I have a problem that needs a woman's touch

Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share
1

Interpersonal communication is not my strong suit, (Cue the sarcastic “NO! You think?”) but I think I have FINALLY figured out something about Mrs Zone.

She likes to complain about her job, whatever her job may be. Each job she has is the worst anybody has been forced to keep. Each boss is the dumbest and most obnoxious on Earth. I long ago gave up complaining about my own jobs because it just gets her going. And one of our worst fights came about because I suggested she get a new job and, when she said she couldn’t find one, pointed out that she hadn’t performed the first step, that of opening the want ads.

According to that Mars and Venus dude the miscommunication stems from my being from Mars, and results-oriented, and her being from Venus, or communications oriented. Apparently, I was supposed to sit there, looking sympathetic, and cooing crap about how right she was and how they didn’t know a good thing when they saw it.

You folks know me well enough, I think, to know that I don’t have a lot of patience with supportive crap. I would rather FIX a problem than talk about it.

Again today she’s threatening to quit her job, a part-time job that pays a LOT better than other part-time jobs, because her boss is getting “threatening.” This is the statement she saw as threatening:

“You HAVE to stay until five on Tuesday because I won’t be here and this place falls apart if I’m not here.”

She reads this as “Stay here until five or I’ll fire you.” I read it as “You are the only person I can depend on to do her job and keep the department going if I’m not here.”

“Well, if she meant that she could have asked NICELY instead of getting all demanding like that.”

So, what I’ve figured out, thanks, in part, to Lexicon’s explanation of why some people like to complain about little things in my “Quitcher bitchin’” Pit thread, is that MRS ZONE JUST LIKES TO COMPLAIN ABOUT HER JOBS! She doesn’t REALLY plan to “quit and go to work at McDonalds.” And that’s why she has been complaining about this job since she got it four years and four bosses ago.

Maybe this is obvious to YOU, but I’m a guy and NOTHING is obvious to ME. Hell, THIS took me twenty-five years to figure out!

So, my plan is to start trying that sympathy crap and keep my eye rolling to a minimum (she’s the part-timer–OF COURSE they treat her like crap!). Do you think I’ve got it right, finally?

2

Yup, you’ve got it right. Most people (men included, although I know you’re all jumping up and down and insisting that this is something that ONLY WOMEN DO), when they complain, generally want a shoulder to cry on and a supportive listener. You’re NOT supposed to FIX the problem, you’re supposed to pat him/her on the back and say “Poooooor you. You’re (boss/job/evil friend/parents) sure are hard to deal with. Let me (get you a beer/rub your back/perform your favorite sexual act).”

I mention the thing that men do this, too, because my experience is that men always deny that they do this, too. Having been the proud owner of several men (sequentially, not at the same time) I can attest to the fact that offering logical advice when a man is bitching about something is usually met with hostility.

3

Well, I think you’ve got it figured out that you shouldn’t try to fix it anymore, but just listen and make sympathetic noises.

However, I don’t think this is a Mars/Venus problem. Mr Mauv used to complain all the time about his prior job. Everytime he did, I would suggest he start calling up some headhunters or pull out the help wanted section. Never happened. He would complain every damned day and not do anything about it. Drove me nuts! It was almost a relief when the company went bankrupt and they let everyone go.

4

Re: the thread title:

You and me both, my friend!:wink:

5

sounds pretty good to me. When I think about how my fiance reacts when I complain about things, that’s basically what he does. If something is really worth complaining about, he might go so far as to say, “Geez, that’s really horrible! They shouldn’t do things like that!” But mostly he pays attention and agrees when he should agree and makes sympathetic noises when he should make sympathetic noises. It doesn’t have to be all that pro-active. Just be on her side. An “I can’t believe they’re treating you like that!” every now and then will probably go far.

Good luck!

6

by George, I think he’s got it…

and add a:

“honey, of course you have to stay until 5, you are THE ONLY ONE who knows what they’re doing in that place, and your Hitler of a boss knows it…”

dropzone, did you actually read Mars/Venus??..
you could drop that tidbit on dewt next conversation you’re having…LOL
I’ve tried for years to have him read it…like you, he knows the stuff, he just never impliments any of it…and believe me, there are times when Mr. Grey is eerily right.

I too, hate my job, have hated almost all my jobs and poor dewt has to listen to all the bitchin’…

and to think of all the misunderstandings that could have been avoided if only he had performed my favorite sexual act instead of trying to fix what my bitcin’ was about…

sometimes, you just have to listen, kiss the tops of our heads, and tell us that you are sorry we had such a shitty day and you love us…

7

Yes, you got it right. I have had to explain the very same thing to Mr. Lyllyan several times. I don’t want him to FIX IT, I just want to complain about it.

Congrats on your break thru.

8

I figured somebody would pick up on that and I’m not the SLIGHTEST bit surprised it was you. :wink:

9

and of course, I am now noticing the bitter irony of that post followed by my first sig…

sigh…

::walks off, mumbling about posting justifications for whining::

10

I’m using generalities here, but I think this is one of the major differences between men and women. (Hold your genitalia jokes, please.) I have found as a general rule that when women have a problem, complaint, whatever, what they are looking for is commisseration, sympathy, agreement, etc. And in general, when men have a problem complaint, whatever, what they are looking for is a solution or plan of action. (And this is why we find that men are not known for their habit of discussing their problems in the way that women do. They see no point in complaining about it if they already know what they plan to do about it.)

After noticing that Mr. Sunshine would always suggest things for me to do to make the situation better instead of just saying, “Wow, that sucks.” I realized that I always just said, “Wow, that sucks.” and didn’t give any advice. Now he knows I just want him to agree with me that my boss stinks (unless I actually ask “What should I do?”) and I know that he’s telling me about his problem because he’s looking for suggestions.

11

About half, before Mrs Z’s dismissive catcalls made continuing too embarassing.

“That moron doesn’t know what he’s talking about!”

Well, he seems to have gotten SOME of it right. He just limited it too much with the gender-specificness.

(Actually, I liked how the sig worked. And I’d steal the “Hitler of a boss” line except she’d figure out I was being sarcastic.)

12

Being a woman, I can say from my own extensive observations of male - female interaction, that there is definitely a lot of truth in the Mars/Venus communication model. I can tell you, that when a man tries to instantly jump in and “fix” the situation instead of being merely sympathetic, I sometimes find it insulting, because the suggestion is that I as the Little Woman don’t really know how to fix it, and am spilling my woes to He-Man in order for HIM to TELL me how to fix it. I know that’s not generally the guy’s intent, but that’s what it can feel like, when I really just want to vent and get some sympathy, hence it can be irritating. Though I grant you, constant whining about a problem without making an attempt to change the situation or perception can be equally irritating.

Drop, I have a suggestion. Next time Mrs Zone starts complaining, throw the ball in her court. Say “Geez that’s terrible, sure sounds like your boss is a jerk, what are you going to do about it?” If she goes back to complaining, just keep putting the responsibility back on her. What you’re doing here is being supportive and sympathetic, but not overly so. Then, you’re immediately giving her the opportunity to come up with her very own solution. Maybe then she’ll be less self-absorbed and more proactive.

Also, just for fun, next time you need to vent about your
job, try asking her for advice, and see what happens!

Whoops, there I go trying to fix stuff. I forgot to say, there, there, {{{{dropzone}}}} :slight_smile:

13

drop, I think you’ve got it right.

For me, bitching is usually to let off steam and vent. It’s cathartic. It is not to get advice. If I want advic, I will almost always ask for it. When I am offered unsolicited advice, I will sometimes tell the advisor “If I want your advice, I’ll ask for it.”

When I am in a bitching/venting/ranting mode, I’m in an emotional state that is not conducive to making rational decisions or listening to advice. After I’ve gotten rid of the emotional crap, I’ll get a more balanced perspective on things, and that’s when I’ll decide what, if anything, I’m going to to about the situation, and if I want advice, I’ll ask then.

MikeG, care to expound on your problem? :wink:

14

I just figured out the same thing recently. My girlfriend gets mad at me for giving her suggestions when she complains to me about things. It turns out she just wants to complain and doesn’t want me to try and fix everything for her. So now I just listen intently, shrug my shoulders and agree. It’s also EXTREMELY difficult to keep from rolling my eyes sometimes, and that gets me into big trouble if she sees it.

Oh well, maybe one day I’ll actually understand her…

15

No can do. That is what nearly got me divorced before. I’m BUNCHES better off phoneying up somne sympathy.

16

I’m always the last to hop on a bandwagon, so I’m kinda reading parts of it now…

he’s a bit too traditional in his role models, and there are times, where, within his definitions, hell, I’M from Mars and dewt is the Venuvian…

17

Women often play a story game. They see who can come up with the worst thing that happened to them. They each try to out do each other.

18

Ah, handy, that’s not just women…men do it, too! Someone tells a story of how they got in a wreck and did $2000 in damage to their car, somebody’s just got to say “Oh, you think that’s bad…once when I…”

Also, in my family, it’s the hubby who complains and whines about his job and looks at me funny when I say that if it’s that bad, he should take his Fridays (he works 4 10’s) and go find another job… Poor baby…awwwww…

19

Right. Sure. Keep believing that,handy.

Meanwhile…save your sanity, dropzone, and read Deborah Tannen’s You just don’t understand. It’s a fun read, and very enlightening. Generalising madly, men communicate to solve things; women communicate to bond. You’re attempting to find anwers and she’s attempting to make an emotional connection.

That’s grossly over simplified, but truly, do check out her book(s).

Veb

20

GAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!
:: Banging head against wall ::

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