I Made My Kid Go To His Own Parent-Teacher Conference Yesterday

Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share
1

He’s 15 now, a sophomore in high school. And for 11 years, give or take, I’ve had the same PT conference discussion twice a year. There’s a script, shall I share it with you? I shall:

Me: Hello! I’m Mrs. Not, Kyle’s mother.
Teacher: Oh! Hello! Kyle…Kyle’s such a delightful person. He’s so intelligent and sweet…but…
Me: But he’s a lazy little cuss?
Teacher (relieved): Oh! Well, yes. He just doesn’t do the work! I don’t know why not - it’s not too hard for him. In fact, I’d love to see him in honors or even skip a grade, but with scores like this, I just can’t justify it. If he would just turn in the homework, he’d be at the top of his class! He’s actually the smartest kid in the whole school, he just…doesn’t do his work!

I’m a little sick of this conversation, to be honest. We’ve tried every strategy offered, and they all work…for about two weeks. Mostly what happens is he gets F’s at the quarter period (in the classes he doesn’t like - the others are A’s), and pulls them up to a C or B or even A for the Semester grade, which is the official one. He’s managed to be 15th in his class with this technique, but it’s fucking exhausting, and sooner or later, it’s not going to work anymore.

So yesterday, on a whim, I decided that I was so sick of having this discussion, I wasn’t willing to do it again. So he came with me to the PT conferences, and he sat down and talked to the teacher. I listened, and made it clear that I was willing to facilitate things, but this was his issue. He had, as you can imagine, No Fun At All.

The first one, he tried some beautiful psychobabble bullshit about not having Foresight and the lack of Rewards for Diligent work. (I swear, you could hear the Pooh Capitalisation coming out of his mouth.) Luckily, his Lit teacher is way too smart for that. “Two weeks ago, I gave you a sheet of paper with 11 missing assignments and gave you until Friday to turn them in. You gave me 3. Where does Foresight come into it?” Oh, snap!

By the third teacher, he was both humbled and calmer: “I didn’t do it 'cause I didn’t do it.” he said, “I have no good answer.”

It was really hard to watch a 15 year old boy stammer and turn red and wipe away the stray tear when he thought no one could see. I simultaneously feel bad that I ambushed him and yet glad that HE had to face the consequences of his actions, and HE got to see what I’ve been going through all these years, sitting in front of disappointed teachers with expectant looks, waiting for someone to come up with answers for why he’s not doing his work.

He came home and did his Spanish homework and showed it to me. Here’s hoping he actually turns it in today.

2

Good on you. It’s good that someone else does it to him before he gets read the riot act for not putting the cover sheet on his TPS reports.

3

As an occasional teacher, may I kiss your feet?

Your plan was a thing of beauty.

4

Better now than in 20 years. Hope it works!

5

This makes me Pee my Pants a little. :smiley:

6

I had some of the same issues as a kid. I was smart, but hated homework (especially the daily work I got in math class). I’d never drop into the F range, but I’d have to work very hard to pull myself up into the C/B range. This lasted until the last year or so of High School. Nothing specific really happened, but I just started working more diligently, and my work ethic got better in college, too. Now I’m pretty good at it - and I think I’ve learned a few things about how my brain works on this subject that might offer some clues to you as to how to help Kyle.

  1. I’m a big procrastinator. You wouldn’t know it now, but I was. Still am, actually. I combat it by two methods - If possible I do the work the minute I am assigned it, as if I let it sit, I’m likely to let it slide. If I can’t do it immediately, I set a reminder in Outlook to pop up and annoy me at a specific time so that I do it. A very specific workplan might be something that would structure his time in a way that would be useful. If he can understand that it will save him time overall, he might be able to get behind the idea.

  2. I was kinda bored by the work I did in school. Now, I find science and math to be fascinating. At the time, I hated them. Part of it was the teachers, but part of it was not seeing the applicability. If you know what Kyle would like to do long term, you might be able to tie that in to his current work to show him how it will help him to work on those things now. I kind of think that some quality tutoring on those subject might have helped.

Now, I don’t know if my 16-year old self would have heeded the advice my 42-year old self would give, but I think its worth putting out there.

7

That’s exactly the realization that my elder boy has come to. He has even used the words “…but those are just excuses. I just didn’t do them.” He’s in grade 9 and needs to get his shit together, and he finally, FINALLY, after nine years of the same shit you’ve gone through, FINALLY realizes it.

8

Congrats to you.

I was a little like your son, except I just blew off my homework or left it at home and turned it in when I felt like it. I never had great social skills with my fellow teenagers, but I knew just how to manipulate my teachers to let me turn my work in late. I always knew what to say and how to say it, and with only bare amounts of studying (in my hardest classes, Biology and Pre-Calculus and Chemistry – Physics was a breeze for me) I pulled 5th in my class.

I regret that. It got me a good scholarship along with my PSAT scores, but it took me YEARS to learn how to study in college. I ended up scraping a C average because I just didn’t know how to work. Entering the work force taught me that lesson, well enough that I started taking much harder programming courses and made stellar grades 6 or 7 years after graduation.

If the cost/benefit analysis were such that I could go to school full-time again, I know I could do better this time. I’ve considered going back for a second bachelor’s degree, maybe go for a master’s, but I doubt it would really pay off in the long run as much as just learning the necessities would.

But if I’d just learned those lessons when I was seventeen, not twenty-seven…

9

Good for you. Excellent choice.
I’m just curious, since it’s obvious you’ve investigated lots of possibilities, is he turned on by the idea of getting to college early? He’ll have to navigate the same accountability terrain, obviously you’re brilliant to put him there now; and once he does prove himself responsible, would he enjoy a more rigorous environment as a reward?

I never knew it was a possibility when I was a kid, and in hindsight I think it would’ve helped me.

10

Me too! That’s the really fun and ironic thing about this. The thing is, we have different thresholds for “panic about your grade and do some work to bring it up.” For me (like you, it sounds) that panic set in around a threatened C, and I’d do the work to bring it up to an A or B.

That’s part of what makes this so hard - I was a lazy cuss, too! I was also one of the smart ones and got by on my charming the teachers and test taking abilities. I got that it was just a stupid game and one had to jump through hoops, but not all the hoops. I’d do projects and tests with high points and skip low point homework assignments that couldn’t hurt my average too much. And, like you, found that come to a screeching halt once I got into college.

And he does want to go to college - in engineering or architecture, two fields in which, yeah, his American History or Literature education might not matter much, but their affect on his GPA sure will. I just don’t know how to really communicate that to him so he groks it. He knows it, I’ve said it often enough, as has his dad and teachers and all the other dull boring grown-ups in his life. Even his adored Aunt Gina can’t seem to make him see the light.

Thanks for your feedback, guys. I was sort of bracing myself for some negativity, but I’m glad to see I wasn’t out of line.

fessie, I really don’t know anything about that option, either! Who would I talk to for information, do you think? He goes to a terrible Chicago Public School, where they don’t really know what to do with him.

11

His school might know. Or you could ask some of the moms here. Are you close to one of Chicago’s colleges, perhaps you could call them?

I can appreciate that it’s difficult to get kids into history, despite this amazing election we just finished. I always figured some of the well-made documentaries (or non-fiction-ish movies) out there could fill in the gaps, but maybe they don’t.

12

I skipped homework too. I felt that it was pointless if I wasn’t going to get uber points for it and I already knew the material. The kid’s right, in a way, when he says there’s no reward for doing the work…and it is work. If I were you, I’d offer a monetary reward that’s tied to each and every little point he gets. Perhaps GPA. Don’t pay him for the grades, make each increment truly tiny. If you paid me to get an A, I might just sacrifice some of the money and get a B. If you paid me for each GPA point, I’d make sure to max out the easy ones. Just a thought, and you might have already tried that.

I’d think about getting him into AP or CLEP programs. Convince him that he’d better do it now while it’s free and he’s not getting drunk every night so he doesn’t have to pay thousands of dollars in college to do it when he could be partying. That’s my one major lesson from high school. Shoulda taken the free stuff on offer.

13

WhyNot, is your kid my kid? Well, I guess not, since my kid is a girl, and 17, but otherwise…

And are you me? Because I did the same thing, at right around the same time.

I wish I could tell you that it had some lasting impact.

I was the exact same way when I was a kid (actually, I was much, MUCH worse), and I’ve somehow become a productive member or society. So I just take deep breaths and tell myself she’ll be fine.

14

Having been this kid…I hate to break it to you, but it will continue to work throughout his life. Schools – and even colleges now – cater to the lowest common denominator, that means that anyone who is capable of throwing the curve gets bored out of his/her skull and is more than capable of playing the lazy game.

What you did will work for a while, but then he will find once again, that being lazy and still getting good grades is much more fun than being bored off his arse, working himself silly with “busy work” (which is what I still consider homework to be), and towing the line for a grade just slightly higher. What he needs is something to focus on that can be taken away if he isn’t doing what he needs to do. Or harder classes that actually challenge him. Either one.

I wish you luck in motivating him. My son is so much like I, that I am expecting to be dealing with this same issue soon enough. Ugh. Hugs to you for what you’re going through. I guess the good thing for me is that I have no guilt for putting my parents through anything because of it – they never gave a shit, lol. I don’t think either of them even bothered to sign my report cards once I hit 4th grade…

15

Must be an underachieving Doper thing :D. An “F” didn’t make me panic at all - I just looked at them resignedly, with maybe a slight bit of sad regret, like a well-fed cat pondering the mouse he had been playing with that had finally expired from a heart attack. Like your son I got “A’s” in classes I liked ( like history classes - who woulda thunk it? ), “B/C’s” in classes I was somewhat indifferent to, and “D/F’s” in classes I just didn’t like at all ( geometry - ugh ).

I got into a state college on the back of strong test scores triumphing over mediocre grades and cleaned up my act…oh, years later. I mean years. I won’t even tell you how many incompletes I logged in my first couple of years of college, though I only sunk into academic probation status once ( I stopped getting “C/D’s”, but I was less successful for awhile negotiating not doing required course work - my grades became very binary for a year or so ). As it happens I ended up becoming a professional student/college hobbyist and ultimately it didn’t end up killing my bottom-line in terms of financial stability or happiness. But it definitely impacted the trajectory of my life.

I think you did a fine job making your son face the music like that. Unfortunately I will say it wouldn’t have worked for me any better than any of the other strategems you employed. Maybe two-four weeks ;). But then I was wayyyy self-compartmentalized even at that early age. May your son be more amenable to pressure :).

16

First off, good on you for making him tag along. It’s easy to ignore the issues when you don’t have two relevant figures in your face at the same time. It’s also easier to set up excuses for good ol’ mom when you don’t have the teacher there to refute your claims.

Also, the thought of cash rewards for good grades makes me a little uneasy, but it does work. It works on the same psychology that some kids won’t sit in class and do their work for 6-8 hours per day (really not a very strenuous activity), but are happy to bust ass 8 hours a day making hamburgers and washing dishes at minimum wage. Lots of people like fairly immediate tangible rewards as opposed to promise of a college education after 7 more years of hard work.

Maybe you could set up a system where he gets payed fairly generously for his grades, but only on the basis of consistency in excellence. For example, if his 6 week progress report grades for a given subject are B after the first 6 weeks, B after the second, and A at the end of the semester, he gets paid. If they are C,D,A, he does not get rewarded for procrastination that happened to pan out.

Or, you could just pay him a five dollars for every A on his progress reports. If he doesn’t have a part time job. That’s what my parents did for me, and it helped keep my head on my shoulders.

17

Good on you for taking your son. At his age (and like others), I also blew on some assignments. Unlike him, and even the teachers, I knew I had no one to blame but myself. And I said it plainly. “There’s nothing wrong with me, my family, or friends. I just don’t want to do what I consider shitty POS (yes, redundant) homework/project.” Everyone else was wondering why I had (suddenly, to them) decided to act this way. But I did, and was mature enough to face the consequences. Gave me a B in Spanish (my favorite class! my language, my love!) and C in biology (my profession, my other love!).

In hindsight, would I have done it again? Maybe, maybe not. Some of the projects I would probably had done, while others I would still refuse to do (they’re still against my views).

One thing I was glad to have, and that in a way you’ve shown, is having parents who wanted me to acknowledge it was my own damn fault. In that sense, I think taking the kid to the meeting was good, he needs to face it. My parents never punished me, never really cajoled or pled with me. They just let me be, told me I should be responsible, and that was it. It helped they had little love for my teachers that year. :slight_smile:

18

When I say it won’t work, I mean that literally, in the college classes I’m taking now, it won’t work. There is no graded homework in 3/4 of my classes. There are tests, there’s a midterm and there’s a *cumulative *final and a departmental (and cumulative) exit exam. If you don’t retain that information all semester, you won’t pass with a grade good enough for an engineering program. You don’t have “busywork” - but you also don’t have a suggested way to learn the information. He’s not learned any better than I did how to learn.

Last night, his Spanish assignment was to write each vocabulary word twice in Spanish and once in English. He did it and showed it to me and then said, rather scathingly, “It’s done. That’s all it was. It won’t help, though. If I wrote them over and over and over again it might make me remember them, but writing them each twice is just a waste of time.”

When I suggested that he then write them over and over and over again until he knew them, he looked at me like I had three heads. It just hadn’t occurred to him to do MORE than required so that he could actually learn it. He doesn’t see that homework is the teacher’s attempt to show him how to *study *- for him, it’s just points to a score like a video game.

And, to be honest, it hadn’t occurred to me either until this semester, at 33, when I’ve been doing all my algebra problems over and over and over, long past the point when I earned the homework credit. And guess what? I’m scoring 100% on the tests because I’m actually learning it. Wacky, that.

But yeah, it might be something he just has to learn on his own.

19

You have to do what you have to do. You can’t ignore this, so good on you for doing what you did, and don’t let up.

I was your son in High School (well, metaphorically speaking, of course!). Teachers would always open the conversation with my mom (and not just with her, also with each other so some of them said - in fact, I switched High Schools at one point, and three teachers had heard about me!) in the same fashion: “he’s so smart, but incredibly lazy”.

And I was. And to some extent I still am, I just found ways to combat that lazyness. Now I’m 29 and still going to school, paying for the stupid mistakes of youth. Don’t let that happen to him!

I sometimes tell my mom how right she was and how I wish I would have listened to her.

20

Yeh. Pretty much. I haven’t been able to teach my kids how to study – I never needed to myself, so how can I teach them a concept as foreign as sitting down and poring over something that I just get?

I know you think that college is different, but for many of us, it really wasn’t. There’s not as much busy work, but you quickly figure out what papers matter and which ones don’t. And you just don’t waste your time with the ones that won’t affect your grade as much.

It’s funny that money motivated me – I mean, I was writing about 3 - 4 term papers my senior year – and didn’t even write my own! I still graduated in the top 30 with a 3.9 unweighted GPA. I was about $100 richer for the term papers, but my English grade was much lower than those whose papers I wrote.