparently, alcohol was perceived as somehow brutish, whereas pot was sophisticated). Despite my repeated explanation that I was fine, thanks and I really just didn’t enjoy smoking dope, it was pretty clear they felt I was being judgmental or puritanical.
Anyway, I eventually came to the conclusion that if this group valued my conformity with their choice of behaviour over and above my personal comfort, they weren’t really my friends at all. I slipped quietly away and never saw them again; I don’t expect I was missed all that much.
Well, this has actually happened to me, although it was many years ago. Eventually, I was not charged with anything and released…the next morning after spending the night in jail.
They served me a bologna (I think that’s what it was) sandwich, tea, and some oatmeal. Big fun was had by all (not).
I think you did the right thing by pitching the joint. As you said, they exposed you to legal liabilities.
I would also flush them out of my life. Druggies have only one friend and that is whatever drug they are abusing. If you get screwed over by their stupidity, they won’t give a damn.
Oh get a grip. Smoking pot occasionally does not make one a junkie. It is not stupid to partake in recreational use of pot. Just because it’s not your bag does not mean the rest of the world can’t enjoy a joint. Get off your high horse (pun intended) and try to exercise a little “live and let live.” If you don’t want to indulge, then it’s up to you to exit the vehicle.
No, the people who are smoking in the vehicle are breaking the law (without even getting into the risks of driving while high), and they are exposing the non-smoker to criminal liability as well. If they want to do it in the car, that’s cool, but it’s wrong to do it around someone who is uncomfortable, and that’s all there is to it. There can be no other valid answer. Even though I personally hate the stuff, I’ll be the first one to say that there isn’t anything wrong with occasional, responsible use of marijuana in private, just like alcohol. But UNLIKE alcohol, pot can show up on drug tests and get you fired, and it’s illegal to possess, and that makes all the difference in the world.
Regarding Bricker v. SHAKES, I agree with those who say that the chances of getting busted depend on the circumstances and the officers involved.
Personal anecdote: I’ve never done any drug stronger than pot, but in my early 20s I dated two drug addicts/dealers (simultaneously, at one point) and with both guys I knew that being in their homes put me at risk. If they got busted while I was there, I had no doubt that I’d be arrested. At the time, it was a chance I was willing to take.
I don’t care what others do in my presence in any moral sense, but I’m now in a position where any legal run-in more serious than a traffic ticket could affect my job. Accordingly, I don’t remember the last time I caught a buzz, and I choose not to hang out with people who I know use illegal drugs. It kind of sucks, because I know there are some very cool people out there who just smoke a little pot now and then, but until it’s legalized (which I think it should be) it’s in my best interests to avoid them.
I have neither a law degree nor a criminal record, nor am I related to any officers of the law, but I read a lot of John Grisham and I watch a lot of COPS so I feel entitled to express my opinion.
Your presence implies your consent, sparky. As several others have said, if you don’t want to be around it you can just leave.
Goodness, first off I haven’t touched the wacky weed in quite some time (15 years).
I totally agree that there are people out there with sensitive jobs that they could get fired if caught in such a situation. But I don’t think we’re talking about that here.
The feeling I got from Ringo’s OP is: What liabilities could he get into with the cops. He seems to think it’s a “Done Deal” whatever that may be. I could be wrong in that interpretation of his OP, I’ll admit.
All I’m saying is, that in all likely hood: Cops aren’t going to “Take you down” unless you’re just a complete ASS to them. This is especially true for cities like say um… Houston? Where the jails are so overcrowded that they really don’t have the time for such trivial violations.
So yes, I’ll capitulate once again and admit that there are laws out there that could get people in to some major turmoil.
But to me it really doesn’t matter because the likely hood of it actally happening is so small that it’s hardly worth noting.
Also, if Ringo is so worried about his liabilities; don’t you think it a tad* bit ambivalenct that he hangs out with so many pot heads? :dubious:
I apologize to you. I was rude and out of line, and I totally need to chill out, man. Whoa.
But I used to have a lot of friends who smoke drugs – and a few of them still enjoy it. Most of them are considerate enough to not do it around me since they know it bothers me, and I appreciate that. And it if comes out, I leave, it’s that simple. Being a passenger in a car is a trickier situation because you’re essentially a captive audience, but luckily, nobody I know would dare do that.
The problem with reliance on “what will law enforcement” is that it’s useless as a recourse. What do you do when the cop hauls you out of the car and puts the cuffs on?
“Hey! The last three times, the cops just dumped my pot out and sent me on my way!”
That argument should especially impress the judge.
The original point I responded to was whether or not legal liability existed. It does. It certainly may be police in a particular area have a practice of charging only egregious violatiosn, and solving minor possession cases by confiscating the contraband and issuing a warning. There is a great deal of leeway available to an individual officer’s discretion.
But if you run into one cop who’s uptight, or just having a bad day, and he charges you… it’s no defense to point to the other times you’ve been let go with a warning.
Too bad. It’s still our OP’s responsibility to remove himself from the situation. Or he can narc all his buddies out. Have them all thrown in jail for breaking the law. Wouldn’t that make him the Big Cheese?
While he’s at it, he can write tickets for speeding and dangerously inflated tires.
Forgetting the legal issues, there is the matter of simple ettiquate. It’s a pretty dick move to toke up in someone elses car if they don’t want you to. It’s like smoking or eating in the car if someone asks you not to.
And people who do drugs, even recreationally, tend to have a bit of a “hey be cool man!” attitude when it comes to people suggesting they not do them. They often have a bit of a sense of entitlement about their drug use.
That’s what makes it difficult to maintain freindships with people who’s level of drinking and drug use is very different from yours. I have friends who do use heavier drugs but they have the courtesy to not involve me in that aspect of their lives.
Except for one time when the “errand” my friend asked me to run with him was a trip to his dealer. I’m like “You IDIOT! They’re going to be all like “who’s the muscle?” and start talking shit, I’ll have to kill them and we’ll end up getting chased around NY all night by a bunch of mobsters who want their suitcase full of cash back!”
