The whole thing? Where’d you find it?
All the Parkland doctors agreed that the large head wound was most likely an exit wound. Even the one (Dr. Crenshaw) who’s turned into a conspiracy nut. The only entrance/exit confusion stemmed from the nexk shot, where the exit wound was obliterated by the tracheotomy, which led to some weird speculation on the part of the doctors about the possible paths that shot took.
And hey, if you want to see exactly where that bullet exited, just click on Frame 313. That’s a whole lot of blood, brains, and skull being blown out the exact spot where the large head wound appears in the autopsy photos.
What the heck does that have to do with anything?
It was fascinating! This guy Oswald really got around! What happened to that right-wing nutjob, General Walker? I find it amazing that Oswald’s relatives didn’t have him committed-he was pretty well crackers by the time he bought the rifle. Of course, his wife (Marina) was probably pretty well scared of him by then.
Just for the sake of asking, was the “FAIR PLAY FOR CUBA” organization ever investigated? Seems like Oswald had a pretty strange relationship with this outfit!
General Walker died a few years ago. I believe he was still living in the same house, or at least did so for a very long time. Despite his political prominence in the late 50s/early 60s, he had long since faded into obscurity except as the guy Oswald almost killed.
The Fair Play for Cuba Committee was thoroughly investigated. Oswald basically had no serious association with the organization. He simply applied to start a local chapter in New Orleans (and lied about the existence of other members, even putting fake names on documents to make it look like it was more than just him).
Incidentally, Dr. Robert Grossman is telling his story on the front page of CNN. Unsurprisingly, his story does not support Zoe’s dark intimations, whatever the heck they are.
This is among the best threads ever.
I came here right after watching the ABC special last night to see if it was being discussed.
This is important to me because I get so tired of listening to guys on bar stools talk about something “they saw on TV” that proves there was a conspiracy. Stuff of Urban legends.
All the forensic evidence and facts point to 3 shots coming from the sixth floor of the TBD. We know that Oswald was up there. We know that he ran away and shot a police officer. We know he bought the rifle used to kill Kennedy. We know there wasn’t enough time to successfully coordinate all the logistics involved in framing Oswald. Is there anything that I just said that is not true?
Why didn’t he admit it? Probably for the same reason he denied killing Tippit, which we know he did.
I honestly don’t see what the debate is. There’s only a conspiracy because people want there to be one. You could take any event in your life and turn it into a conspiracy if you dug hard enough.
Seems like if Oswald had missed, there would have been no US v North Vietnam war as we know it:
http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2003/11/22/vietnam/index.html
Robert McNamara has apparently been addmitting so publically since the mid eightes, without much fanfare, and it has been confirmed by some recently released tapes: Kennedy had decided, a month before his death, that we would be completely out by 65, and that we would lose the war if we tried fighting it. The records of this decisions were removed from the internal record, and they have only recently come to light.
Another interesting thing that’s not a new revelation, but hasn’t gotten much attention, is that Johnson essentially rigged the Warren Commision. But not because they wanted to cover up a government conspiracy to kill Kennedy. In fact, ironically, because they wanted to defuse a FAKE conspiracy theory: the movement to blame Castro and the Russians, inciting a war.
Fascinating stuff. It doesn’t support conspiracy theories, but it does make you shudder to think how close we came to: a) not having the Vietnam War in our history and b) yet another near miss on nuclear war with Russia.
Ummm, so I’m guessing you missed where I posted that bit about how Kennedy’s alleged decision to withdraw from Vietnam amounted to taking out 250 “advisors” out of 16,000, starting with the least combat-relevant and even then only if the South Vietnamese had adequately replaced the American troops at the whole commie-fighting thing?
As you say, that doesn’t have anything to do with the assassination, but the myth you and Mr. Galbraith repeat does explain the Kennedy martyrdom that keeps the assassination thing alive despite all the evidence to the contrary.
One of your links was broken, and the other doesn’t seem to respond to what I’m takling about. From what I can tell of the other link’s content, it’s major argument is that Kennedy was a staunch anti-communist. But none of this contradicts that. What they, and the tapes, and McNamara’s own account all say is that Kennedy agreed to a plan that involved a withdrawl of US personnel with or without victory by 65. It wasn’t a matter of being soft on Communism, but a matter of whether a wider war made sense for the US to fight personally.
Both links appear to be correct, though the server is down at the moment (no surprise, given the 40th anniversary). And while Mr. Galbraith is free to claim whatever he wants about an imaginary win-or-lose withdrawl by 1965, Kenndy’s contemporaneous statements to the contrary weigh rather strongly against that, and his advisors state almost without exception that Kennedy was committed to winning Vietnam.
Again, not that any of that has anything to do with the assassination.
Your job is to refute the particular claims being made, not respond in general. Galbraith is, at least, presenting a new assemblage of documentary and testimonial evidence that your cites do not consider or refute. They include tape transcripts of the President not only agreeing to the phase out, but also discussing how it can either be kept quiet, or spun so as not to clash too clearly with their public optimism about winning the war. When agrees to the initial pullout of 1000 personel, he says “let’s do it, but without a public statement.”
Are you counting McNamara as an exception?
And the Johnson thing does have something to do with the conspiracy theories. It both explains why people were troubled with the Warren Commission (because it indeed wasn’t quite a free ranging inquiry, but had an agenda, albiet one of national security rather than coverup), and the importance of the early conspiracy theories themselves. To some people, pinning Oswald on Castro and the KGB looked like a sure fire way to get the US to engage Russia more forcefully, maybe even going to war. To Johnson, preventing this eventuality was matter of millions of lives, and crushing even a hint of such connections was important. This both explains why conspiracy theorists sense so much going on behind the scenes (because there was a lot going on: just not the sorts of things they were thinking about) but also refutes many of their illicit connections (and indeed Johnson, from the tapes, has always seemed pretty clearly convinced himself that Oswald acted alone and that the KGB had nothing to do with it)
It’s important not to forget that while everyone hails the Cuban missle crisis today as having prevented nuclear war, there were many people back then who thought that nuclear with Russia was inevitable, and that there would never be a better time to strike than now, when our first strike capability so far outstripped Russias. There were people seriously thinking that this was the only thinkable option, and that postponing it would mean the end of the human race, rather than just the end of a few cities and Russia.
I’m continually surprised by one thing- Kennedy wasn’t killed instantly? Apparently the throat wound was sustainable, but just from seeing the Zapruder film and the damage from some of the grislier photos, I’m rather amazed. The doctors did a tracheotomy and tried to save him? He was alive when he came to the hospital, albeit not for long? Is this really possible, given the way his head was blown open?
Minty Green-about the guy with the balckumbrella (who opened and closedit as Kenndy’s car went past)-when he was finally tracked down, what did he have to say?
As I said, I found the FRONTLINE presentation pretty interesting…there certainly was no shortage ofpeople who diidn’t like kennedy.
What happened to carlos marcello (the New Orleans Mafia crime boss). Did he experience a naturaldeath?
It was a guy named Louis Witt, who says he was protesting Kennedy’s appeasement policies. The umbrella is apparently an obscure reference to Neville Chamberlain. Here is his House Committee testimony in 1978.
How 'bout you first show some evidence that he was involved in the assassination, then we’ll worry about the details of his death.
Minty, if you can’t kick people off the jury and you need to rely on your obnoxious powers of persuasion, get a back up career. You are correct that I am not a devotee of the Kennedy Assasination lore. I did know however that the gun was bought under an assumed name. So you want it both ways, Osawald is an low life, minimum wage, loser incompetent and he develops an assumed identity. Maybe, but why? Just like all of the other coincidences, “it could happen”. Do you have any background in statistics? I will even concede a high correlation factor given the unsavory/incompetent nature of many of the participants, but too many coincidences, not could, HAD to happen.
But for me at this point it is more of a gut reaction against someone (Moderators, when did you start letting people say fucker in these discourses?) who says he has all of the answers. Whenever somebody says he knows all the answers and there is no reason to discuss it further, I will instinctively take the other side. I imagine you will peruse your much loved and well worn copy of the Warren Commission report and cry out “Why don’t they believe, Oh God, why don’t they believe as I do?” AIN’T GONNA HAPPEN. Too many people pointing out discrepancies and too many people wanting to stop all discussion = recipe for conspiracy proponents.
Since you asked, I am in the investment businees. My job is to search out discrepancies in valuations, which are caused by contradictory facts, unwarrantred assumptions, unrealisitic reliance on others motives and a hubris of know-it-all-ness. I don’t need to convince others that I am correct (more time to exploit the opportunity and you can get in big trouble sometimes by touting your positions) but rely on the eventuality that the contradictions and Rube Goldberg machinations that justify erroneous valuations fall by themselves. But if the gov’t supported those discrepancies in valuations and certain people wanted to choke off all further evaluations (don’t want to hurt the gov’t’s feelings?), me and mipswoman might be in some financial trouble.
Just this AM, I realized that if Peter Jennings, John Gambling (sp?) (obnoxious conservative NYC radio personality) and Minty all say cased closed, go home and don’t talk about it, I know I am on the side of the angels.
You’re babbling nonsensically again, and you’re still not presenting any evidence of conspiracy.
mipsman, apart from minty’s obnoxious style, you keep saying that there are too many coincidences, too many things that don’t add up. But we’ve been asking, again and again, just what those unanswered questions are. You have yet to mention one as far as I can tell. Just some general assertions about how things don’t add up. Well, what are those things? To me, it looks as solved as any murder can possibly be.
For those of you who missed it the first time a FoxNews repeat will give the truth in less than an hour.
Wow is this the same Fox that brought us that oh so intelligent and believable Moon hoax show?
Feh.
Oswald alone. Sorry but sometimes mediocre presidents are killed by mediocre nut jobs. It’s the way of the world.