I was terminated. Was it unfair? Should I pursue the issue?

I was terminated. Was it unfair? Should I pursue the issue?

At the end of December of last year, I was terminated from my bartending job at the Hotel DuPont after 10 and a half years of employment. I want to know if it was unfair and if I should pursue the issue. I’ll start at the beginning.
To serve alcohol in Delaware you must have an ABC card issued by the state. To get the card the card for the first time or if it had expired, you need to sit through a 4 hour class that goes over the laws and then take a test at the end (if your card is not expired you can take a half an hour refresher course). Now when I started working at the hotel I was asked for my card so a copy could be made. Until last July that was the only time I was ever asked for my ABC card. July comes and one of my mangers asked for my card, I dig it out and it has expired over a year ago. No problem, every Thursday they have the class and I can go get it renewed. Well I was leaving on my vacation in two days, but I told him I’d get it renewed when I return. Of course I forgot all about it. Come the beginning of December and he asks for it again. Feeling shame that I forgot, I told him that I did have it at home and that I’d bring it in when next I see him. It was a Wednesday and I figured I’d just go the next day and get it. Well, something came up and I couldn’t go. When I saw him next he told me that I can’t work until I have an ABC card and sent me home. Well, that Thursday I went and got my ABC card. There in the class were two other managers and another employee from the hotel. We took the class and got our cards. I called up my general manager and said I have my card and am ready to come back to work. He wants to sit down with me and an HR person first. I show up for the meeting but the HR person is a no show. So I talk to him we go over the facts of what happened. Now I was about to start another short vacation over Christmas. My general manager doesn’t want me to work until I have the sit-down with HR. So we reschedule for when I get back. I’m thinking I’m going to be written up. When I come in for my meeting I find out that they are firing me and that’s that. When I ask why I was told it was an ethical violation. That having my card expired put the hotel at risk. Also I had lied about having the card when I did not have it.

Here are some points and some questions:
• If the main reason I was being terminated was the expired ABC card, why was I not fired in July?
• I know that the others that took the class with me had expired ABC cards. They were not fired.
• There had been rumors going around that come the New Year that the hotel was going to lay people off because of the economy. I believe that this was the real reason I was fired. Other employs that I talked to after the fact also believe this to.
• I had never gotten a written warning while I had worked there. For all accounts I was a good employee.
In the end I did screw up. I let my card expire and then lied when asked if I had it. But others had expired cards and is a lie worth being fired for? There were no negative repercussions from my card being expired. I have a valid one now. I filed a complaint with DuPont ethics hotline on the mater. They never called me back and when I called them back a month later I was told the case was closed and that guidelines were followed. But I don’t think they had all the facts. What should I do? Is this worth calling a lawyer over?

Seriously?

I personally think you don’t have a leg to stand on for a number of reasons.

  1. You let your card expire and did nothing about it for over a year.
  2. You forgot to get it renewed.
  3. You blew off getting it renewed.
  4. You lied about getting it renewed.
    Just because nobody had asked to see your card before is no excuse to let it expire for over a year. It was your responsibility to remember to do it right after vacation. It was your responsibility to not let something come up to prevent you from taking the class. And lying is inexcusable. I’m willing to bet nobody else in the class you took was this far out of status.

Sorry.

Why did they not fire me in July then? others forgot or blew off getting it renewed and they were not fired. i feel that it is unfair that i was fired and not them because of the expired card. i did lie and maybe that was the straw that broke the camels back. i just feel that i got a raw deal because they were looking to cut costs.

Are you kidding me?

I’d have suspended you as soon as I discovered you didn’t have a card, and fired you if you didn’t manage to get it renewed within a week.

They didn’t need to then. Even if they are currently trying to discreetly lay people off, you gave them a reason to let you go.

If I’m looking to cut costs, the liars are the first ones to go.

In general, you can be fired for any reason or no reason, unless it is an illegal reason. “Unfair” is not illegal.

If you feel the real reason you were terminated is because of your race, religion, or other protected class membership or in retaliation for some type of legally protected complaint you had previously filed, then you might at least have grounds for complaint. But the termination needs to be for an illegal reason, not just a different reason from what they said. They actually don’t need to tell you any reason at all. You’re not even disputing the factual nature of the reason they are claiming-making an untrue statement about the card.

These are general principles of employment in an at-will state such as Delaware. If your work was governed by a written contract, such as a union contract, that would determine how your termination should be handled. An actual lawyer might possibly be able to find you an angle, but it seems unlikely.

I find it completely unsurprising that you would be terminated for either the expired card or the lying. In combination it is not surprising at all that you were terminated.

IMHO the best you can get out of this situation is a serious lesson for the future: in the work world, lying about a problem almost always makes it worse. This goes double when the lie is to your manager. Managers will not forgive that one. Your challenge will now be to be honest about this situation, while spinning it as a lesson learned, when you apply for new jobs.

You’ve got no case. Besides, Delaware is an employee-at-will state - you can be fired at any time for any reason as long as the reason isn’t illegal. They fired you for a perfectly logical reason. No lawyer will take your case unless you can pay a big retainer, and then it would only be because he’s unethical and wants to take your money.

Were you able to collect unemployment? If so, be thankful that they didn’t deny you that, because they certainly could have.

Well, you feel like you got a raw deal, but the fact is you didn’t do what you were supposed to do and lied about it. So despite your feelings, you are the one who provided them the chance to fire you, and they took it. So no it wasn’t unfair, and I don’t think you have an issue to pursue.

I’m curious. What came up?

Because they were trying to give you a chance on good faith, never dreaming that you’d let them down like you did?

I was pretty much with you until you lied. At that point you crossed a line between being lazy and being dishonest. If I had found out that an employee of mine lied to me I would have no choice but to document what happened for HR and let that person go. Once you lose my trust how can I be sure you won’t steal money out of the till? Bartending is still a cash business, at least partly, and unless I can somehow measure every ounce of alcohol I am dispensing I have to trust that my employees are honestly charging customers, collecting money from them, and putting that money, minus tips, in the cash register.

Chalk it up to experience and move on. Let’s hope word hasn’t gotten around town and it doesn’t impact your ability to land another job somewhere.

Yes. The fact that you have to ask this question suggests you have a lot to learn.

Well, at that point you had not broken a promise - twice - to get the card, and hadn’t lied about having it. Can you really not see the difference?

Sounds like they were cutting you some slack on the expired card because you were a good employee. You screwed that up when they caught you in the lie.

Keep in mind that lying is a HUGE deal to employers. It’s usually (not saying this is true in your case) indicative of a dishonest person. And dishonesty means skimming from the till, sliding free drinks to friends, etc.

Sorry.

You boofed the pooch, dude.

“Something came up?” Unless it was the death/funeral of an immediate family member, or an acute medical crisis for you or an immediate family member, you don’t have much to stand on here.

Professional/work licensing is ultimately your responsibility. It was required for your job. You not only let it expire (understandable to some degree), you twice failed in your obligation to get it renewed, and then lied about it.

The economy is down, and you work in a hotel. Business travel and tourism are going to be down, and it’s not surprising that a hotel might be downsizing. It’s up to you to sell your “worth” as an employee at the best of times, which these are definitely not.

Take this as an expensive and harsh lesson, learn from your mistake, and don’t do it again in your next job. Good luck with that.

I’m not sure how you would “pursue the issue” given the facts of this case. What court would come out in your favor here?

In all fairness, Bizarro Court might.

Aceospades, your questions have been answered, but let me offer this:

One of the things I clearly remember my father teaching me was to readily own up to my mistakes. Admit them even before they were discovered by others, and take my lumps. The point was that this would build a reputation for taking responsibility, which is a very valuable thing. Partner to this is building a reputation for honesty, which is also a very valuable thing.

I refer you to this joke. There are some things, like what McGregor did in the joke, and lying, that can stick with you for a very long time.

A lot of people don’t want to have dealings with someone who they fear will lie to them. All it takes is one lie to raise the suspicion that more will follow. I think it would benefit you to take this to heart.

Pretty much agree with all the responses above…just gotta add this…

Rumors are assumptions gone awry, but not hard evidence. People will believe in rumors if they feel it would benefit them regardless what the real evidence is. You are feeding off of the emotion you and those other employees created…that is not good.

Six months to get a professional certificate renewed? Six months of missing a class they have “every Thursday”?

Were you tending bar during that time? If so, you realize that you were putting your employeer in jeopardy every time you served a drink. Any routine check by ABC would have led to your employer at least getting a fine and possibly losing their license.

Even if you were fired because of the economy, why do you think your record for the previous six months wouldn’t make yours the first job they’d cut?