SPOOFE:
Welcome to the club. You’re on her “list”. Her “gutless-I’ll-pretend-to-ignore-you-but-really-won’t” list. Many of us are. You’re in good company, though!
Bullshit. It has everything to do with her political beliefs, and nothing to do with clarification. I liked you assholes better when you weren’t pretending to be truth-seekers.
Milo’s questions have indeed been answered over and over, by RTFirefly, Spiritus Mundi, wring, elucidator and others (including Stoidela).
Just to illustrate, here are a few links. Not that they’ll do any good, of course.
No, no. Don’t play “linky-linky.”
Let’s play “apples and apples.” It’s right up there a few inches for you to read, cut, paste and answer.
What’s incorrect? Who is/are the evil wrongdoer{s}?
(This is the place where you continue to avoid the scenario as presented to you, because you can’t logically refute it.)
And while we’re answering questions, I’d like Stoidela’s evidence for the evilness of Republicans. We’ll even use her definition for evil. Please submit one or more instances of inherent evil, for any or all of the following categories, which can be applied exclusively to a conservative(s).
Well, I believe that I started a thread (which is 90% responsible for the vilification I receive around here, no doubt) about Republican/Conservative philosophy, and my opinion of it. I believe it to be inherently selfish, without regard for consequences that go beyond the financial pages. Apart from the lipservice given to “family values” and being “tough on crime” as a means of advancing a socially repressive agenda in terms of civil liberties, [sub](which is pretty damn evil right there, actually)[/sub]I have never read or heard of a Republican politician or pundit citing much of anything outside stockholders as their reason for doing/believing anything.
Applied, the GOP platform will have evil results: destruction of the planet being foremost among them and my primary issue among many. It is always the GOP that is first to turn to destructive acts to solve a problem/make a buck (Hey! Vote for me! I won’t hesitate to drill for oil in Alaska!), and it is always the GOP that will block legislation that is designed to help the environment but which may cost companies money.
I consider reckless disregard for the health of the planet and the creatures on it morally wrong, wicked, causing ruin, injury and pain, certainly indicating future misfortune, and blameworthy. And when it comes to politics, it has been my observation that among the most popular parties it is Republicans who are most often likely to pooh-pooh the facts of the environmental destruction which is happening around us every second of every day. In fact, I cannot ever recall hearing a self-identified Democrat pooh-pooh environmental issues at all, even though they do not all agree on the extent of the problem and the acceptable answers. (I have, however, heard/read of a very rare Republican here and there who takes it seriously, to be entirely fair.) This alone would be enough to justify the label of “evil”, and since it is what is closest to my heart and the issue that motivates my passions above all others, I will leave it at that for now.
I have also said, right here in this thread, that I do not believe that most Republicans set out to do what they believe to be evil, it’s just that they refuse to accept the evil results of their actions or potential evil results of the actions they wish to take but have been prevented from taking.
Now, some may argue that evil automatically implies intent, but I do not agree, and the definitions do not cite that. Which is still not to let Republicans off the hook entirely. In the case of #5, I think evil still applies in terms of maliciousness, most recently and publicly as regards those Republicans who made it their business to harass Clinton to death. There was a whole lotta maliciousness goin’ on. And I still can’t figure out why. Although I do have a book on my Amazon wish list that I am going to get soon: * It’s the Stupidity, Stupid : Why (Some) People Hate Clinton and Why the Rest of Us Have to Watch * by Harry Shearer
It is almost certain that you will not agree with me, but that is utterly beside the point. I was asked why I assign the label of evil. I have now told you. Whether I am right or wrong is completely debatable, of course. But never let it be said that I don’t have my reasons!
Stoid
Why yes, Milo. Let’s rehash pages and pages (and pages and pages and pages) of election discussion right here in this unrelated thread, just because…well, pretty much just because.
Oh, and don’t forget to call people names if they refuse to do it. Good, I see you’ve got that covered.
You’ll really claim rhetorical victory on this issue, even though it’s been picked apart for weeks and weeks, if people don’t deign to go over it all again here? What am I saying…of course you would. Talk about a waste of bandwidth.
that perhaps I have not been crystal clear about this:
I consider environmental destruction to be the single greatest crime of all time. Worse than anything else. Period. There is * no greater evil * in my book than destroying the single most spectacular and magical place in the entire universe that we know of. Everyone gets all atwitter about the condition the earth would end up in if we ever had a nuclear war…well, the way we’re going, the planet is going to end up pretty much just as fucked as it would be after a nuclear war, just not instantaneously.
Every one of us participates in this destruction to some degree, because it’s virtually impossible to avoid. But some of us are at least ** prioritizing ** ** NOT ** doing it.
So yeah… so long as they pooh-pooh global warming and vote against the Endangered Species Act…Republicans are EVIL.
stoid
So the people who voted for Clinton in '92 were motivated by evil when they voted him into office? Because I don’t recall the bumper stickers saying “It’s the ENVIRONMENT, stupid.”
well it’s good to know that you think Gore is evil too. You do think he’s evil? Right? After all, it’s hard to find many democrats more anti-environmental than Gore
I don’t know why anyone else voted for him. I voted for him because I trusted him to do better than Bush at just about everything, and I was right.
Oldscratch:
Yep. Uh huh. Whatever you say.
stoid
Ummmm forgive me. I can’t figure out if you’re being sarcastic or not. Can you fill me in. I mean, why would you support Gore if he’s anti-environmental.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by oldscratch *
**
I dunno, Oldscratch…some things are just too mysterious to explain. <shrug>
stoid
Ah. I get it now. The Republicans are evil, because you say they’re evil.
Let’s talk about the environment though. Specifically, Al Gore’s own lipservice to the environment. In fact, I’m gonna go back to a post I made a few weeks ago. You’ll find it in this thread, http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=47033
And to this, you, Stoidela, responded,
So, from all this, and using your logic, I believe a valid conclusion would be that Gore is also evil. It’s only a matter of degree. And when you can show conclusive evidence of global warming, please publish it. There’s an awful lot of scientists convinced it doesn’t exist.
I also wanna address your claims that Republicans are selfish and greedy. Apparently you believe creating jobs and capital equates to greed. I guess you’d rather enslave the unfortunates to the government through welfare addiction. This, the crushing of the spirit of humanity, in my opinion, is the true evil. Just how many people have their livelihood riding on the back of what the liberals want to be the permanent underclass now? Do you not believe these welfare administrators and clerks have a desire to maintain their own standard of living? Do you suppose they distrubute your largess through altruism? The conservatives, on the other hand, only wish to create capital. And I can tell ya, government re-disribution programs will never do that. Only the marketplace can create wealth and only wealth will ever eliminate poverty. This is so simple.
Yup. I knew you might come back with this, Milo. But I have no intention of cutting and pasting for you, since obviously you have an information retention problem. If you’ve forgotten every previous discussion you’ve had regarding the points in your scenario, I’m confident you’ll again pretend your points were ignored later on in this very thread.
See, guys; the charge wasn’t “You liberals have never completely swayed us with your arguments”, which would’ve been truthful and reasonable. Instead, you’re playing the “refresh my memory” game, claiming that only addressing your points in this thread counts. Now I could address your scenario Milo, but what would that prove, other than that we still disagree? Instead, I’ll respond with a hearty and appropriate “Fuck you!” If you object to the “GOP is EVIL” charge, fine; argue against it. But don’t pretend we’re afraid to answer your particular political spin for the umpteenth time.
You object to Stoidela’s single-minded anti-conservative tone in the OP, Milo? Compare and contrast it to this classic OP. Any points of similarity? You know, you (and others on this MB) should really be grateful to Stoidela for her most inflammatory posts. Ever wondered how you appear to liberals when you post jingoistic comments? Take a look at some of Stoid’s OPs.
Scylla said something quite canny yesterday about looking in a mirror. Words to live by.
**
I felt it was related, because I was trying to get at the heart of why, exactly, Bush is an evil wrong-doer. In summation, now that it’s all over. That kind of thing. Feel free to disagree.
And who did I call a name because they refused to do it?
Gadarene - If you’re referring to my “chicken-shit” comment Re: Stoidela … she’s a chicken-shit for oh, so many reasons beyond not responding to the scenario I presented above.
As has been pointed out, her veiled attacks and “I don’t respond to personal insults” when challenged on them, essentially using the “la-la-la, I’m not listening to you,” 4-year-old tactic.
xeno: Yes, please do go back and read the OP. The thread title was more inflammatory than I intended, and I said so later in the thread.
However, if you want examples of liberals who feel they are morally and intellectually superior to anyone who voted for Bush, you don’t have to look very far. There are at least a couple in this thread.
So, what in that OP outraged you, then?
Stoidela…Chrono and others…
I’d like to thank you so much for being able to convey so effectively in all of your posts what I am not nearly educated nor articulate enough to do myself. Thank you.
Stoidela, I would like to add my own personal pet outrage at the Republican adgenda…that’s the “Every man for himself” code. Of course so many of them, especially the leaders of this party are born with silver spoons in their mouths. I do hope one day they choke on them. While the environment is important to me, people and their suffering is what gets my dander up. The idea that if you fail in some way to pull yourself up by your boot straps then you deserve to live like vermin in the richest country on earth frankly makes me feel ill. A few months ago I took the Keirsey Temperment thingy. One of the questions really struck me, most of them were easier to answer, this one made me pause. It asked which is more important justice or mercy? I thought about it a moment, and finally decided that while justice is very important, mercy is a quality that this world could use even more. I see very little of that in the “conservative philosophy”. And it disturbs me greatly that ordinary people, who would consider themselves personally charitable, merciful and just do not see that their political affiliations are not baring this out.
Oh well…I need to shut up because I’m am just not good at debating. I am not good at defending my position when faced with being called things like a “liberal racist” and such. I’m not good at explaining why I don’t personally feel like a victim but I’m outraged at the political, economic and social victimization that other women, children, and minorities have to face in this country everyday. Call me a liberal racisit, call me a martyr, call me a moralizer I really don’t care, I thought at some point there we were evolving into a society better than that. I was wrong and it breaks my heart.
Needs2know
Perhaps you’d get more respect if you had some idea about conservative philosophy before condemning it. And if you’ve got such a problem with being born with a silver spoon in the mouth, why don’t you seem to have any objection to the Kennedy family? Maybe you’d get a better reception for your ideas if they weren’t the product of such ignorance.
That title, of course, was "Hey Democrats, Whine here! Tell us how smart you all are and how dumb we all are! "
So, tell me please, Milo which was it?
- I really didn’t understand how those words might be considerered inflammatory
or
2. Some nasty liberals held a water pistol to my head and forced me to type those words and hit submit.
??
Absolutely nothing. I was uninterested in both OPs (yours in the link and Stoid’s here), simply because I felt both were intended to provoke, rather than to promote discussion. You may have noticed that, other than one rant I posted that slammed all the major Presidential candidates, I’ve never responded to a political discussion with categorical slurs against a particular party, and I really don’t find such slurs compelling - against any political school of thought.
I linked to your OP because I felt the anti-liberal tone of it was quite similar to the anti-conservative tone you’ve been complaining about. In both cases, declarative statements were presented as the unadulterated and inarguable “truth” of the situation, and it was quite obvious that no counterargument would be entertained. I simply wished to point out that those who are excoriating Stoid for this attitude are IMO holding her to standards of behavior which they do not wish to apply to themselves.