How much money do beggars make?

Wrongo. It has nothing to do with how I view my life. If I give money to someone to eat with, and it’s spent on crack, I have several concerns: The person still didn’t eat. I was lied to. The crack pusher has more incentive to stay in business. The crack user is one step closer to ruin. And I enabled this. You can care or not care about what you wish, but you don’t need to tell me what I should or shouldn’t care about.

Give me a break. What’s next, I should give my car keys to someone who asks for them to save someone from getting carjacked? A woman should consent to have sex with any stranger who requests it to save someone from getting raped? And are you going to give the beggar a few hundred or thousand to save various people from getting mugged the next umpteen times he wants a fix? That’s got to be the most asinine rationale I’ve seen for giving to beggars.

Thanks to lexi for providing first-hand observations of facts.

I am sure the dollars-per-hour of a beggar depends on his or her competence and location, and some luck.

The less competent probably need the money more, and have fewer ways to get it.

Another factor in their income is the numbers of hours they spend begging. Not everyone can stand on concrete for eight hours.

Yes, there are liars, frauds, losers out there. I knew a guy (very good tech, a mentor before he became disabled and drank himself down), who decided he didn’t have to keep paying for his nice flat, because he figured a smart homeless guy could be very comfortable. Once he was on the street, he found it was an ugly existence.

So he got into the system a little, and found the cheapest hotels (again, this cost more than his apartment had), where the law gave him rights if he stayed (more than 2 weeks?–in San Francisco). So the hotels would not let him stay longer than that, and he had to keep moving. I helped him in certain ways, knowing he of course continued to drink. He died about a year after he was out of his apartment.

He was an adult. Given his self and his situation, likely the only way to keep him alive would have been to institutialize him, and there is too much wrong with that also.

First, at least in my experience, far more beggars are alcoholics than drug addicts. This might vary in cities with heroin ‘epidemics’, but I rarely see homeless people who seem to be heroin or crack users. Some, especially those who sell newspapers instead of asking for money directly, are not alcoholics or drug addicts. They may have become homeless as a result of a bad financial situation, or a mental illness.

Integrating many of these people into the workforce is a well-meaning but unrealistic goal. Giving them a low-paying, unrewarding job with an abusive manager will not make them happier than they were when they were homeless, and it’s likely that they will not keep the job for long. For those with addictions, it’s important to realize that it is extremely difficult to treat addictions successfully, especially when the person is uncooperative.

Street youth are a different category; they’ve become homeless because of a situation at home, rather than a financial situation. For some, it might be physical or emotional abuse, an incompetent (and perhaps drug-or-alcohol-addicted) parent. Many street youth use alcohol and ‘soft’ drugs. Most areas have extensive programs for street youth, so if you’re concerned about this issue, you might want to contribute to one of the programs instead of giving money directly. (Except that street youth have a way of diverting donations from these programs for recreational purposes.)

Again, if you give money to a beggar, it’s far more likely that the money will be spent on alcohol than on crack or heroin. It is also very unlikely that an addict will rob or steal if they don’t make enough by panhandling. With heroin, at least, the drug itself discourages violence, and the addiction is not terribly expensive to maintain. Crack is different, but I don’t think crack users generally become panhandlers; I think they’re more likely to support their habit through crime in the first place, and not bother with panhandling.

Two more issues: food and withdrawal. Food is widely available to homeless people through shelters and soup kitchens. (Even for those who don’t stay in shelters because of the risk of having things stolen or getting diseases, it’s possible to eat at one without sleeping there.) Homeless people can get adequate food without panhandling. I’ve rarely seen them buy food; when I do see them in a fast-food place, they tend to not to buy food. They usually buy coffee, so they can sit inside and warm up. Finally, withdrawal is rarely fatal, and is only fatal for a very few drugs. A heroin addict will not die within hours or days if they don’t get heroin. They will get sick, but not die. IIRC benzodiazepines (and by extension probably alcohol) and barbiturates can be fatal.

ElectricZ: Don’t generally believe any story a homeless-looking person gives you; if they say they need money to get to a job interview, it’s really just a way of increasing appeal. I once saw someone begging in a business area with a ‘need job interview clothes’ sign. Homeless shelters will help with job interviews. They will provide bus fare to get to an interview. (Street youth here often try to sell transit tokens. I found out that they get tokens for going to job interviews, and so they often set up fake interviews and sell the tokens they get.) There are also organizations that will give low-income people business clothes for job interviews. If someone tries this line on you again, you might just want to tell them about that.

Hows a panhandler making $4 an hour supposed to compete with a panhandler in Bangladesh who will do it for a tenth the price?

Soft drugs such a marijuana, mushrooms and alcohol were common, but not habitual in my experience. There are programs out there for youth, such as youth shelters, and drop in centers - and some are very helpful - but from my own experience, I did not want to go to these programs because I preferred to be with my friends. Street youth are not a very trusting group either, for any help offered there is a fear that something will be wanted in return, so many youth just take advantage of the organizations who are there to help. A burn then before they burn me mentality. Most of this distrust is for adults and the “system”, other youth are trusted on the grounds that the youths share a common pain, and similar abuses at home - and all had the same desire to escape - and find the streets a better place than home.

Most street youth get out of that life eventually, but many of them don’t get out until they are adults because they get very close to the other kids there. In a way the group you are a part becomes a surrogate family with older kids taking care of younger ones. I am still very close to a few people from those days, they are my best friends and my family - and most of them are completely functional adults although it took them and myself longer than most people to integrate in to a normal life. Some of my old friends were nearly 30 before they had decent jobs and could be considered functional members of society.

In any big city are soup kitchens, and other places to grab something to eat. Some even have showers & laundries, which are absolutely wonderful after having “whore’s baths” in the sinks of fast food joints. There is a certain spartan quality to the food at these places, and almost always there is a religious service involved with getting food. One of the most annoying things is being told that when you accept Jesus into your life that your life will be better - it really used to bug me that these preachers had a condescending tone with street youth and would speak as if by accepting Jesus that you’d no longer be on the streets dirty and hungry and your life would be all better & normal, thank you very much. So sometimes rather than hearing these platitudes about how becoming Christian would fix EVERYTHING - most people, myself included would rather panhandle for a burger from a fast food joint.

And coffee, yes warm coffee indoors on a cold day was a major expenditure. And a plate of fries and gravy could last for an hour.

Funny with drug abuse, friends of mine who did harder drugs did them as adults, once they were off the street - and most used means other than begging to get the money for them, whether it was crime, drug dealing or stripping or prostitution - or a regular straight job - drug money was not procured via begging. Almost all but a couple friends from my youth are now all off drugs, any many do not even drink.
And none of them ever died from withdrawal symptoms, only overdoses.

Sorry you don’t get it. Read again what I wrote:

He did not ask something for nothing, he supplied me with entertainment, same as a street musician. For the best laugh I had all day, a buck was cheap. I’ve gone to many a movie for $10 and not laughed that hard. Of course this joke was only funny the first time, so I have not repeated this act.

glee the reason I was so pissed was the fact that at the time I was running about 1 paycheck away from being homeless myself. I had small children and more bills than available income. I had $10 bucks to my name until pay day. I would have to put at least $5 into my gas tank to get to work until Friday. That left me $5 for all the wild crazy stuff I might want to do. Like, oh, buy a cup of coffee at work, or maybe a soda on a hot afternoon. I was willing to give up two of those cups of coffee or sodas to help someone that I thought was in genuine need. Instead a con artist who, had in her hand, more money than I had in the bank took $2 from me. From my point of view, I was trying to do a good thing, and perhaps gather a little positive karma, and I found out I got fucked. Yeah I was pissed. I was pissed because she was a lying douche bag, :wally and I was pissed because I did not see through such a transparent scam. :smack:

In my experience, the stories of rich beggers are mostly urban legend. At least at night, I rarely see anyone give anything at all to panhandlers. I have on occasion taken in homeless people (who I had met previously while hanging out on the street) for a few nights when cold snaps hit, and I assure you they didn’t have any hidden funds.

[amusing anecdote] I was sitting on the subway one day, and a homeless guys gets on with two take-out containers of leftovers he had just begged from a restaurant, still hot. He hands one to another homeless guy, apparently a stranger, in a wheelchair, and then he goes and sits down in a free seat at the other end of the row. The guy in the wheelchair fumbles around for a bit, then finally finds a much-crumpled dollar in some pocket somewhere. He hands the dollar to the person sitting next to him, pointing at the other homeless guy. So this dollar is passed hand-to-hand, down the entire row of people, as a thank you from the one homeless guy to the other. And nobody pocketed it. [/amusing anedote]

The NY Times did a series on the homeless, and most of them made little more than a meal’s worth of money in a day. The majority of those who made some kind of decent wage were those who had arrangements with local superintendents to pick redeemable cans and glassware out of the trash. The Times also documented extensive trading networks across the city, with homeless trading each other necessary goods. Interestingly, they talked to several people in one of these trading networks who unanimously said that they would only trade with/trust people who DIDN’T do drugs - partly because druggies were too much of a risk and partly because they didn’t want to encourage addiction. Go figure.

mischievous

I’ve heard at various times, from otherwise very intelligent people that all of the following can make between $60K and $100K per year, often “tax free:”

Food servers/bartenders
Crop pickers
Pizza delivery people
Taxi cab drivers
Stay at home envelope stuffers
Soda can collectors
Homeless beggars

Maybe you can occasionally find instances of someone, somewhere making good money by doing some of these things. But most of the time, these people are just barely getting by, and people just generalize and use these stories as an excuse to feel no compassion for people doing what are often considered menial & degrading things. Really, if you could truly make good money by doing these things, people would be clambering to do them.

I don’t give money to beggars, but it isn’t because I’m kidding myself that they’re making tons of cash, or that their life isn’t as sucky as it seems to be.

A lady who claimed to know told me that everything is free, except drugs/booze.

Ever seen any one starving? Sure, the guy may be hungry. He’s saving his money for dope. Someone will give him free food, but not free drugs.

You are right that the others are a lie but some bartenders in really nice, busy places, with a youngish clientele really can make a lot of money. I used to be a part-time baretender in New Orleans and made about $500 cash tips each night on Friday and Saturday nights. That was working with two other bartenders and they worked the full week. I doubt they made much over $70,000 but most of that was in tips and certainly not fully declared.

Waiters and waitresses at such places can also make really good money. However, the type of people that I am describing have to be uber-professional and knowledgable and treat it like a real career. They generally also need to be fairly attractive and have a personality for it. It is not something that someone can walk in off the street and do.

Why would you feel compassion? What, is having any of those occupations something to be ashamed of? ‘Hi, Im Bill, Im a bartender’ - ‘Oh, Im sorry Bill’ - ‘Uh…sorry for what?’

The number of people who look down on someone for having jobs like that is pretty small outside of college campuses. Ive done a few of those jobs, and very rarely encountered any kind of weird ‘Oh you poor thing’ or ‘Get a real job’ from anyone who wasnt so young as to have zits all over their face. Besides, who the hell cares? Why lower yourself to letting other peoples opinions determine what you choose to do in life or how much respect you have for yourself?

As for begging, Rick I agree with almost completely. I have no problem at all with giving money to someone playing a song, reading poetry, washing my windshield, banging a rythm on trash cans. The better they are, the more Ill give them. But anyone who asks me for something for free, whether its my best friend or a complete stranger, is getting laughed at. There are not too many worse ways to insult someone than to ask them to give you something for free.

Another one is strippers. At a place where the dancers got very naked and squirmed around poles, and the audience put money in their costumes, one of the guys in the bunch I was with was pointing out how much the girls could make. He did not allow for the kickback the girl had to make to the establishment to dance there, if they had made that amount of money in the first place. Or how it is part-time employment, like musicians without the union.

And prostitutes. A couple of times, I’ve heard “Say she makes $100 a trick. And she can do five or ten tricks a night. Times 365 days a year. That’s $182,500 to $365,000 a year! You should do that!”

I leave the various things wrong with that as an exercise for the reader.