Very happy childhood - lived in a rural area, white picket fence around the backyard, any serious crime nearly unheard of (left our place unlocked when we were home), parents were happy and stayed together, good grades in school, kinda nerdy but had a good core or fun nerdy friends to hang with.
When I was a young teenager, I took up a couple of babysitting jobs because it was pretty much the only work I could do for some spending cash. I didn’t enjoy it at all, and stopped for that reason. I didn’t look forward to seeing the kids, at all. I also never really dreamed of having kids someday - for a while I sort of planned on them because I more or less assumed that just about any man would want children and of course since everyone was telling me “you’ll change your mind someday” I figured the adults knew better.
However, my parents encouraged my sister and I that we could do what we wanted in life, and that eventually led us to think that maybe we didn’t have to get married, or have children. Both of us did marry several years out of college, but we don’t want children. I’m the elder and in my mid-30s.
My husband thought he might want one child for a while, and I agreed to keep my mind open. I certainly did, but those “I want to be a Mommy” feelings never arrived. Moreover, his desire to be a father dwindled and then disappeared. We don’t regret our decision.
To the poster who made the “misery loves company” comment - how very true in our case. The sister-in-law who was prodding us to have kids had two teenagers who were doing things like getting awful grades and then crying for Mom to go yell at their teachers (and she did! :eek: ) about how it’s not their fault they have ADD (but no meds/therapy/alternate classes/etc.), or wrecking cars, or drinking/smoking pot underage and bringing home friends to the basement to continue this while the parents are sleeping upstairs, and so on. At this point SIL is paying extra tuition over and above their private college’s usual high tuition to keep two early twentysomethings in special coddle-the-student tutoring tracks, after they spectacularly failed out of competitive universities.
At this point, I’m just really fucking sick of people thinking that they know me better than I know myself. If someday I realize that I wanted kids but now it’s too late, I’ll probably regret it deeply and mourn what could have been. But if I have kids because I assume I’ll regret it if I don’t, and I assume I’ll get all gooey over my own baby and become a great Mommy - and that doesn’t happen - then I’ll at the very least be a disinterested and even resentful mother, and inflict a lot of emotional pain on a kid who might wreak their own version of pain on their own children down the line. Sorry, I can’t have that on my conscience.
If you’re a stepparent who also has biological children, or someone who has biological and adopted children, it seems that you should openly favor the biological children, because they carry your genes and the stepchildren or adopted children don’t. And it should be OK to do pretty much anything on behalf of your kids, even hiring a hitman to murder their rivals’ family members, because your kids’ rivals don’t carry your chromosomes, while your kids do.
Most of us, though, don’t think those are morally acceptable things to do, even if they do promote the survival of your genes.
I think there are enough kids out there. I don’t need to have any more. If my maternal genes ever kick in (I’m only 20) I’d rather try to adopt. It’s difficult but I think taking in a kid with no chance is better for someone like me (not into the whole pregnancy thing, sorry) than popping out one of my own. My friends’ boyfriend of three years was adopted (his birth mother was 15 and a drug addict) and got the opportunity to go to great private schools and is now at a great college. His adoptive parents are good people who were unable to have kids of their own. He got a chance.
And it’s not selfish to not have kids. Some people should not be parents. Some don’t want to. Why the hell should you care? People shouldn’t have kids just because they are “supposed to.”
I feel exactly the same way. I know I don’t want to have my own kids (I’m 29), but I’m thinking more and more about adoption. I’m especially interested in adopting an older child or maybe even siblings. But I guess that’s pretty selfish to think about adopting when I could pass on my genes, huh?
I honestly think there are selfish aspects to both wanting to have children and not wanting to have them. I also don’t think there’s anything wrong with that. These are our lives we’re talking about here. Why shouldn’t we do what we think will make us happy?
Also, for the people who believe a good reason to have kids is because they’ll take care of you when you’re old: there’s no guarantee that your kids are going to do that. Stop by a nursing home sometime and you’ll see what I mean.
Not to be left out, I’ll speak up for another group of childless folks. Those who want to get married and have children, but who haven’t met( or never meet) the right co-parent. Not to knock single parents, but I can’t imagine setting out to be a single parent. And at this point, I’m female and over 30, with a distinctly ticking biological clock, and more or less resigned to spending the rest of my life alone.* This isn’t the life I wanted. I’m not yet ready to settle for a lifetime of loneliness. But I’m darn sure that I want tales of " You can be a happy, successful, COMPLETE person even if you never marry or have children" , and not lectures on how everyone should have children.
On my less morbidly hermit-y days, I recognize that I’ve still (probably) got a decade of fertility left, adoption becomes harder but not impossible as one ages, and there are other ways of nurturing children besides being a parent(biological or otherwise). And if my biggest concern is loneliness, there are ways of combatting that which I am not pursuing at present, even if they aren’t guarenteed to introduce me to Mr. Right. Not that I’m looking all that hard. So don’t feel too sorry for me. Still, the poster whose words everyone is picking on managed to seriously annoy me on behalf of myself and everyone else who would like a chance at parenthood, but may never get one(as well as on behalf of the groups who’ve already spoken up).
bob, I’m a physician who works in a prison. Many of my patients are either children of parents who proved themselves unfit to have kids, or are parents who should never have had kids, or both.
A human being is much more than the way a sperm or ovum makes more sperm or ova.
Bob55, you are one of the kind of people who has annoyed me since I was 19 years old. I do not like children, with very rare exceptions. I don’t like being around children. It would be very unwise for someone who knows they don’t like kids to have one. I have had never had my tubes ties, because male doctors who know me so much better than I know myself have decided in their infinite wisdom that I will change my mind. So I deal with the unpleasant side effects of birth control. I have been doing this for over 26 years. I have not changed my mind. I do not regret not having children. I just regret that there are still simple minded idiots who think they know better than another person what that person wants or needs.
Let not your heart be troubled, my friend. For we may not have kids to visit us once a week in the rest home, we will have saved enough money by not paying for college tuition and braces that we’ll be in the really *nice *rest homes. Who’ll be laughing then, huh?
I had a happy childhood. My parents have a wonderful, loving marriage. I have two brothers I love. I have nieces and nephews I adore. I’ve just never felt any urge to have kids.
I know the stereotype is that women love children–especially babies–and get all gooey around them, but I just don’t. I never fantacized about what it would be like to have kids. I don’t feel any desire to go hold the babies I meet. Even when I was a child and played with dolls, I prefered Barbies or more adult dolls. I never liked baby dolls (except for one horrible experience when mom got me a baby doll that ate and pooped, and I discovered I could make it vomit by stomping on its stomach–mom probably got a few grey hairs from that). My friends will point out a baby and ask “isn’t he just adorable,” and I think he looks pretty much like every other baby. I often have to fake being all cooey when co workers bring their babies around for fear of looking incredibly cold or hurting the mother’s feelings.
I was told for many years that I would change my mind. At 20, I was told that I would change my mind by 25. At 25, I was told I would change my mind any day. At 30, I was told that I’d better start thinking of the future because I was running out of time. At 35, I was told that I’d really better do something about my childless state because I’d already waited to long. Yet my mind never changed.
Now, at 40, I’ve pretty much passed the point where I hit the snooze alarm on my biological clock. The kid-having window is closed. My family doesn’t pester me about having kids any longer. Now they pity me. That would be a lot worse only I’m lucky enough that they avoid saying anything to me.
Maybe, at age 80, I will regret never having children. I don’t regret it now, however, and I doubt I will any time in the near future. So I figure I’ve got several good years of life to make up for a few sad ones when I’m old. At any rate, it would be far worse to find myself 80 years old and regret having kids. I figure that when I’m 80 I’ll look back on having a rich, full, enjoyable life. Perhaps there will be a bit of regret that I never had children. At least I won’t look back with guilt over having children that weren’t loved or wanted like they deserved to be.
I’m content to love my nieces and nephews and be their eccentric, but favorite, aunt.
You can say your folks splitting up has nothing to do with it, but I beg you to reevaluate that.
And just because someone has an opinion different than yours does not make them nasty, judgmental, and narrow minded, please don’t personally attack me. In fact, in person I am a lovely person, I think the internet just hides too much inflection and humor to show this, if we were having this same conversation in a room you’d in no way be offended by me.
And yes, by definition, if you do not want children you are selfish. We didn’t get to this place in the world by having people who only care about themselves. You who say you don’t want kids, why is that? Deep down the reasons are only selfish. You want your life, how dare anyone or anything interupt it. You want to have your material things, you want your free time, you want to go out to clubs or bars, you want your career, or you want to just sit at home and watch TV. Every reason is a want, not a need. Therefore it is selfish. Disguise it any way you like, heck I don’t care. I’m just trying to prevent some of you from regretting it before it’s too late.
And to those who say “well some people shouldn’t have parents just read the newspaper and you’ll see that”…well yes, true. But the people on THIS board are obviously capable of logging onto a website and having an intelligent discussion on the matter, and the fact that you are able to do that says you’ll likely be intelligent enough to raise children.
Well, clearly we got here somehow. And it wasn’t by our ancestors saying “you know I really don’t think I should be having kids”. Deep down we are a slave to our chromosomes, stop fighting it you will only feel empty and depressed
The only reason I mentioned “Conservative” btw was because of the recent stats that Conservatives are having 230 kids per 100, while Liberals are having 160 per 100. I thought it was applicable to the discussion.
Why can’t anyone just have a discussion anymore? It always resorts to personal attacks, and as I’ve said before, when you go there you’ve lost.
Seriously, responses like this reveal your character.
Guess what, I too get annoyed by sounds like that. My son cries all the time, and at first it was very difficult, but as time went on I buckled down, learned to handle it, and learned to help resolve the issue that is making him cry. We all are bothered by repeating screeching sounds, but there’s a reason babies cry and it isn’t pleasant…because those babies who didn’t cry didn’t survive, millions of years ago. Babies cry for a reason, and you can usually get them to stop within a few minutes once you learn them. Being able to get him to fall asleep on my stomach when he was crying 5 minutes prior is worth every screech And guess what, as a woman, your cry tolerance is 10X a man’s. Motherhood makes you want to help that little guy, you wouldn’t want to shut him in a closet like a cat
You said “would add nothing to my life that I don’t already have”. Again it feels like we’re talking in terms of needs and wants here. You have everything you want. Life isn’t about wants, it’s about needs. I’m not sure specifically what your wants are, but the fact that you are on a subscription website says that your needs are being fulfilled at least (food, water, shelter, heat), so clearly there is room for a baby in your life. You just don’t want it, and that goes back to my argument that it is therefore selfish.
Yes, we can. When it comes to uncivilized urges like hitting someone, or hunting for food. But rationale breaks down at the point of procreation. The fact that you are here says that your genes are incapable of no longer being a slave to your genetic heritage and instincts. In the end, the old brain stem (feed, fight, flight, or fornicate) always wins
My counter-argument wasn’t that you wouldn’t have anything to enrich your life, that was a bonus. It was that it is selfish because you are only thinking of yourself and the here and now of your life. Again, needs and wants…
I’m not here to bother or offend people as many of you imply. I’m here to offer you the counterpoint, and if you don’t want it then please don’t post in The Pit. I’m only trying to explain my view of it all, not everyone else’s. It’s my opinion, I realize this. But I thought we were “open-minded” enough (as some of you have implied I am the one who is close minded) to listen to another’s viewpoint.
What the…? A woman’s cry tolerance is 10X that of a man? The fuck does that even mean? And can you provide cites to back it up?
It is not selfish to choose to not have children if you believe there’s a strong likelihood you would not do a good job by the child. It’s far more selfish to reproduce just because you want someone to take care of you in your old age or because you somehow believe your genetic material actually matters to the world. Your “reasons” for having children positively reeks of arrogance and to be honest, its own brand of selfishness.
Can you list one reason you choose to have children that doesn’t actually benefit you personally, besides propagation of the species (which isn’t a problem at the moment?)
One last thing. You’re living in lala-land if you think almost everyone (even intelligent, coherent people) who swears off children would miraculously discover they have a maternal/paternal instinct they didn’t previously know they had once they pop out a little one. Unfortunately, it’s the child who suffers when Mommy and Daddy find out they should have listened to their instincts.
But hey, you never know until you try, right? What’s the harm?
You make a great many absolutist-sounding assertions, Bob55. There’s a strong case to be made for the notion that every action a human individual takes can ultimately be traced back to a self-interested motivation. Labeling such self-interest with the loaded term “selfish” is either judgemental or manipulative, and is not what I would call consistent with an intention to engage fairly in honest.
And insisting that you know better than they how other people really feel wrt a personal decision such as procreation, when they have expressed their lines of thinking quite clearly is, impolite, at best. At worst, it is nasty behavior, engaged in by the narrow-minded, who presume to set themselves in judgement over others.
That’s just creepy, guy. Please clarify the intent of the smiley. Is it to signify that you really are offering up a benign and salutary Truth? Or is it intended to mock the “drink the Flav-R-Ade” quality of the pronouncement, and show that you recognize how creepy it seems when you put it that way?
Actually, Bob, what’s selfish is having children. It’s the ultimate act of egoism: a driving, desperate attempt at immortality. You don’t want kids because you cannot stand the idea that this world might continue without some part of you in it. It’s an action driven entirely by fear and denial. And, let’s not forget how emotionally greedy it is. It’s not enough for you to make your way in the world forging bonds with your peers. You’re so desperate for affection and affirmation that you’ve created a little person so entirely dependent on you, it will essentially view you as a god. If that’s not selfish, I don’t know what is.
On the other hand, not having children is an act of purest charity. I’ve decided not to use up resources beyond those necessary to keep myself alive and happy. I’m not creating half-clones of myself to further crowd and pollute the planet. Everyone of us here who doesn’t have kids is making it possible for your kids to be that much more prosperous. Rather than lecturing us about how we really feel, and what we really need, you should be down on your knees thanking us for making it that much easier for your genetic vanity to thrive.
Now, I don’t hold your “lifestyle choice” against you, but let’s not kid ourselves about who has the purest motives, here. You aren’t doing anyone any favors by having kids. You aren’t helping anyone, except yourself and your own ego.
If people don’t want to have children, great. Excellent, in fact. I like kids a lot and I’d like to have some eventually, but if I don’t, cool. I would never dream of questioning anyone else’s decision to have or not to have children, though. It is in no way my business. And I don’t understand at all this badgering of people who say they don’t want to have children. It’s none of your business, and indeed, wouldn’t it then be better for such people not to have children? They should be applauded, in my view, for being responsible. Far better than, say, what certain of my cousins have done–having children that they obviously didn’t want but didn’t bother to try to prevent, because they don’t take care of them (not because they can’t, but won’t) and instead leave them with anyone else who is willing to take care of them.
Additionally, intelligence is hardly the sole criterion with which we should judge someone’s ability to raise children. I know some very intelligent people who would likely make terrible parents.
Are you not aware that fornication, through a little modern advance called contraception, does not always end in the birth of a child?
I like babies okay, but the new baby smell has always been aversive. If I smell the top of a baby’s head, I feel somewhat sick and have to hand her over to someone else.
