I have listened to people say the Arab countries hate us because we are arrogant and do things against their interest. I want to know what we must do for these counties to like us. What I would like is some detailed examples of things we do to these countries for them to hate us as much as they do. If your answer includes Israel, explain what should we do about that problem. I don’t want to hear put people in a chair and talk them to death. I would like to hear real causes and solutions.
Make Islam the required religion of the country, repeal any laws about equality of women, kill or expell or subjugate all Jews… that’d be good for a start.
I hope there was a smilie intended there because otherwise it implies a view of Arabs which we might want to discuss its validity and/or its bigotry.
Dex is simply showing off his “deep” knowledge of the Middle East, of Arabs and Islam - well balanced as it is. Glad he could share to enlighten us.
That aside, the question of “liking” is misplaced. Much of the Arab world has profoundly divided feelings on the US, a mixture of positive and negative.
I believe I covered much of this ground in my thread on Iraq and the war, but the issues are more about resentment of American support of Israel (totally or in part, depend), combined with support for fairly oppressive regimes. Overall sense they are getting screwed.
A workable and just peace plan which is actually applied in re Israel would be helpful. Clearly would remove a major source of tension.
Other items are harder to handle for short term interests conflict with long term results – e.g. supporting the corrupt and bankrupt regime in Egypt bec. it made peace with Israel is good for Israel but shitty for the Egyptians. However security concerns ex-Israel also feed into this. A ‘regime change’ in Egypt were it popular would likely end up with an Islamist government. Obviously in the short term that would be dicey. Similar things can be written about much of the region.
Well,
I have some experience on this because I grew up in Egypt (although my family is Christian).
Growing up (in the eighties), I remember Egyptians talking about America as though it were some sort of mythical paradise. Streets of gold and all that. People dreamed of one day seeing America and had a strong positive feeling towards it. When most people found out that I was half-American, I instantly become more likeable and approachable.
Even as late as December 2000, the last time I’ve been there, people there, on the whole, still loved America. The main criticism I heard was that America stands by as the Israelis slaughter Palestinians (never mind facts here, this is about emotion), but when one Israeli is killed there is immediate condemnation. American interests were seen as being pro-Israel, at the expense of Palestinians and other Muslims. Hatred of Israel dates back to the Balfour Declaration but that is a whole other thread.
Interestingly, when I was in Egypt last, most people there though that George W. Bush was an extremely honorable man and would help Muslim interests around the world.
Now, the anti-Americanism has moved from the fringes of society to the mainstream. As my father tells it (he currently lives in Cairo) the Mubarak government may possibly collapse at any time due to the surge in protesting/rioting against America’s current actions and, indirectly, against the Mubarak government which has had good relations with the US government.
My evolving theory is: Arabs believe America supports Israel, a nation of millions, at the expense of the Muslim world, a billion people. They see the favoritism America shows in the Israel-Palestine crisis as a first step since, they believe, Israel is an expansionist nation. They believe that Israel wants territory from Lebanon, Syria, Egypt, Jordan, and Iraq and that America will continue to support Israel as it pursues these policies.
I, personally, don’t believe in this scenario but the majority of Arabs/Muslims do (from my experience). However, facts don’t matter in these situations, emotions do.
If we want to stamp out the hatred against us we can do a few simple things: 1) eliminate even the appearance of a double standard towards Israel. If we are going to demand that Iraq follow UN resolutions then we must demand that Isreal does to. 2) We need to spread the wealth a little. There is plenty of US aid going around the world. We have to get it to the people who need it and make it known that we are sending these packages. 3) But, we need to help the Arab countries develop their economies so that so many people are not living in squalor. We must increase American investment in these countries a la Qatar, but we obviously need cooperative governments and cooperative populations to be able to do this.
Well, we might start by looking at what the Founder of our own majority religion had to say – much of which He borrowed from the native wisdom of the area which the Muslims share into. Stuff like “Do unto others as you would have them do unto you,” “With the measure with which you judge will you also be judged,” – all that stuff.
Whatever our own internal motivations may be, the Arab countries do not see them. They see a superpower flexing its muscles, totally unaware or uninterested in what motivates them (and prepared to believe the worst lies about what they believe to be ultimate truth), secure in its own self-righteousness, and led by people who seem to have the same attitudes as provoked the Crusades. Arabs with any historic sense remember the Crusades well – and remember the results of their agreeing with the Allies to rise against the Turks in World War I: Britain and France decided to replace the Turks as their overlords, instead of freeing them.
The above is very much ivory-tower blue-sky idealism. But it needs to be the foundation on which practical steps are taken.
This is very true. Although I would love to see a more democratic and representative government in Egypt, the real alternative to a Hosni Mubarak is an Ayman Zawahiri. My biggest fear is that Zawahiri returns to Egypt like Khomeini.
And this is a real possibility as these Terrorists have been chipping away at the government for years by stoking anti-Christian and anti-Jewish feelings. Zawahiri’s first call to Jihad was not against Israel or the US but the Coptic Christian community in Egypt. Those who have heard these calls and have killed Christians in Southern Egypt have been dealt with very lightly by Mubarak, who fears for his political life.
We should act to stop Arab tyrants form using Israel or the US as scapegoats. Note that violent criticism of Israel naturally leads to criticism of the US, since we’re their ally and protector.
One way to accomplish this goal would be to encourage the spread of democracy, as is being tried in Iraq. Another would be to punish those tyrants who demonize the United States and reward those who are friendly toward us. This seems to be roughly the choice that Bashar Assad of Syria is now considering.
Cite?
Collounsbury, a question:
In your professional opinion, how are the majority of Sunni Muslims in Egypt, Saudi Arabia, Syria, etc. reacting to the stirrings of reform (and disdain of the theocracy) that appear to be present among young Shiite Muslims in Iran?
Are they dismissive? Fearful? Sympathetic?
Your insight would be appreciated.
Um… december, maybe this way of thinking about punishing those “Arab tyrants” who disagree with the US (God forbid) is the kind of American arrogance that BeatenMan was talking about in his OP.
C K Dexter Haven that was an excellent comment on the kind of Stereotyping and Bigotry that Arabs/Muslims currently face in the USA (and elsewhere). Do you care to explain yourself?
The question is, how many Arabs would accept a peace plan that actually ensures the continuing and permanant existance of Israel as a Jewish state.
Please, Collounsbury, give this cynical Israeli something to hope for. What percentage of Arabs do you think would, say, accept an Israel in 1967 borders, with Jerusalem and with no Right of Return? Because, frankly, the peace process is getting nowhere because Israelis feel there’s no one to talk to.
I think a good start to enhancing the American image abroad would be not starting wars on false pretenses. Bad start this year, I’m afraid.
The major split on this thread regards whether or not the US ought to change its behavior, given that many Arabs hate the US. Which of these five ideas do you agree with:[ol][]Many Arabs hate the US, so the US should change its behavior. []Many Arabs hate Israel, so Israel should change its behavior. []Many Arabs hate all Jews, so all Jews should change their behavior. []Many Arabs consider women second-class citizens, so women should change their behavior. Many Arabs hate gays, so gays should change their behavior. [/ol]I sure hope you don’t agree with #3, #4, and #5. Maybe you shouldn’t agree with #1 or #2 either.
Not to mention “rewarding tyrants that are friendly towards us”. Isn’t that exactly the policy that helped create this mess in the first place??
Presenting that idea as a “learn from history” agenda item to someone who is rabidly pro-Bush serves to underscore the aproposness of your screen name. 
Nicely skirting by the issue, december. Whatever you, don’t trouble yourself to think about why many Arabs hate the US.
Many Arabs hate the US because they interfere in Middle Eastern politics to further their own interests, so the US should change its behaviour.
To address the OP. Countries are like people. Getting them to like you is not dissimilar to getting people to like you. Treating their customs, beliefs and opinions with respect rather than as a hurdle to getting your own way is usually a good start.
As it is the US foreign policy for the last 50 years has been acting like a overgrown teenage who doesn’t understand that sometimes they don’t know best and that sometimes you don’t get your own way. Like any teenager it goes into a a sulk when other countries say no and doesn’t understand that throwing your weight about may make you feel better, but it doesn’t solve the problem.
Is it any wonder that sometimes people don’t like the US? Which is a pity, cos it can be delightfully charming otherwise. Just need to work on the social skills.
Is this a joke? I don’t want to cause offence, given you are an administrator. But I find the sentiment ignorant, bigoted and inflammatory.
Given you appear to be generally quite a learned, sane, person, I guess it is a joke. In which case, I would recommend editing your post to add a smiley or something, or newer visitors to this thread might get the wrong impression about you (and perhaps about the boards too, given you are admin).
Hmmm. Back in, let’s say, the 1950s, the equivalent thread might have been: How do we get the Soviet Union to like us?
Back in, let’s say, the late 1930s and early 1940s, the equivalent thread might have been: How do we get the fascist states (like Germany and Italy and Japan) to like us?
The answer would have been the same: we’d have to toss over our allies and re-ally with those governments. In the 1950s, we’d have had to stop opposing communist take-overs of countries. In the 1930s, we’d have had to toss our allies like Britain and France to the wolves.
The way to get the Arab states to like us would be to drop our support of Israel. The Arab states would then launch another war against Israel, trying to push all the Jews into the sea.
See, I think the question is asked arse-about. We’re in the power seat. It’s not what should WE do to bow to Arab wishes; it’s what should the Arab states do to get us to support them more? The answers: drop their hatred of Israel, replace their military dictatorships with democracies, work on their internal social problems rather than demonize the U.S. and Israel.
[QUOTE]
Originally posted by december *
**The major split on this thread regards whether or not the US ought to change its behavior, given that many Arabs hate the US. Which of these five ideas do you agree with:[ol][li]Many Arabs hate the US, so the US should change its behavior. []Many Arabs hate Israel, so Israel should change its behavior. []Many Arabs hate all Jews, so all Jews should change their behavior. []Many Arabs consider women second-class citizens, so women should change their behavior. Many Arabs hate gays, so gays should change their behavior. [/ol]I sure hope you don’t agree with #3, #4, and #5. Maybe you shouldn’t agree with #1 or #2 either. **[/li][/QUOTE]
You are missing some choices: how about
- Some of the above.
- None of the above.
- All of the above.
- Maybe we shouldn’t lump an entire culture into one category, or we are no better than those Arabs who hate Jews or Americans because of the group they were born into.
I’m a fan of #9, myself. I think it’s rather more nuanced and judges people as individuals, rather than blindly classifying them as representatives of entire categories that they happen t belong to, by an accident of birth.
Could it really be that bad to consider why people perceive us the way they do? I sure don’t think so. Try it sometime; it can be fun, trust me!