This is a good way to accept it, I think. They’re not spending the money on their kid, per se. They’re spending it on saying goodbye and coming to grips. I tend to agree with the OP overall, but this helps me get to a better understanding.
And I agree that while it’s fine for you to tell us anonymous folks, you should keep your opinion to yourself as far as those involved are concerned. No good would come of criticizing their choices.
I like this idea - you could say something like you’re not in a position to give right now, but you plan to do this in future.
I don’t care about how others spend their money unless the money comes from the government. Then I care.
I did not know that, thank you. So, why do I hear about so many very low income families begging for financial help when a loved one has incurred medical expenses?
We had excellent medical insurance when hubs had open heart surgery and we still ended up owing over 10 grand due to out of network doctors and lab expenses.
So, you feel you have the right to tell me how I should spend my Social Security or civil service retirement money? That seems pretty rude to me.
If your money comes from the government, then I should have a say in it.
Does that include government employees?
That is an interesting statement. Please tell us more.
A quarter of my retirement income comes from my years spent working for a county with a name you probably don’t even know. How could you possibly feel entitled to have a say in how I use that money?
Depending on state, even being very low income doesn’t necessarily qualify someone for Medicaid. Childless working-age adults who aren’t already on disability, for example, can have a very difficult time getting coverage in states that did not expand Medicaid under the ACA. With kids, it’s more commonly the other financial burdens rather than direct medical bills that lead to fundraising appeals, such as lost income when a parent has to quit their job, or a wheelchair accessible vehicle.
Because it is very, very possible for someone to have too high an income for Medicaid and still have either no insurance or be unable to afford what’s left over after the insurance pays. That’s why you will sometimes read about couples who can’t afford to get married because one spouse’s income will make the other ineligible for Medicaid but won’t be enough to be able to afford hundreds or thousands a month in copays etc with private insurance. And it’s very often a year after year thing - I can afford a one time $10K out-of-pocket medical expense, but I probably wouldn’t have been able to afford it every year for the last 40 years.
I would think there’s a distinction between regular old government employees’ payroll/pensions and what amounts to handouts from the government.
The public has a right to know what the government is paying people for. In the case of government employees, the government is paying for labor/services, be it via payroll or pension.
In the case of handouts/entitlement programs, that right comes in knowing/controlling what that hand-out is spent on. We don’t want food stamp people buying champagne and caviar, for example, so we have a right to restrict that. And I think most people would object to public funds being used to fund absurd funeral extravagances.
The whole point is that most of those public dollars was one that someone else worked to earn, and that the government appropriated via taxation- income, sales, etc… So from the perspective of the taxee, there’s a sort of opportunity cost concept- was that dollar well spent? Could I have done better? Was it wasted by the government?
That’s where those of us who think the people have a right to see what hand-outs are spent on are coming from.
Can we please drop this offensive sidetrack about “government handouts” with its barely concealed racism and contempt for impoverished people? Or take it to the Pit if you’d like to continue that conversation?
Just curious: who in the world mentioned race before you did?
Modding: Until an actual MPSIMS mod shows up. This does not help end the hijack.
Moderating:
These posts have been returned to the thread (slightly out of order) because they were not a hijack from the question of the OP, about judging how other people spend their money. And because MPSIMS allows for broader topics than P&E.
However:
If you think something is inappropriately racist, just flag it. Don’t accuse other posters of racism outside the pit.
(note that this thread may either close or move to the pit soon, however, if it stays on this track.)
Moderating:
Assuming that all government payments are “handouts” is unduly political for MPSIMS, and really belongs in P&E or the pit. It’s okay to express a desire to judge how other people spend your tax dollars, but not to put down the people who get those dollars.
Moreover, there’s a case to be made that money in general “comes from the government” to a significant extent. We all agree that it’s not realistic to assume that the entire pre-tax sum on your paycheck or your business earnings is “your money” to dispose of however you want, right? It’s not humanly feasible in the present state of society to live in a modern economy without any—in fact, a lot of—government functions. And government functions cost money.
So a significant chunk of what you think of as “your money” that “you earned” is in fact resources that both morally and legally you owe to the government. Because you wouldn’t be able to live in a functioning society that would let you “earn” that money if it weren’t for government.
Now, the question of how much money various individuals should be considered to owe to the government and for what reasons and for what uses is a hugely complicated issue that is endlessly debatable in the form of tax policy. So I’m not claiming that we all ought to be in automatic agreement about the exact amount of taxes that each of us should pay.
But I think it’s very reasonable to point out that in general, tax breaks and tax credits can be considered “money from the government” just as much as means-tested government benefits are. If, for example, Crafter_Man’s jurisdiction gives him a tax break on his business expenses or whatever that results in their not having the revenue to fund a better transit system that would enable more low-income workers to commute to better jobs, he’s getting “money from the government” at the expense of those other workers’ prosperity, and in theory they’re just as entitled to have a say in what he does with it as he is to have a say in how they use their food stamps.
I know that the standard conservative/libertarian response is to declare that all their pre-tax income really is “their money”, and any tax break or credit they get is just “allowing them to keep more of their own money”, which shouldn’t be compared to “government handouts” like food stamps or retirement benefits or whatever. My point is that in realistic terms, that is basically a bullshit artificial distinction founded on a completely unworkable hypothetical ideal of a taxless functioning society. The money that you needed the entire economic and governmental structure of society to help “you earn” is not in any meaningful sense exclusively “your money”, either legally or morally.
Bravo!
What happened to the child that died is a real shame.
The grief of the family is, too. I agree that it sounds like they overspent terribly, and unwisely. Grief makes every choice more difficult. But, most funerals don’t damage the prospects of innocent young people. All this is a real shame.
I feel bad for everybody concerned.
Unless there was an unscrupulous funeral home, or somebody else, who knew how to prey on this devastated family. Somebody who coaxed them to spend ruinously.
If there is, that person or those persons should be flayed on YouTube, and I’d consider attending and throwing salt.
After speaking with the OP, I have moved this to the Pit
Yeah, I wouldn’t say anything to any of the people involved. Who knows if they feel good about spending that money, or they were appalled to learn what the funeral home charged them. Who knows whether they are so in the hole from medical expenses that it doesn’t even matter. But if you don’t feel like you want to contribute to a GoFundMe, just don’t do it, without drawing attention to your decision in any way. Luckily for you, none of this is actually your problem or your responsibility.