:rolleyes: Cheap shot is cheap. I wish I could say I thought you were better than that, but I can’t.
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Is it true that we all make split second decisions and initially treat people differently without even thinking about it based on appearances? Well of course. I remember some study that showed that single people looking for a romantic relationship will general approach people who they feel are near their own level of attractiveness. And I knew a very attractive and brilliant woman who was constantly bemoaning her lack of male attention; she mainly had contact with men who perceived her as “out of their league.”
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OTOH those initial reactions and perceptions are most powerful because they are made in the absence of any other data, and once other data is available the superficial not only becomes less salient but is interpreted differently. Yeah, like Wesley said.
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The op, as presented, though has a double whammy in the sexist reality of our world: she is, by her account (so at least her self-perception), physically unattractive, AND she is, from her description of herself and her male peer group, perceived as smarter than her male peers. Males are comfortable enough being romantically involved with someone a level above them or a level or so below them in their perceptions of physical attractiveness, but my impression is that they are more uncomfortable becoming romantically involved with a woman who is clearly smarter than they are, even more so than being more financially successful. Even among the scientist crowd, you rarely see a pairing where the female is paired with a male who is significantly below her intellectually. Males want a smart mate but even the smartest males still want to be the smarter one of the pair.
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Our presented op’s friends stated desires and what they will actually do are likely poorly correlated. See this study:
- The point is that men often have pretty fragile egos that they defend in ways they are often unaware of. A female partner who is a bit more attractive than they are strokes that ego (too much more threatens it), an unattractive partner broadcasts that they are unattractive themselves (and fear that such is true is the often the unrealized issue I think), a partner smarter than they are … now that is a big ego threat. No I am not suggesting that our op hide her smarts and play the part of a ditz … but I am suggesting that she use her smarts to find ways to make men who she is attracted to feel good about themselves in both the superficial and deeper ways, that the ability to do that will result in her being perceived as beautiful to them. I think a lot of men find a woman who gets their jokes to be attractive and for just that reason. FWIW.
LOL. You started with the cheap shots, dickhead.
I have a group of girlfriends that is pretty evenly divided on the looks scale between “above average” and “below average” - maybe weighted a little to below average. All of us now are between 40 and 50. And at 40 and 50, everyone who wants to be paired up is - the attractive and the unattractive (well, one of my attractive girlfriends is in the middle of a divorce - her not terribly attractive husband decided to sleep around with less attractive women than his wife).
There are a few things I’ve noticed. Not terribly attractive women tend to end up with SHY guys, not necessarily bad looking ones. Many of my girlfriends who aren’t beauties by any stretch of the imagination ended up married to guys they basically jumped. Nice guys, interesting guys, intelligent guys. Often attractive women end up with guys who aren’t terribly attractive, but are self confident and outgoing. I suspect there is a pattern here. The other part of the pattern, they usually married later, in their late 20s or early 30s, than the attractive part of the set.
I’m an ugly dude…wanna fuck?
With that setup? Not taking that shot would have been an insult. For a moment I thought you were intentionally putting out a straight line, and briefly considered that you might not be a complete pompous ass. Thanks for clarifying.
Speaking of cheap shots—they’ve been helping ugly people get laid from time immemorial!
Doesn’t cheap shot imply Rand Rover’s wife is actually ugly? If his wife wasn’t ugly, it wouldn’t be a cheap shot, right?
In the last pic thread you told me I look fine.
(just for fun I’ll show my sig)
Looks do matter, there’s no denying it, but attitude is also a HUGE determinant of attractiveness. Positive, intelligent, go for it women in good shape with middling looks get as much quality male attention as they can handle. Belinda Gates and Hillary Clinton were no beauties and they were both chosen as wives by men that could have had almost any woman they wanted within limits.
This attention I am referring to may not be from the prettiest 20 something males in your immediate social set, so the onus is on you to expand your horizons of men with whom you wish to associate. If you have thing for young pretty boys your complaints aren’t going to get much sympathy.
Attitude is everything. There is a 24 year old woman in our office who is drop dead gorgeous. Literally looks and dresses like a fashion model. She is stunner physically. She has a 4 year degree and is intelligent enough, and yet she has trouble maintaining relationships, and it’s certainly not because she’s withholding sex. The reason for her issues is that she is a low affect person who is almost always reactive in conversations. She initiates very little conversationally and does not engage many topics.
These kinds of "cipher’ people are insane amounts of work to have a relationship with. It’s like pushing a rock uphill. No one wants that.
Just be upbeat and engaging and you will do fine. If you are a quiet sad sack you had better look like Sophia Loren and even then your relationships won’t last.
Is 34B really considered small in the US? It used to be the fairly standard size for slim, hot twenty-somethings here in the UK (judging by how quick it sold out anyway!)
And so you did!
I think that the OP of this thread should hook up with the OP of this other thread http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=644543&highlight=escorts
Then she can complain to him about how all guys care about is looks and he can complain to her about how all girls care about is money.
If I’m not physically attracted to someone I have no interest in pursuing a sexual relationship with her. Why exactly does that make me a bad guy?
It’s your attitude and outlook that is affecting your life, not your looks. You don’t see the middle ground, and you are making huge assumptions.
I’m on the other end of the your self-classified physical spectrum, and it’s a whole different set of problems to deal with. Sure, it’s very easy to get a lot of attention from men. The problem is that much of it is unwanted and often inappropriate. People make negative assumptions about you, and it’s often jealousy based. People, usually women, assume they are smarter than you, more worthy in general than you, and that I’m superior to you attitude wears thin and men notice it. I don’t haul people around with me when I help stray animals, when I teach illiterate adults how to read, and so on. My life isn’t a who’s the better person contest, it’s a life I built for myself because it’s what I enjoy and feel fulfilled by. It doesn’t affect me if some women can’t get themselves together internally enough to be secure and value themselves without blaming me or the rest of the world for their issues.
The simple fact is, if you opened yourself up to having a great guy, you would have one. If you loved yourself, other people would pick up on that and know that you are open to receiving love.
If your ass and hips are too big, get fit and toned because you know on the inside that you deserve the best health and shape that you can give yourself. Look at what beautiful women like that lady who plays Bones have done with their big hips. When men look at her, they aren’t thinking boy does she have fat thighs. Not satisfied with your tits? Wear a push-up bra or focus on all the beautiful women that aren’t stacked. Brooke Shields comes to mind. I bet if you went to a professional make-up artist and he or she showed you how to do your make-up, you would be pleased with the results. Same thing with your hair. A cut that is the right one for your hair and face makes a world of difference. You owe it to yourself to be the best you can be, inside AND outside.
Accept yourself and love yourself, and wanting to look and feel the best that is humanly possible will come naturally. When you love and value yourself, it’s a hell of a lot easier to say no to people and things that aren’t good for you. Once you “get” that, your life only gets better and better. You will be able to handle problems better and be able to cope with the ups and downs of life a hell of a lot easier.
All that the media makes me feel bad is bullshit. Only people with very weak minds who don’t love themself fall for that shit. When I look at a Victoria’s Secret ad, I’m thinking that looks really sexy, and even though I’m not 22 any more, I’m still sexy and wearing one of those could be really hot and fun.
Sitting around with a bunch of horndogs who want to play philosopher so they can have an excuse to sit next to hot chicks isn’t a very nice way to treat yourself. It’s not them, it’s you. You know what they are really up to, so you keep going? What the hell for?
Anyone can get a boyfriend or girlfriend if they have the right attitude. When you meet men, even ones you aren’t interested in, you have to really believe that you have maximized your potential in every way. You look the best you can (even when working on yourself, you look the best you can with what you have got to work with), you are emotionally and physically healthy, you lead a balanced life, you have interests, you are willing to take a risk and are not going to be mortally wounded by rejection, and you project your own happiness.
Cite for bolded part?
Last time I tried to help out an ugly woman lamenting over the fact that she was ugly and couldn’t find a guy (and she was pretty unattractive) she refused to go out on a blind date with a friend of mine after I showed her his picture even though the double date was set up.
Geez that bugged the shit out of me. He felt like real shit to.
I will not have much sympathy for the OP unless I get information about the guys she’s turned down over the past several years.
No, its not small, it’s more or less average. And if you’re wondering size 2 isn’t considered “land whale” or even large either. It’s TINY. A 5’7" woman who weighs 130 is actually close to the line of being medically underweight. So her boobs - which very likely her correct bra size is 32C or 30D if she is indeed 130 carrying most of it in her lower body – probably look huge on her frame.
Curtis LeMay.
I once dated a girl with a very round face whose cheeks had some kind of pebbly texture. Maybe it was acne scarring, I don’t know. It was quite distinctive and I’m sure she didn’t want to look that way.
But because of other things about her – attitude, what she did for fun, other aspects of her looks – I thought she was hot as hell.
It didn’t work out, but several of my friends at the time developed crushes on her over the next few years. She eventually dated a few of them too.
Wherever she is, I hope she knows we still remember her as hot.
The one scene that comes to mind for me, at least, is the transformation scene from “The Princess Diaries”. Anne Hathaway IS gorgeous, but not in what I consider to be typical modern day “Hollywood” style because
A)she’s not overly tall
B)she’s not stick thin
C)she doesn’t have boobs bigger than her head
D)she’s not blonde
I love watching her because she reminds me a bit of Audrey Hepburn in that she kinda gives Hollywood the finger as far as what’s considered beautiful and stylish.
A cite for what “my impression is”? Really?
I have no cite, just my impression. My impression further is that what I think of as being the old sexist tradition of woman preferring to marry someone who is at their educational level or above (“marrying up”) and men being more comfortable marrying someone who is at their educational level or slightly below (“marrying down”) is, by necessity, changing, as the numbers of highly educated women begins to outpace those of highly educated men. In fact for that I can go further than “my impression” and offer this cite:
Problem is that the marriage numbers do not inform about attraction as much as they inform about the effect of education and class on the decision to marry versus to cohabitate.
I’d be interested in reading any actual cites any one has to offer.
And the point to the issue framed in the op stands: IMHO men find women who make them feel good about themselves and who they are to be attractive, no matter what their physical characteristics are.