I learned so much about sex today (sorry, kinda long)

Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share
1

Well, not so much sex as just attitudes towards sex. It began when me and another guy were talking in the computer lab and the discussion somehow came to promiscuity. He believes that there are two kinds of women: women for relationships and women to fuck. Relationship women should be those who have had relatively low numbers of sexual partners, whereas a girl to fuck can just be a random hot girl from a bar with God knows how many partners. I was a bit unnerved by this train of thought, though it’s not the first time I had ever heard it.

When I asked how he felt about guys who are equally promiscuous as these random one-night-stand girls, he actually defended their position. “It’s in a guy’s nature. It’s the woman’s responsibility to deny sex, and if she doesn’t, well…” At this point I’m thinking that I must be a feminist because I believe that if you’re going to look down on a girl for sleeping around but not a guy who is just as promiscuous, than that is a pretty unfair and hypocritical point of view.

When a fairly attractive young girl (between the ages of me and this other guy) came in, I figured I would have an ally in the conversation. But she actually said that she agreed with him! She agreed that it is the woman’s place not to be “skanky.” At this point I am absolutely baffled that young adults only a few years older than me really think this way.

The conversation seemed to naturally end up with the guy asking both myself and our female coworker how many partners we have had ( :frowning: ). At 24 he weighed in with a staggering (or maybe not?) 12, she only had 2, and I…was luckily able to completely avoid the question until more people came into the lab, thus not having to admit to being a 20 year old virgin.

Uhh…I wasn’t really sure how to incorporate an actual discussion into this…so I suppose I could pose some questions to the masses (whom I hope my male coworker represents a VERY VERY small portion of):

  1. Do you differentiate between relationship potentials and fuck-buddies? If so, how?

  2. Do any of you actually believe that it’s the woman’s place to be “pure” and reject advances; otherwise she is the skanky one, regardless of how many partners the male has had?

  3. Do any of you act drastically different when around friends than SOs? (I.e. Guy being sweet and cuddly when alone with a girlfriend vs. acting embarrassed and like a jerk when the girlfriend tries to act that way when his “guy friends” are hanging around)

Hmm…that’s all I can really think of right now. It was just a definite shocker to find out that I am apparently not a stereotypical guy, because I want to be friends with a girl first, don’t just want to find a random screw at a bar, and consider it hypocritical to call a girl skanky but not a guy. Maybe that’s why I don’t have a girlfriend? Because I’m not a pig?

2

Sounds like a maturity issue to me.

  1. I admit that in my younger days (teens) I broke women into those groupings. But even then I was aiming at 'Is this one worth pursuing long-term with the intent of marrying? But I grew out of it by the time I was 20. I am, indeed, the marrying type.

  2. The so-called ‘double standard’ is stupid and crass. In an age where (relatively) consequence-free sex is available there’s no reason that women can’t enjoy and pursue sex as much or as little as they wish. Implying or imposing something more restrictive on them is, again, stupid and crass.

  3. I admit, again, when I was younger, of not being comfortable being all lovey-dovey with my SO when ‘the guys’ were around. Again, I grew out of it and see that I was, again, stupid and crass.

Intimacy is rare enough in this troubled world that anything that works to separate two people should be worked against.

3

This is all MHO, so YMMV:

1) Do you differentiate between relationship potentials and fuck-buddies? If so, how?

Relationship potentials, for me, means there’s actual emotional attachment involved; that you like someone for their personality, not just their sexual appeal. Someone you just sleep with–it’s all about the sex, and not much else.

2) Do any of you actually believe that it’s the woman’s place to be “pure” and reject advances; otherwise she is the skanky one, regardless of how many partners the male has had?

NO! Absolutely not! Men are just as “skanky” if they sleep around–promiscuity is promiscuity, no matter what their gender!

3) Do any of you act drastically different when around friends than SOs? (I.e. Guy being sweet and cuddly when alone with a girlfriend vs. acting embarrassed and like a jerk when the girlfriend tries to act that way when his “guy friends” are hanging around)

Not really, but certain PDAs are off-limits in front of other people. That’s about all I can think of.

4

:rolleyes: Yes. You dont have a girlfriend because you’re not a pig :rolleyes:
“Fuck buddies” are only for when you are both drunk, becausethen it doesnt count.
As for the other thing (girls cant be sluts, but guys can be studs): well, I guess it just works out better for us guys, eh?

5
  1. Do you differentiate between relationship potentials and fuck-buddies? If so, how?

Well, I’ve only had one fuck-buddy (as apart from relationships and guys I slept with, but that didn’t fit in either of these two categories). This relationship was differentiated from all the others (both relationship and one-night-stands) in the fact that we only got together to, ultimately, sleep together. We didn’t talk on the phone, for example. We didn’t go out to lunch. We didn’t go on “dates”. In a relationship, there was all the other stuff that comes along with a relationship, not just the sex.

  1. Do any of you actually believe that it’s the woman’s place to be “pure” and reject advances; otherwise she is the skanky one, regardless of how many partners the male has had?

Out-moded and offensive. (I’m a woman.) A woman has just as much right to her sexuality as a man has.

  1. Do any of you act drastically different when around friends than SOs? (I.e. Guy being sweet and cuddly when alone with a girlfriend vs. acting embarrassed and like a jerk when the girlfriend tries to act that way when his “guy friends” are hanging around)

Well, as I said I’m a woman, so I hope I can answer this. I’m much more conservative in my expressions of affection/sexuality in public. I’m sure that if your acquaintance were ever to meet me, he would not put me in the slut category. But he would be wrong (by his sexist definition).

BTW - can any Dopers give me a synonym for sexist? Thank you!

6

Ah, no. Fuck buddies are also when you are perfectly sober and realize that sexuality and sexual drives are perfectly normal things. And that it’s perfectly okay to express that need and to get it met, regardless of whether you are in a relationship.

7

Exactly. The “had sex because you’re drunk and horny” encounters are one-night stands, most likely. “Fuck buddies,” aka “fuck friends” or “friends with benefits” requires the friendship part too.

8

I’ve actually seen this attitude pretty frequently. “There are women you screw, and women you marry.” I’ve always wondered; what do you do for sex after you get married? And, what exactly do you think your wife will do if you’re not satisfying her?

  1. Do you differentiate between relationship potentials and fuck-buddies? If so, how?
    Yes, relationship potentials were people I had friendships with. Not someone I met in some bar or club.

  2. Do any of you actually believe that it’s the woman’s place to be “pure” and reject advances; otherwise she is the skanky one, regardless of how many partners the male has had?
    I’ve always seen this as a control issue; usually in younger men who cover their self esteem problems with a macho attitude.
    I once had a discussion with a small group of friends about this. One of the guys stated very firmly “I won’t marry a slut.” Okay. How exactly do you know if a woman is a slut? “If she’s been with more men than I have women.” I thought he was joking. It turns out not.

  3. Do any of you act drastically different when around friends than SOs? (I.e. Guy being sweet and cuddly when alone with a girlfriend vs. acting embarrassed and like a jerk when the girlfriend tries to act that way when his “guy friends” are hanging around)
    Uhhhh…yeah. Lasted about a week. If you can’t be yourself around your friends and your SO at the same time (BTW, your S.O. should be one of your friends) then you’re not ready for an SO.

Everyone’s libido is different, and so is what they consider “a healthy amount of sexual activity.” Sexual compatibility isn’t the most important thing in a relationship, but it’s up there. If you can’t find a comfort zone for both of you, one of you is going to be very unhappy.

9

1) Do you differentiate between relationship potentials and fuck-buddies? If so, how? Never had a fuck buddy, but I think the criteria would have to be similar - I’d have to like and be attracted to them.

2) Do any of you actually believe that it’s the woman’s place to be “pure” and reject advances; otherwise she is the skanky one, regardless of how many partners the male has had? See, if you asked me this, I would say a definite no. But then I think, and we often refer to a friend’s ex girlfriend as a “slut”. I’m not sure we would have called her that had she not cheated on our friend, and generally been a total bitch, but it disturbs me a little that I think of her as a slut rather than a bitch. Although to be fair, I don’t know any equally promiscuous guys, and if I did I might think of them in the same way.

3) Do any of you act drastically different when around friends than SOs? (I.e. Guy being sweet and cuddly when alone with a girlfriend vs. acting embarrassed and like a jerk when the girlfriend tries to act that way when his “guy friends” are hanging around) I think my boyfriend tries to act more manly around his guy friends, but it’s more a case of he won’t babytalk my cat. We tend to treat each other the same around our friends.

10

FTR: Male, 30yrs old

1) Do you differentiate between relationship potentials and fuck-buddies? If so, how?

No. I’m on the conservative end of sexual matters… I can’t have sex with a person I’m not in love with. Sex is mighty important to me, and when it’s someone I don’t care about, I’m just pretending it’s actually someone I do care about.

2) Do any of you actually believe that it’s the woman’s place to be “pure” and reject advances; otherwise she is the skanky one, regardless of how many partners the male has had?

Nope. Both be skanks. Some guys think they need to “score”… probably just to boast with other guys. Sounds like a self-image problem, doesn’t it? :smiley:
But to THEIR moral codes they aren’t doing anything wrong, since it’s between consenting adults. (Except for unwanted pregnancies and STDs. But apparently they aren’t too worried about such.)

3) Do any of you act drastically different when around friends than SOs? (I.e. Guy being sweet and cuddly when alone with a girlfriend vs. acting embarrassed and like a jerk when the girlfriend tries to act that way when his “guy friends” are hanging around)

Nope my SOs have always been friends before being SOs. A gal should be mature enough not to do anything that makes a guy look less macho in front of other men. A guy who goes out of his way to prove his macho in front of the other guys is quite the doofus, though. :slight_smile: The other guys will immediately suspect something is wrong, too, making the effort backfire.

You have to realize that the other end of the sexual liberty spectrum has to advertise. Men who try to keep relationships more dignified have a harder time advertising that fact. :slight_smile: But once you do find someone with the same values, it will be like finding an oasis in the desert.
_
_

And one last thing, everyone lies about sex.

11

Nearly 22 y/o female here.

  1. Do you differentiate between relationship potentials and fuck-buddies? If so, how?
    Since I don’t want a “fuck buddy”, and only pursue relationship prospects, no.
  2. Do any of you actually believe that it’s the woman’s place to be “pure” and reject advances; otherwise she is the skanky one, regardless of how many partners the male has had?
    I don’t approve of promiscuity from either gender. Now, I don’t go around calling anyone a slut or whore, but I don’t think it’s any better when a man is promiscuous than when a woman is.
  3. Do any of you act drastically different when around friends than SOs?
    I generally prefer to pursue relationships with people I’ve known as friends first, so I think I stay pretty much the same.

As for not having a girl because you’re not a pig, nah. It just sounds like maybe you’re hanging around the wrong type of people if this is the normal attitude. Once you find someone who shares your values, I think you’ll be a lot happier than if you tried to act like a “pig” to get a girl who likes pigs.

12

Thank you for posting this; it stongly reinforces my old attitudes that caused me to drop out of school.

I had a similar revelation reading another message board a few weeks ago. A young man had got his girlfriend pregant and discussed it on the board. There were lovely gems about how pulling out was a good method; how condoms were 100% effective, so that bitch probably cheated on you; just get the abortion and go on; how coming on the girl was commonplace; and so on.

I was a bit shocked to say the least, but the lack of “wtf?” posts was telling to me. I guess I’m the one out of the loop - but I prefer that.

12? That’s just not a smart idea, and it shows to me a lack.

And screw the whole virgin thing. All it did was up my sex drive.

I did not wake up the next morning a man, a new person, reflective upon younger years, or whatever. The first time will probably suck and be awkward - your best bet is to do it with someone you care about and who cares about you so you can laugh it off and try again.

Further: sex is not like porn, especially at the beginning. It’s dirty and messy and cleaning up is awkward. And it’s got a smell.

1) Do you differentiate between relationship potentials and fuck-buddies? If so, how?
Well I’m just about engaged, so the question is under my radar. But if I were single, I wouldn’t - because it makes more sense to me to have both aspects in the same relationship.

2) Do any of you actually believe that it’s the woman’s place to be “pure” and reject advances; otherwise she is the skanky one, regardless of how many partners the male has had?
Not exactly. I don’t care for promiscuous people - I find sex pretty boring now - but I don’t think acting on it makes a person “skanky” - curse you for making me type that! :D. Provided, of course, someone isn’t having sex for reasons unrelated to the desire - e.g. to show how mature/hip/manly he is.

3) Do any of you act drastically different when around friends than SOs? (I.e. Guy being sweet and cuddly when alone with a girlfriend vs. acting embarrassed and like a jerk when the girlfriend tries to act that way when his “guy friends” are hanging around)
Not really, anymore. I’m different around different sets of people, definitely, but I have a rather judgemental clique. So, I play into it now. Yeah yeah, I’m the whipped pussy-boy in my group, but I’m also way more knowledgeable and experienced than anyone else, so what do I care?

I’ve heard lots of guys lament “nice guys finish last” enough to realize it’s pretty much a tautology: winners will do what it takes win, whereas nice guys will choose being nice over winning.

I find that much more noble. Don’t go back on that.

13
  1. Well, yeah. Relationship possibilities exist in my worldview. Fuck-buddies do not. If I just wanna get off, I got all kinds of equipment for that; I don’t want or need sex without a loving relationship.

2)No, I think that’s a big load of horseshit.

3)I don’t grab his ass when other people are around, but that’s really about it.

14

When I was a teenager I wanted sex but being a person who liked girls I was always open to more than sex happening, you know, being girlfriend and boyfriend, and it made sense to me that the girls would have similar attitudes overall. I don’t recall feeling any contempt or hostility towards the girls known to be sexually active, or of thinking of them as less desirable for a relationship.

I did feel a lot of contempt for the boys who had a shitty attitude towards girls though.

As it ended up happening, I didn’t have much success with sex or relationships until quite a bit later, and by that time I harbored a lot of bitterness about the whole setup, but I didn’t know it was going to end up being like that when I was younger.

15

Just so you don’t feel alone: 20 is not old for a virgin. My fiance and I weren’t intimate until he was 24 (we were eachother’s firsts). We’ve been dating 7 years now and we’re set to get married next fall. He’s told me repeatedly that held out because he didn’t want to waste the special-ness of sex on some random girl. Don’t get me wrong, he’s got a HEALTHY libido. He just home medicated with lots of porno and toys like others have pointed out.

Don’t be disappointed in yourself just because you want sex to be special. Yeah, it’s messy and awkward, but it’s still special. I say kudos to you for being such a good guy and congrats to the lucky girl who eventually discovers you.

16

1) Do you differentiate between relationship potentials and fuck-buddies? If so, how?
Absolutely. I may find a girl physically attractive but be turned off by either her personality or lack thereof. In that case, she gets relegated to the fuck-buddy pile, although I’ll make this clear before any intimacy.

2) Do any of you actually believe that it’s the woman’s place to be “pure” and reject advances; otherwise she is the skanky one, regardless of how many partners the male has had?
I may get flamed for this, but… yes. Men are, in general, trying much harder to get laid than girls are. Partly this is because of the above- most of us can sleep with a girl we find attractive only in a physical sense, while most girls can’t do the same with a man. That said, I treat both sexes the same way- if a girl’s number is high enough to turn me off, knowing that a guy’s number is as high is enough to keep him away from my female friends.

3) Do any of you act drastically different when around friends than SOs?
Depends. I was in a mild S&M relationship with a girl and would occasionally refer to her around friends (only when she was there) in the same terms I’d use to refer to her in the bedroom, as did she. Normally, though, I’m largely disinclined to call a girl I’m dating “babydoll” or whatever when my friends are around.

I’d also like to mention that you missed an opportunity in your conversation. Like it or not, you ARE a virgin. You’ll learn that college girls have much more varied tastes than high school girls, and to a sizeable minority the fact that you’re a virgin could (and in my experience would) be a powerful turn-on. Only by being open, honest, and even proud of it, though, can you turn it to your advantage. As a secret, all it does is eat at your confidence.
RNATB, pulling for you to meet the right girl since the first thread of yours I read.

17

This might be the smartest thing anyone has ever said on the Boards, at any time.

I’d like to add that none of the above means you won’t enjoy it, because, seriously, it’s lots of fun. Treat it like alcohol- enjoy, but not to excess, and without getting arrested, and it will be triffic.

18

Misogynist if you don’t like women, misandrist if you don’t like men, and misanthropic if you don’t like either.

19

I just thought I would throw this out there.

My ex and his “friends” have a totally unique view of this. They consider the “sluts” the kind you marry. Their opinion is that they are much more fun. One of his friends has a collection of pictures from all the wives “upper body parts”. Fortunately he does not have mine. Although he did manage (in a vulnerable moment) to get me to show him mine (I was trying to save my marriage). For me it was a humiliating experience. The fact that my husband thought it was fun lessened my resolve to save the marriage.

I try to be open minded, but I am not the kind of girl to sleep around and it pains me greatly that my husband would sleep with anyone. It takes me a long time after a relationship is over before I can sleep with someone else. Like now I know he is sleeping with someone already. While I have traded our king bed for a single.

20

[looooooong post deleted]

I think we might’ve just found a topic that’s too complicated for the SDMB.

Regardless, there are two specific points (plus one bonus point :p) I want to address.

2) Do any of you actually believe that it’s the woman’s place to be “pure” and reject advances; otherwise she is the skanky one, regardless of how many partners the male has had?

It’s more complicated than that.

If a person (male or female) disrespects their self, sleeps around, destroys relationships, and is generally hurtful to their self and others, then I would generally consider them a “skank”.

If person (male or female) really likes to have sex, does so with respect and dignity, is careful about who they affect, and respectful of other’s feelings, etc., then he or she is generally not a skank.

Try to get away from thinking that the number of partners is relevant. I’ll make this vague because I have no illusions of anonymity on the SDMB: 12 partners at age 24 is not even approaching “Staggering”.

I don’t know you, but you sound more stereotypical than you think. First, don’t assume that all guys are like your co-worker, and secondly, don’t assume he was even telling the truth. A lot of guys try to act macho around (especially younger and less experienced) other guys but purr like kittens when females are present.

Well, again, I don’t know you, but the overwhelming diagnosis for lack of a date is underconfidence. If this was a real question, open another thread and we can talk in more detail.