If someone were to actually lose his/ her mind and went completely insane, would it be possible for them to know it? I’m to understand that 1 out of every 4 Americans suffer from some sort of mental illness, but this illness is usually so slight that the person involved can still function in society ( being in full control of them selves) without posing a threat to themselves or anyone else. ( no cite ).
I am also led to believe that to a certain point, EVERYONE is somewhat psychotic because everyone has daydreams and fantasies that temporarily seperate us from the actual world around us. Its only when these dreams become so intense and frequent that we start to lose the ability to seperate our dreams from reality. (reality being the world around us) thus resulting in the loss of complete self control.
I’m not an authority on this matter, but this is one of many thoughts that I have been pondering for quite a while. Tell us what you think. Do you believe that if a person were to actually go completely insane, is it possible for them to realize it?
I forgot to add, what prompted this OP was a report I ran across about a very unusual man that went by the name of John Nash. For those who are not familiar with either him or his work, this is a very good read!
That must have been so awful for you - glad you’re OK now. Would you be prepared to expand on how you felt at the time? Did you feel nothing was wrong, or did you have a sense of something being amiss, but you couldn’t figure out what it was?
I’ve always said I’d take physical illness over losing my mind any time. (I got my wish. :dubious: )
I had a weird episode about 10 years ago that was probably verging on psychotic. During the few weeks that it was happening, I was all too well aware that my brain wasn’t functioning right.
On the one hand, it made the experience more distressing, possibly prolonging the problem, since I knew that something was wrong with me and was in a constant state of terror. On the other hand, however, I think it was that self-doubt and self-awareness that allowed me to recover without meds or a shrink.
If I had been more ‘arrogant’ or complacent about what I thought and believed about things, I might have calmly descended into delusion; but because I constantly questioned the strange thoughts and sensations that I was being assailed with, and sifting out the ones that weren’t ‘normal’, I was able to keep a hold on reality and fight against that which I realised was unreal.
I’m OK now, and thankfully I’ve never had a recurrence.
That’s not what psychotic is. Nor is feeling blue the same as clinical depression. Nor is being distractable the same as having ADD. Etc.
Specifically to your question, however, yes, some people do know that they’re nuts. My mom works for community mental health and she described a woman who has severe hallucinations and, even though she knows they’re not real, finds them very disconcerting. (Who wouldn’t?) One can also know that one is depressed and won’t get out of it, but is stuck anyway. And obsessive-compulsive sufferers can know they’re in trouble even if they can’t get out of the house without touching every metal object in the house twice. And so on.
I’m sure that isn’t universally true, e.g. hlanelee, who I’m very glad is well.
That’s not being somewhat psychotic, that’s having an imagination;) Bear in mind I say this having experienced more than slight psychosis … serious enough that I had to go on meds for it; fortunately it’s nowhere near as bad as it was two and a half years ago.
Now, to address the rest of the OP … I’ve been suicidal for more than six months at a time - more than once, IIRC, and it’s becoming somewhat difficult to remember as I get chronologically separated from it, and been psychotic to varying degrees. What I have currently is somewhere around 0 on a scale of 0 to 10 in terms of severity, something I can (and do) handle with very little strain (worst it’s come to in the past several months has been me saying to myself “No, I won’t do that.”). So … well, I think I was insane at least once, and probably twice, and I recognized it in myself.
Lemme just head off those who might suggest I see a practitioner here: I’ve known when I needed one (I didn’t have all the resources I needed back in high school, but I knew what I needed and I got it when I could), and I don’t need one now:) If you’d like to debate my mental state with me, take it to email.
I’ve managed to acquire a diagnosis of paranoid schizophrenic, so presumably I qualify.
It’s a good idea for everyone, not just us, to remind yourself over and over again of the fact that there is absolutely nothing you can have faith in as definitely being what and how you think it is.
For those of us whose ideation and impressions diverge markedly from those of similar people having similar experiences, it’s more necessary.
You can’t really function while thinking of yourself as having a broken head full of static, so you have to go on the assumption that some portion of your thinking and feeling is valid and meaningful.
The hardest part is (of course) how to deal with other people. My best rule is: no matter what I believe other folks think of me and the “flavor” of their intentions towards me, and whether or not they are collectively amused at me or otherwise have attitudes or intentions other than the ones they are overtly stating, it’s always a bad idea to call them on it and always a better idea to behave as if you think they think you are reasonable, lucid, respect-worthy, and trustworthy. Most collusion is unconscious and unintentional (people sharing a culture, a mindset, a set of common experiences, and therefore acting and believing in tandem, rather than having actually discussed things and come to conclusions some time before you were present in the room, etc.), and on the occasions when a group of people do find you amusing and are saying things or behaving towards you in order to amuse each other, or find you frightening and consider you a threat that something needs to be “done about”, etc., it’s still good to behave as if you expect and anticipate only friendly good things from them.
As with the belief-and-certainty thing, this is a good rule for everyone, not just nuts.
Check out The Eden Express written by Mark Vonnegut (Kurt’s son). It describes his experience with paranoid schizophrenia and his subsequent treatment and recovery. Fascinating, terrifying book.
He knew very well that he was sick, but could not control or prevent the action of his disease.
I’m glad I found this thread, because I have a question of this nature and it seems that some folks who have posted could answer it.
An acquaintance of mine has 5 kids and a 6th on the way. She’s a pretty irresponsible parent and is known to allow just about anyone to watch her kids. Her current live-in nanny is a guy I’ve known for a while, who is a schizophrenic. When I met him he was on meds, and wasn’t exactly quite on keel then, but could have a linear conversation and function. Now he’s off his meds and off his head. Trying to talk to him is a byzantine and trying endeavor–I’ve never experienced anything quite like it: it makes me feel like I’m crazy too. It is impossible for him to hold a job, a real relationship, or a conversation as he is now. I am fond of him, but he gets kind of, ummm, excited when I’m around and quite wrought, so I generally have to avoid him now. (Don’t say anything, OK? I feel bad enough.)
The problem is, he refuses to take any medications and this woman with all the kids is enabling him, telling him and anyone else who shows concern that he can be helped/cured by massage and acupuncture. I think he realizes there’s something not right about how he is but he denies that he’s psychotic, which I guess is very common with this type of illness, and won’t get help that involves him taking medication.
I feel bad for him and the kids in this situation, and I wish there was something that could help. IANA psychiatrist, but I feel like there’s nothing that his friends can do that can truly help him, that only medical intervention can help in cases like this. Am I right? Do schizophrenics pretty much need meds to cope with their illness? How “normal” or should I say, functional, can be if he’s pretty much full blown schizophrenic, with treatment? Is there any hope of leading a regular life for this guy? Is it safe for him to be around kids, alone? I feel like the answer is no, but I don’t want to be overly alarmist.
Hi, I’m back. When my wife had me committed in 1989 I was paranoid and very delusional. I would blacking out and could not account for myself from time to time. Had she not taken action I would have likely destroyed myself or someone else. I had insurance and her uncle was the solicitor. I was put in a good, private institution and things worked out. In 1994 my employer had me committed, I do not know the details why. I was taken to the nearest indigent health care facility with a mental ward and held in handcuffs for 10 hours until an intern could interveiw me. It was less pleasant, after 3 weeks they turned me over to my wife’s custody. Sometimes, I have become afraid of myself and have had myself committed. Today, I maintain my condition, take my meds, go to therapy, and try to be aware of how I think and feel. If I do not, I know that someone will take control of my condition for me and it will likely not be pleasant. I take an anti-depressant (Effexor) because I do not like to go around feeling like hanging myself or making a quick left into traffic. I take lithium carbonate because it helps keep me from showing my ass like I used to. Today they will put you in jail for some of the stunts I used to pull. I used to take melleril or haldol or resperidol for delusions. I will not take an antipsychotic because they make you sleep ten or twelve hours a day. I like the people I talk to when no one else is around, thay amuse me. I know that they do not exist so that doesn’t count but it bugs the hell out of my wife. Any questions?
hlanelee, thanks for being so frank. I hope the questions I ask aren’t too personal. How is your marriage? Are you able to function in a relationship like that when you’re off your meds? Is it radically different when you’re on them? Did you meet your wife before your first psychotic break, or did you initiate the relationship with her while you were also dealing with your schizophrenia? Would you feel safe being around kids when you’re off your med? How about on them?
I guess what I’m trying to figure out is how functional you are able to be and how aware you can be of how your illness affects all the aspects of your life when you’re off your meds. Thanks for your insight and I hope I’m not hijacking this thread too heinously.
a) Most people diagnosed schizophrenic are not violent. Being incoherent doesn’t intrinsically translate over into violent.
b) Psychiatric treatment for schizophrenia is crude and clumsy and many people prefer to proceed untreated. Many of us find that neuroleptic meds (the kind given to schizzies) pretty much just muffle the nervous system, masking symptoms far more than they “fix” anything.
c) As long as you’re just posing the question to muse upon, you’re entitled to wonder and ponder, but in a world where forced psychiatric treatment is still a reality I’ve got to get preachy and say that the question of whether or not he “needs” them is one that he must answer, not you, and not I. Citizens have at least rudimentary rights to be crazy and uncured of it if they so choose. These need to be expanded, enforced, and respected.
I understand and sympathize with this. I do not like taking psychoreactive drugs myself and I appreciate someone wanting to avoid this. However, I know he’s been picked up wandering the streets, half-dressed and not clean, not able to hold any kind of conversation. He’s not nearly that bad now, but I fear this is where he will go if things keep going as they are. He doesn’t seem to remember being arrested, or he’s denying it now, but I worry that if CPS winds up at the house (they’ve been called a few times this year) and they find him there, it’ll be a problem. He won’t make a very good impression.
I suppose everyone has the right to be ill if they wish. I just want him to be happy, and I’m not qualified to say if he is or not because he’s so alien to me that I can’t really understand what’s going on with him. I do know that he’s very intelligent, has the capacity for sweetness, but is also very disturbing/disturbed and is self-medicating quite a bit with substances legal and not. And he’s caring for kids. Believe that my questions come from the best place in me. However, I am totally powerless in this situation so don’t worry about me forcing anything on him.
Rubystreak I’m not sure how to answer your questions. I had my first psychotic episode 2 years after I met my wife. In Feb. 1989, 3 months after we were married, she was hospitalized for an extended period of time. She had some gastrointestinal problem and nearly didn’t survive. Th stress got to me, in August she had me committed because I was having frequent outbursts. She says I never hit her but she was scared. I want to add that until April 1987 I was a habitual drunk, most of my abnormal behavior was attributed to that. As far as meds are concerned, I can function well without them. I take lithium because I am prone to manic episodes, these are scary. Lithium helps me to not show my ass when I’m in public (emphasis on helps). Effexor helps me not want to die to a level that is controllable. It’s unnerving to be driving down the highway 65 MPH thinking, “All I need to do is swerve left into the next car.” I take meds for my personal comfort. I’m fine around kids. When someone does something to me, I sometimes think about getting even. Causing them harm in some manner. Rubystreak there are people that are mentally ill and you can’t help them, there is too much personal main tenance involved. Also, much substance abuse is involved with mental illness. You cannot make someone else clean or sober, the same reason. This is just a side observation, but from my experience being drunk and crazy, habitual drunkenness is more socially acceptable than mental illness. There are lots of drunks around children.
Rubystreak I love my wife more than life, she says that she loves me. We frequently make disgusting public displays of our affection and we cuddle on the couch and watch the tube every night. In October we celebrate our sixteeenth anniversary. We have been together for seventeen, we lived in sin for a year and a half.
Kind of on this topic: Today at work an elderly man told me that his dementia was getting worse. He was very eloquent and intelligent as he related to me that the confusion gets the best of him at times. He gritted his teeth and dramatically denounced his condition, at the moment fully coherent and mentally intact.
It was sad.
I think he realizes there’s something not right about how he is but he denies that he’s psychotic, which I guess is very common with this type of illness, and won’t get help that involves him taking medication.