It was the laserdisc “faces” edition, so Han shot first and all that good stuff.
a week or two ago, I made a topic about ESB and RotJ, for I had recently seen those two
but today I watched ANH for I had missed that one. Not that I hadn’t seen it before; I have seen all of them before several times.
ANH really has a different feel to it than the other ones. You know what I mean? I don’t know if I can explain what I mean, or if it is so obvious that I look dumb for even mentioning it.
Darth Vader talks differently in this one, faster I think.
Also is he not in command in this one. Definitely in ESB and RotJ he is 2nd only to the Emperor and no one dares mess with him. But in this movie he is choking some guy and Peter Cushing tells him to let him go. No one can tell Darth Vader what to do. Also it seems like ESB or RotJ Vader is too important to go out personally in a tie fighter during a rebel attack.
but my question is, why do so many (i.e. 2) say “May the Force be with you”? They make a big deal out of how there are no Jedi left, and no one left around who believes in the Force. So I guess it makes sense that Han says it even though he mocked it, for he was doing it to support Luke. But the general or whoever guy was leading the fighters before the Death Star attack, why does he say it, “may the force be with you”? No one believes in that hokey religion anymore.
Also someone says it in RotJ before the death star attack, even though none of those people are Jedi.
Also Luke didn’t even know what the Force is before Obi-Wan told him, so maybe it isn’t common knowledge among non-Jedi, so why does everyone else say it? Maybe it is good to have a catchphrase for merchandising.
also, what’s the deal with Obi-Wan being called Ben? If he had changed his name to go into hiding, it didn’t work well because Kenobi is more well-known, isn’t it? Luke tells Leia he is here to rescue her with Ben Kenobi, and she recognizes it. So it isn’t a very good name for hiding, so there is no point it it.
Sorry, I have no idea what movie you’re talking about. The plot sounds familiar, but the movie I’m thinking of was called “Star Wars”…
To answer your question regarding “May the Force be with you”; if I recall correctly the commander of the rebel base says it before the pilots head off to fight the Death Star. If we assume that the Rebel Alliance is really the remnants of the Republic, then that seems to fit. After all, it’s only been 20-30 years since the Empire took control, right? Certainly the older members of the Alliance would remember the Republic, and therefore the Jedi and the Force. The reason Luke has no idea about it is because his aunt and uncle tried to shield him from his heritage. Leia obviously knew about Obi-wan, so it’s not surprising that others in the more ‘civilized’ parts of the Empire would still remember also.
Remember that if there’s a bright center to the Universe, Tatooine is the planet that it’s farthest from. After living there in isolation for all those years it’s not surprising that ‘old Ben’ thought that he was the only one left anywhere who remembered the ‘good old days’. I don’t think that the Jedi were nearly as ‘long forgotten’ as they were made out to be when we first learn about them (in the conversation between Luke and Obi-wan).
Not a huge Star Wars geek, but I’ll attempt to answer a few of these.
A New Hope, for me, feels like it was designed to be a standalone movie. That is, even if Eps. V and VI never came to fruition, it’s a (relatively) complete story arc in and of itself, albeit with a bunch of loose ends.
Tarkin (Peter Cushing) appears, through the extended universe, to be more of a political leader while Vader, as a sith apprentice, is the Emperor’s lapdog. I’d say both are on even footing, but the death of Tarkin makes Vader the obvious #2 come Empire Strikes Back.
Vader took the Tie fighter to go and hunt down Luke, because he sensed a dangerous presence after Obi-Wan. It couldn’t be messed up. Also, as a Sith apprentice and his sort of “ill-defined” role in the leadership, I guess he could go wherever he wanted.
Finally, Obi-Wan Kenobi was powerless to stop Qui-gon Jin from Dying. Then he let Anakin go evil. Then he hid in the desert, not bothering to change his last name. Then he got killed not paying attention his sword fight, leaving Luke Skywalker to sort of fend for himself after taking him from the only home he ever knew.
Much as I like Alec Guinness, I gotta say, Obi-wan sounds like a pretty awful Jedi.
when Luke is coming back after blowing up the Death Star, Leia comes out and yells “Luke”
and the Luke yells something back at her. My friend says he yells “Carrie” but also it sounds like he could be yelling “hey” or something, so I don’t really know.
The Rebels want a return to the “more civilised age” that the Republic represented at one time. The Force and the Jedi are symbolic of that era. Whereas the Empire fixation on death, destruction and power (encapsulated in the Death Star), the Rebellion’s philosophy is life-affirming: note that the Force is inherently connected to all living things. This is reinforced by the Rebels occupying a lush jungle-like planet, with the Empire existing in an artificial, man-made environment.
As for Ben/Obi-Wan, the change in name is largely symbolic. There is a theme running through Star Wars where names signify personae. Anakin and Vader may be the same person, but they are different personae; similarly, Obi-Wan is a Jedi but Ben is an old hermit.
Possible Fanwank: “Old Ben” is how a barely talking Luke said “Obi-Wan” back before Uncle Owen put his foot down and started keeping Luke away from him, but the name stuck.
Re “Ben” Kenobi: Maybe on Tatooine “Obi-Wan” would sound like an exotic, otherworldly name, and he didn’t want to draw attention to himself in that way. Fit in with the locals and all that.
And he kept “Kenobi” because he knew (because of the Force, you know) that Luke would hear the name “Obi-Wan Kenobi” one day, and that would cause Luke to come to him.
Re “May the Force be with you”: It’s been a while since I’ve seen ANH, but who actually says that noboby believes in the Force anymore? Uncle Owen, who’s trying to keep Luke safe from the dangerous life of a Rebel? The cynical Han Solo, who doesn’t really believe in anything? Even if the Jedi themselves have all but died out, the Rebel Alliance seems to be striving to keep alive their customs and rituals. Hence the phrase “May the Force be with you,” used something like “Godspeed.”
My favorite Fan Speculation about this – dating from before the release of The Empire Strikes Back – is that “Obi-Wan” is actually the vocalization of the letters OB1 (just like R2D2 became Artoo Detoo and C3PO became See Threepio).
OB1 stood for Old Ben One, because he was the first clone of the original Old Ben Kenobi, who, after all, fought in the Clone Wars.
I recall reading once that, when James Earl Jones came back to do Vader for Empire, he had a lot of trouble recapturing the tone and cadences of the voice. He does seem a lot more measured and emotionless in the second two movies than he does in the first.
This is mostly fan supposition, but here’s my take on it. Vader answers only to the Emperor, but Tarkin’s clearly a key figure in the Empire, with a significant power base of his own. I suspect that he’s largely responsible for ensuring that the Navy is loyal to the Empire. This makes him valuable, but also dangerous - if he decides that he should be the one in charge of the Empire, he could be a credible threat to Palpatine’s regime. Vader’s there for two reasons. He’s supposed to do whatever Tarkin wants him to do to ensure the success of the Death Star project. But he’s also there to make sure Tarkin doesn’t get any ideas about parking the Death Star in orbit around Coruscant and attempting to usurp Palpatine. When Tarkin dies with the Death Star, Vader fills the power vacuum he’s left behind, which is why you see him giving orders to Navy officers and killing them with impunity when they screw up in ESB.
Han doesn’t believe in that hokey religion, although he’s clearly heard of it. But he’s a cynical bastard, at least for the first two acts, so it’s fitting that he doesn’t buy into any kind of mysticism. In the galaxy at large, there is clearly a lot of other opinions on the subject. It’s been less than two decades since the Emperor crushed the Jedi, and not everyone bought his story about them betraying the Republic. Plus, his record of tyranny since then has probably discredited his claims about the Jedi in many quarters. It’s not surprising that an organization dedicated to his overthrow would embrace Jedi principles as part of their organizational ethos.
You don’t have to be a Jedi to believe in the Force, anymore than you have to be a priest to believe in Jesus. None of those guys can move shit around with their mind, but they still accept the demonstrable fact that the Force exists.
Luke grew up in the asshole of the galaxy, by an uncle who was terrified that he’d follow in his father’s footsteps. It’s not surprising that he doesn’t know anything about the Force, but it’s unlikely that he’s representative of the galaxy at large.
Leia was captured on a mission to specifically find a guy named Kenobi, so when some guy bursts into her cell saying he’s with “Ben” Kenobi, it makes sense that she’d put two and two together. If we ignore the prequels (please!) it’s pretty easy to assume that there’s no particular reason to adopt a full pseudonym. There’s hundreds, if not thousands, of inhabited planets in the Empire, with untold trillions of sentients. Get far enough away from the galactic center, and there’s pretty much no way that word of a “Ben Kenobi” is ever going to make its way back to anyone who gives a shit.
Of course, that’s kind of blown out the airlock when we find out Vader was born on Tatooine, but that’s going back to why the prequels were really, really stupid. And I don’t think that’s territory that needs to be covered again.
Much of the dialogue in Star Wars was pure cornball. Star Wars was intended as a film much in the vein of Buck Rogers, and it does bear a resemblance. The Ewoks and Jar-Jar ‘Stepin Fechit’ Binks were childlike and childish characters intended to appeal to children and sell toys. But the whole of the first film was a technically-advanced Buck Rogers adventure. (Not that there’s anything wrong with that.)
I largely agree with this (except the “sell toys” bit). Star Wars is breezy fun and certainly in keeping with the '30s serial space adventure genre. But that really only becomes apparent once Luke leaves Tatooine–prior to that, it’s more a western than anything. And the third act is a homage to The Dam Busters.
The Empire Strikes Back similarly plays on western and war movie tropes but the Buck Rogers/Flash Gordon “gee whiz!” element is missing. Return of the Jedi is also lacking that piece of the puzzle.
Funnily enough, The Phantom Menace regained it somewhat, as did Revenge of the Sith.
