I just love it when someone kills a legislator!!

"Regarding bicycles vs guns.I have had little success in locating the statistics on the number of guns vs the number of bicycles, the rate of injury when precautions are used (helmets or gun locks), and the actual death and injury rates for bicycles. I did find that motor vehicles are the leading cause of death in children, ages 0-14. (Source: NHTSA Traffic Safety facts) Obviously we can’t reduce speed limits or ban cars. But it is questionable as to whether we are as dependant on guns as we are on cars. "

This is classic. You are kidding, right?

“Oh, and lay off waterj2. He’s far, far better at this debating stuff than you, and is a really good guy to boot.”

If this guy is so good why not address the issue? Of course the NH legislator is insane. I draw a parallel between depriving someone of their freedom and shooting a cop. Why is a cop’s life so much more sacred than a citizen’s? Some cops are necessary. The rest are a giant leech on society’s neck along with the judges, jailers and prosecutors, etc. You people have been lulled into a dew lolly sheepish acceptance of the status quo.
“There’s a difference between “strong” opinions and loony ones. Killing cops because they want to put people in jail? C’mon…we’ve got it lucky.
Okay, the drug laws are unfair. The “war” against drugs isn’t working. But if someone is trying to break into your house, who are you gonna call? Mommy?”

What is this distorted crap? Can this have anything to do with what we are talking about? For that matter does it have anything to do with itself? These thoughts are not logically connected. All emotion and no thought.

“Chronolicht, in previous threads you’ve admitted to repeated instances of snorting cocaine and of driving drunk, so why does the same past behavior of George W. Bush incense you so much?”

Because watching the 52 year old frat boy speak of how we need his “leadership”, a leadership based upon values, not consensus (What the fuck do you think governing by polls is? An imperfect parallel admittedly, but as close to it as possible and the reason why Bubba was a success), makes me wretch. The little puppet is a first tier hypocrite, along with Henry Hyde (pooching his secretary while railing against Clinton’s infidelity), Tom DeLay (inviting lobbyists onto the Texas house floor to “help” write laws while giving patriotic speeches about the integrity of the new government), Gingrich (quickly bowed out before the people got wind of the fact that he was fucking someone other than his wife), and on and on, the two faced heroes of the Republican party. They are slime who line the pockets of the rich while raping the environment and sodomizing your children’s future. If you are not rich and support Bush, you are deeply and profoundly confused.

Imagine the hoopla if Gore had been bagged for DUI several weeks before the election. We never would have heard the end of it.

“Hmm. So lets ban bleach because a kid might find it and drink it. Lets ban plastic bags, because some kid might find one and suffocate. Lets ban pools, because some kid might fall in one and drown.”

This is good logic. Atomic bombs don’t create nuclear winter, fingers do. We ought to sell nuclear missiles to everyone because it is people that cause war, not bombs. This argument is facilely moronic.

What I think is moronic is the insistence on “guns don’;t kill people, people do.”
The fact that people kill people is precisely why gun control is being instituted.
Furthermore, the function of a plastic bag is not to kill. A gun’s is. There is no particular need for guns in our society, (in general) either.

That being said, since I am a libertarian, I do support a person’s right to own property, including a gun.
I also support their right to be severely punished for any negligence on their part.
When children die due to guns, someone was criminally negligent. The child is too young to be considered responsible for their actions. Whoever allowed the gun to be available should be tried for 3rd degree murder.

And using stupid arguments inaccurate arguments like “bicycles kill more people” or “let’s ban plastic bags” does not improve the rationality of your position.

sarcasm alert! sarcasm alert!
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.
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chronolicht, you seem to have misplaced your head.

Perhaps you should go see a proctologist.

Hyperbolic but not sarcastic. The nuclear argument is logically congruent.
Scatological humor gets the job done, eh? I have learned from you. (That’s sarcasm, baboso).

Ah, I love the smell of a hijack in the morning.

Both, actually. Sarcasm without hyperbole is like the Straight Dope without Cecil.

  1. This is what happens when uninformed people vote. If you are simply voting for a guy because he has an “R” (or a “D” or an “L” next to his name) then you are an idiot and deserve to have an idiot represent you.

  2. Where the hell was the press BEFORE this guy ran? I mean, could anyone have dug this up prior to the election?

  3. This guy is either: a) asking to be shot by a cop, to prove that his claims were legit. or b) just trying to get attention, any attention, he can. Because if he really believed that the cops were so bad, he’d believe that they’d shoot him for kicks.

Personally I think pissing off the cops with such inflammatory words is reeeeeeeally stupid. It would be like insulting John Gotti’s daughter. There are some things you just don’t do if you want to keep breathing.

Come one, come all, to behold the Mighty Morphin’ Power Thread, which starts out flaming a madman in NH, quickly turns to jibes at Republicans, then Libertarians, then a Gun Control debate of kids n’ bikes vs. kids n’ guns, a couple indictments of the “War on Drugs”, a little bit of nuclear weaponry mentioning, then a flame war degrading into spotty name calling. Even the late, great, JDT is mentioned in passing.

I love The Pit. :smiley:

Boy, I’m so glad there are people out there who are perfectly ready and willing to decide what I need. Are you *sure you’re a Libertarian, and not a Democrat or a right-wing Republican?

“The fact that people kill people is precisely why gun control is being instituted.”

Take a careful look at this statement, Kyberneticist. If people kill people, what the hell is gun control going to accomplish? Your statement is totally illogical. “People are the ones doing the killing, so lets take away their guns.” Huh? For someone who says he’s against gun control, you sure seem to have mastered its logic.

And when I referred to bikes vis-a-vis guns, I referred to accidents, for kids 18 and under. The statistics you quote are not referring to the circumstances I listed. So you have not disproved anything.

Perhaps you misunderstand, Lizard. I was saying that simplistic statements like the one I quoted only reinforced the restrictionary causes. Then I showed why.
The same with poor logic like yours. Gun vs bike accidents? What the hell are we comparing now? Scrapped knees and concussions vs blown off kneecaps?
The only reasonable comparison is gun vs bike deaths.
I showed that bikes cause far fewer deaths in children. I purposely excluded 14-18. If I had included those ages, the gun deaths would have skyrocketed. You don’t know how to quit when you’re ahead, do you?

I hate it when conservatives claiming to forward the cause of liberty use dumbass arguments to defend the narrow set of rights they are looking for.

Oh yeah? Well I want to force bus known communists into your living room to kill your puppy! What are you going to do about it?

BTW, everything I’ve seen in the press in Mass and NH seems like a snow job to me. This guy seems to be getting taken out of context. Of course people have the right to kill a cop in self defence and, many would say, to defend their property against illegal search and seizure. That is why we get to have guns, remember?

No, we get to have guns so that the people can aid in defending our borders.

Is it just my imagination, or is this becoming not only a Great Debate, but one that’s been done to death?

Well hell, Anthracite herself almost offed a few cops a few weeks ago, when they surprised her in a confused moment.

I would have testified at her trial that she was within her rights.

…since I am working in New Hampshire right now and getting to enjoy the fireworks in the press.

  1. Wasn’t it just a few weeks ago that Republicans were cracking jokes about people in Florida being too stupid to vote properly? Well, now the Repubs are all lining up here to complain that they didn’t know his views when they voted a straight ticket. Oh well, idiots must suffer (unfortunately, the rest of us suffer along with them).

  2. I don’t think Mr. Alciere is being taken out of context - he hasn’t exactly been apologetic - you may visit his website and see for yourself - http://www.tomalciere.com is chock full of hilarity, if only he weren’t serious.

Some examples of his plan to better the nation…mind you, some of his ideas may have some merit in moderation, but he’s over the top.

…and my personal favorite…

That’s right! If you’re a mental institution and don’t want to be there, you must be sane! Only a crazy person would want to be there! What logic!

“The only reasonable comparison is gun vs bike deaths.”

Straight ahead chowderhead action. The comparison is fatuous. Bicycles are a mode of transport and enjoyment. They are also guaranteed by the second amendment. Unlike handguns.
“A well-regulated peloton being necessary to the amusement of a free State, the right of the people to keep and ride bicycles shall not be infringed.”

There is no constitutional protection for individual gun ownership. It is considered a well tried area of law.

Rather ironic to see all this vitriol in the same forum where death has been wished upon Regis Philbin, Anne Murray, William Shatner, George Bush irresponsible parents and others…

Worked for Yossarian

Okay Chronolicht, you have officially pushed me into waterj2’s camp. Bicycles are guaranteed by the second amendment? What planet are you on?
And if there is NO constitutional protection for gun ownership[, then how come I can drive down the road to my friendly neighborhood hardware store and buy one anytime I want? If there was no “right” to it, it would’ve been outlawed by people like you long ago. Save your pompous prounouncements on legal matters for teenagers who are too stupid to recognize an idiot when they say see one.
I, like waterj2, am through with you.

“Okay Chronolicht, you have officially pushed me into waterj2’s camp. Bicycles are guaranteed by the second
amendment? What planet are you on? And if there is NO constitutional protection for gun ownership[, then how come I can drive down the road to my friendly neighborhood hardware store and buy one anytime I want? If there was no “right” to it, it would’ve been outlawed by people like you long ago. Save your pompous prounouncements on legal matters for teenagers who are too stupid to recognize an idiot when they say see one. I, like waterj2, am through with you.”

Um.

How do I put this?
You
well
you um
I
I was not
Well, I wasn’t serious.
“…who are too stupid to recognize an idiot when they say see one.”

This is top ten irony. You are clearly a vertebrate but not an arthropoid. All lizards are literalists. The words even come from the same root.
If you did know a little law, and you took the time to study this a bit, you would know that people don’t have handguns because of the second amendment. They have handguns under the same types and area of laws that regulate the “right” to drive a car. That’s no right at all. It is a privilege. Thanks for the belly laugh.

[troll]TOM ALCIERE FOR PRESIDENT![/troll]