Hyphenated surnames

In My Humble Opinion
21

Women who hyphenate their names tend to do so, in my experience, because the name the were born with is the one identifier they’ve had their entire lives. It’s part of their identity, and they don’t want to give it up just because they choose to spend the rest of their lives with someone. Hyphenation is a compromise between keeping the full name you were given at birth, and taking your husband’s last name like a good little woman.

Frankly, I don’t see how it’s anyone else’s business whether a couple has the same last name or not.

22

Ever worked in a fileroom? I have, in the HR department of a big bank. Hyphenated last names give file clerks fits. You never know where you’re going to find Mary Smith-Jones’s file … under M. Smith, or M. Jones, or M. Smith-Jones, or even (I really don’t know why this happens, but it does) S. Jones or J. Smith. Obviously (IMHO) it’s supposed to be M. Smith-Jones, but in my experience hyphenated last names get misfiled about half the time.

My opinion: call yourself whatever you want, but be prepared for people to get it wrong, especially if it’s unusual or if you’re not consistent about it yourself.

23

Yes, I’m one of the Evil Hyphenators

Why? I didn’t want to give up my name, and my husband swore he’d never marry a woman unless she took his name. So it was a compromise. During the same discussion we also decided any children would have his surname alone.

Why am I so attached to my given name? It was my name for a quarter century, so I was pretty used to hearing it. No sons or male cousins in the family - so the surname dies out with me. There’s also the issue of “hiding” an ethnic identity, one that isn’t always popular. I wanted to acknowledge that background. And because I’m a stubborn cuss.

But I’m not inconsistent - I use the hyphenated name everywhere EXCEPT in one area - at airports and in the sky I use just my husband’s surname (except when legal signature required). Why? Because my husband bought me my first flying lesson, encouraged me whenever I needed it, and otherwise helped me achieve a life-long dream. So it’s in tribute to him, because without him I wouldn’t be a pilot. Also, aviation is very male-dominated and guys tend to be down on hyphenation even more than women, and it was something I just didn’t want to deal with in that arena.

It was never a matter of being “indecisive”. On the contrary.

If I had to do it all over again? I dunno… I’d lean towards keeping the maiden name. Except that, being hyphenated, it requires a lot less explanation when, say, visiting him that time he was in the hospital. It does signal a connection that otherwise might require me to carry around a copy of the marriage license.

But yes, it does play havoc with the filing systems.

24

Hyphenated name here-- get used to it. No, I won’t be put out if you call me by one or the other. Sometimes I identify myself at the counter with just the maiden half of the name as that’s how I’m alphabetised and they’ll find the file that way, and people stop and stare otherwise, as if they have never heard the term “hyphen.” “. . .k, l, a, n, d, hyphen, I, v. . .” “What?”

Is it usually the guys that have the argument about “how can you be so attached to a meaningless name and so attached to your pompous ancestry etc etc” as they never really face the decision (it’s always the woman’s MAIDEN name that is the meaningless arbitrary attachment, of course)? What is Mrs Dinsdale’s dad wasn’t a right bastard? Would you feel differently? We’re in an odd place here–You have to understand that while there is a desire to. . oh, have people who knew you in the first 30 years of your life recognize your name or ever track you down, there is a traditional societal pressure to change your name-- like if you don’t you consider it a “starter-marriage” or they don’t even recognize that you are married and are shocked to learn that you are. Is it pompous also to be reluctant to have your professional career split into pieces? "You don’t seem to have published anything before 1998. . " “Oh, you have to search under I instead of K. . . because I had A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT GOD-DAMNED NAME.”
How it happens. True story: 4 months or so before wedding
“Sweetie. . . what should I do with my name?”
[frown, high pitched insincere answer] “Whatever you want. . .”
“Would you be hurt if I didn’t take your name?”
“Sorta. . .”
“Are you going to change yours?”
“Noooo. . .”
“Do you see a double-standard here?”
“Yeahhh. . .”

End of story. This is done in other cultures and they get by just fine. Sorry about the Christmas card trouble.

25

When I married the first time, I thought it would be “neat” to have a hyphenated last name, maybe I was a little pretentious, but also I identified with my maiden name, that was how people knew me, even though it is a very common surname. The second name was very unusual and the names did not sound very good together, both ending in “s,” and people never understood what I was saying was my last name.

To further complicate things, I’m one of those jerks who used her maiden name for business but the hyphenated name for official paperwork, like the mortgage and the notary. What a pain in the rear! But mostly a pain for me, I think, and not the people sending me Christmas cards, because I really didn’t care how they were addressed. When I divorced, I didn’t have to change my name back again at work but the mortgage still has that dippy hyphenated name.

Have any hyphenators divorced and kept the hyphenated name? I know some women keep their ex-husband’s name and some go back to their maiden name, but for me, the hyphenated name had to go.

When I married the second time, I took my husband’s name, didn’t even consider a hyphen, and I’m happy as the proverbial clam. I’m probably not less pretentious, just more apathetic.

26

Never considered hyphenation. Mr. Ben didn’t really care that I kept my name, but then I’d been rather upfront about the fact that if I ever married, I’d keep it. Not from any particular attachment or because it would die out (I have two brothers), but because it just was me.

Our children have Mr. Ben’s last name – the Vet sends reminder cards to them with his name (probably because he filled out the form the first time we took the beasties in for kitten shots). If we ever were to have human children, and the jury’s still out on that one, they’d have have his name as well since he’s the only son of an only son.

27

Thanks for all the responses.

As I’ve said many times, I certainly feel you should be free to call yourself anything you want.

At the same time, I will consider myself free to have the opinion that it is - at best - silly and minimally cumbersome. Same way I’ll form opinions on guys wearing their pants halfway down their asses, young girls dressing like prostitutes, riceburners, body art, other family units’ earning and spending habits, or any number of other personal choices. And then you can form whatever opinion you wish about my opinion …

So Prince can certainly request to be referred to by a symbol. But I am not going to call him anything other than Prince. And in legal matters, he is consistently referred to by his given name (which I’m sure will occur to me as soon as I press “submit”.)

And my personal observation is that at least a good portion of the hyphenated people I’ve encountered are not doing so to preserve their professional reputations. You guys might travel in vastly different circles than I. However, I suspect many people are placing excessive value on past performance/reputation - both their own and their ancestors’.

The names that “inspired” this post were of middle school teachers. Three teachers made up for an entire line full of six names. I do not believe the curriculum vitae of middle school teachers is such that prospective employers are vetting their publishing history. And if my kids are any example, they don’t really care about such things, and would far prefer a shorter, simpler name. But I may be mistaken.

Coupla questions - what IS the most common practice for filing? There doesn’t seem to be any standardization in our file room.

If your name is Smith and your spouse’s is Smith-Jones (or Jones-Smith), is it appropriate to call you “the Smiths” or “Mr. and Mrs. Smith”? Say I’m introduucing you to someone at a party or such. Do I enter you in my phone book under S or J - or separately under each.

Thanks again for the responses.

28

I’ll echo DeniseV and say that I only mind when people intentionally “get it wrong” because they don’t approve of our decisions. We know that our name choices are unusual, and we don’t expect that people who don’t know us well will get it right.

And yes, my husband did take my last name.

I’ve told the story here before, but I guess it bears repeating:

When we were getting married, we decided that the future children would have my last name, which is Geller. My family is stronger and closer, and we wanted him to be closer to this tradition. Also, my family has taken my husband in as a member, while his family and I have more of a typical “in-law” relationship (it’s a good relationship, but I don’t feel like part of the family). Jeff wanted to keep his own last name, Robbins, partially because he was already using it professionally, and partially because he was used to it! But he did want to have a name in common with our children. So, he hyphenated. He uses his original last name casually, and his students call him Mr. Robbins, but he uses Robbins-Geller on forms and such. The baby has my last name, as does Spot.

This is very common situation, only the genders are reversed.

Almost all of our friends are cool with this. They address stuff to all sorts of name combinations. Technically, the most correct is “Ms. Elizabeth Geller and Mr. Jeffrey Robbins-Geller,” but anything other than “Mr. and Mrs. Jeffrey Robbins” is A-OK with me. There are only 2 people who do that, though. One is Jeff’s grandmother, and at the age of 92, she can call us whatever she wants. The other is Jeff’s oldest friend, who doesn’t approve of our decision. And the fact that he feels that he has a say in these matters is one reason the friendship isn’t as close as it was. :slight_smile:

Again, if people don’t know us well, I don’t expect them to “get it right.” If they are not people that we will be dealing with on an ongoing basis, I don’t even bother to correct them.

I know that this situation causes a bit of inconvenience to others, but we felt that it is more important to have the names that felt right to us than to arrange things for maximum convenience to others.

(And I have to admit, I did play around with a telemarketer yesterday. Yes, I know I’m a bad person for doing this. The conversation went something like this:
“May I speak to Mrs. Robbins?”
“This is Elizabeth Geller. What can I do for you.”
“I was looking for Mrs. Robbins.”
“Mrs. Robbins is my husband’s mother. She doesn’t live here.”
“So this is not the Robbins household.”
“Well, Mr. Robbins is my husband.”
“So you’re Mrs. Robbins!”
“No I’m not.”
and so forth.
Usually, I just say, “Yes, Mr. Robbins is my husband, but my last name is Geller,” but I was in a slightly evil mood.

29

My in-laws address me by their son’s surname as well. Kind of annoying, but waddyagonnado?

My son generally uses my last name in conversation, but his long name on legal documents. I wanted him to choose which ever name he identified with, and that’s what he does.

And, no…it wasn’t indecision that brought me to this. I like my name and identify with it. My son is half me and half his dad. There’s really no other way to do it!

30

Vivian Smith-Smythe-Smith, etc. (Deceased, etc.)

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In response to your most recent responses/observations/questions.

Did these hyphenated people tell you as much?

My comment was in response to someone else’s suggestion of “professional” implications.

  • … have your professional career split into pieces? "You don’t seem to have published anything before 1998. " *

I don’t think it is a huge and unwarranted assumption for me to guess that a tremendous percentage of the hyphenators I encounter do not encounter this problem. I guess this fits in with my general presumption that a bunch of folk think the rest of the world should be a heck of a lot more interested in their individuality and their accomplishements, than the rest of the world actually is.

**Since when does a kid’s preference for a name have any bearing on ANYTHING? Do you choose pediatricians based whether your kids like the name? **

Silly, silly argument. Clearly your emotions are interfering with your communication. At least I hope so.

My kids’ preferences have considerable bearing on many many things. AND I don’t have the option of selecting my kids’ teachers. AND my kids aren’t required to write their pediatricians’ cumbersome hyphenated names on each of their assignments. AND my kids will doubtfully be conducting a search of their middle school teachers’ publication history - if we want to assume that most middle school teachers have such histories. Shall I go on?

Filing is alphabetical. You would file under the first letter of the last name. Anyone who doesn’t get it may quite possibly be subliterate.

Well, I certainly won’t attempt to disavow you of the level of literacy of our office’s support staff. But riddle me this, bat-kitty. If Susie Smith-Jones advances an action on behalf of her minor child Johnny Jones, where does it get filed? It would be nice if you would enlighten the subliterate professionals and support staff I encounter all the time in courts, law offices, medical providers, and administrative bureaucracies who don’t appear to share your wisdom.

I guess there should be some universal enlightenment that informs everyone of the manner in which certain folk wish to creatively express their individuality and heritage. Yeah, that’s right.

John and Susan would work (if you are on friendly terms). Say I’m introducing you to someone at a party or such. "Bill, this is John Smith and his wife, Susan Jones."

A fine solution, as long as I know both John and Susan’s first names. Or care enough to find out. Unfortunately, I find myself occasionally having to refer to people - either in relatively formal speech or writing - who I simply don’t care enough about to research or recall their preferred mode of address. Nevertheless, I would prefer to at least convey the impression of a minimal level of courtesy. Which requires that I make assumptions.

And it seems to me that in such circumstances, courtesy would have the person who has chosen an unconventional name for themselves, to simply bear such efforts graciously. To tell the truth, in my opinion n the vast majority of circumstances, the vast majority of folk don’t care whether you are Mrs. Smith or Smith-Jones. And they are unlikely to remember either you or your appellation.

But the people who make a point of aggressively correcting a well-intentioned speaker? Well, THEM I’ll remember. Of course, not necessarily by their proper name.

I’d probably be better off saying, "This is Sue, who I work with - and some man. At least he appears to be a man. I know she’s married, but I never met the guy. So this could be a gigolo for all I know or care. Never met him before, and may well never meet him again."

33

When I was married, Mr. Corrvin took my last name. It was in the wedding announcements. When we divorced, it was written into the divorce that we reverted to our birth names (with those names spelled out). The only problems we had were with those people who seemed to be under the impression that an Oklahoma marriage license specifies what name you’ll have after marriage (it doesn’t-- it’s the last document you fill out as a single person, and the officiant and witnesses are the only ones to sign it after the wedding).

I wasn’t terribly offended by the people who called me Mrs. Hislast, especially friends of his who knew only that he had gotten married. Mrs. Hislast was simply a code or title for “wife of Mr. Hislast,” the only name they knew him by. Hey, so it was wrong on both counts, they tried. :wink: I’d simply mention that my name was still Ms. Mylast, Corrvin to you of course, and his is now Mr. Mylast. It all depends on an attitude of assuming people aren’t out to offend you by using The Wrong Name. They’re simply using the title that they feel is most likely correct.

I don’t think I’ll change names again if I remarry. But then, I also won’t be offended when the Ravenlets’ teachers call me Mrs. Raven, that being the title for “wife of Mr. Raven and assumed mother of Mr. Raven’s children.” (Repeat incidence of gentle correction above.) Of course, with the divorce rate and such the way it is, I wouldn’t be surprised if teachers didn’t call parents by first names and vice versa these days, rather than worry about which parents have which names. I also won’t be terribly worried about whether his kids will think I care for them less because I don’t share their name. I have two sets of grandparents, and for obvious reasons I don’t share a last name with one set-- and yet they love me about as equally as can be. Love and respect aren’t about names.

Corr

34

I know you’re not being accusatory, but in my case, my surnames have no “importance” of any note. My dad was a factory worker. However, his last name was my last name for over a quarter century, and I’d become accustomed to it. Like I said in my last post, my name is the way it is for my preference. Perhaps it’s silly, but I’m fine with that; I’ve sometimes been told I’m too serious anyway.

You alphabetize by the first part of the surname - consider it as all one word. As for personal address books, I list couples with dissimilar surnames under either the person I know the best, or twice including both people in each entry.

35

Your problems obviously lie with anything that isn’t buttoned-down, brown-shoes, vanilla ice cream standard. Talk about aggressive!

36

I have a hyphenated name. It wasn’t my idea, it’s the name my parents gave me when I was born. (My mom’s name is hyphenated as well, my dad’s isn’t; this confused me greatly when I was a kid.) If I ever marry, I’ll keep my name. It’s my name, it’s not something I can just shed or change because you find it inconvenient. Is it just hypens, or do you have the same problem with any name that is long or unusual? Do you get pissed off at Mike Krzyzewski for not changing his name to Smith?

37

I just have to say, that argument about your kids’ teachers is about the most ridiculous thing I’ve ever heard. So they have to write ONE EXTRA WORD on some of their homework. Big, hairy deal! If this presents a hardship to your child, I doubt the teacher’s name is the real problem. I’ve had teachers with very long, complex Slavic names before, and it was never a problem to learn or to write out their names on a paper. Took my a while to pronounce and spell correctly, sometimes, but it was never a big deal.

As for introducing people, I really don’t see a problem with saying, “This is Bob and his wife Susan,” or “This is Bob Jones and his wife. I’m sorry, dear, I’ve already forgotten your name. What was it again?”

Really, this thread is far more about your own prejudices than any shortcomings or flaws in people with hyphenated names.

38

Ah, the IMPRESSION of a MINIMAL level of courtesy. Clearly, that’s your style. Why change now?

Damn, I hate it when I slip and reveal the depths of my superficiality.

Your problems obviously lie with anything that isn’t buttoned-down, brown-shoes, vanilla ice cream standard.

You’ve sure got me pegged! I sure never experience this kind of confusion when my buddies december and His4ever stop by! :smiley:

39

Feh.

40

Kyla - I share the same total number of letters as well as the last 3 with coah K. And I don’t recall every saying that anything in this thread “pissed [me] off”.

CrazyCatLady - you win the insight of the week award, for revealing in your final sentence somethign I freely admitted in the first sentence of my OP. Keep up the good work.

Hey folks - I’m smiling as I write this, and intend this as light hearted. But I suspect I may be offending some people.

Heck, I form opinions about a lot of things. You are certainly free to disagree with my opinions. But you certainly aren’t going to convince me that my opinions on matters of personal preference are incorrect.

Knock yourselves out. Hyphenate away. Speaking for myself - I’m not sure whether the z in my last name is silent or not - and I don’t really care!