I don’t know how safe it would be to assume that. I guess you should also define hateful.
Hey, I’d like someone to actually come by and explain Kaden as a baby-name choice!
What I’m wondering is what is Achernar real name and who made fun of it in that thread.
I glanced through the thread to see if my real name was there although I was pretty sure it wouldn’t be. So I’m thinking someone took Achernar’s real name and put it through the wringer.
Look, EVERY discussion is going to have the potential to offend SOMEBODY. It’s ridiculous to suggest people censor themselves just because some reader out in Podunk might get bent out of shape. The types of people who justify this are just as bad as the ultra-religious right-wing censorship advocates they protest.
Like the OP said, if you don’t like it, DON’T READ IT! If you don’t like the show, change the channel! If you don’t like the music, don’t buy it! Makes perfect sense.
Caricci: A hateful statement is one which expresses hatred. When hatred is expressed toward certain topics, it’s offensive. Here’s an example of a thread in which I find many of the statements to be hateful but not offensive. For more examples of what I consider hateful statements, see earlier in this thread where I quoted some from the name thread.
Zebra: My name is Christopher, as you would be overly informed if you clicked on my homepage, so it’s not like I’m trying to keep it a secret. As far as I know, nobody has ever made fun of my name, but I know how I would feel if someone did. (And yes, I know exactly how this works. Now somebody is going to make fun of the name Christopher. I’m one step ahead; you’ll not get a reaction out of me about it in this thread.)
Sorry for my density, but are you agreeing with me, disagreeing with me, insulting me, or just trying to confuse me?
Darn near obligatory, in fact, especially in this forum.
Welcome to the Pit.
Regards,
Shodan
PS - you misbegotten spawn of perdition.
Already in Use, I’m completely agreeing with you, in an obtuse, silly sort of way. I was trying to show Detective Sgt. Achernar a fanciful example of “deliberately offensive.”
I think your “banks … sheep” post was brilliant.
I’m sorry, but this simply isn’t true. Not to be confrontational, but I imagine you’d probably like it if people like me (what’s the PC term for “PC Police”?) saw the potential for offense in every expression of every opinion, but I’ve read literally thousands of threads on this message board, and I do not see the potential for offense in every post, even ones in which strong opinions are expressed.
I really do consider my views on this matter consistent, and also consistent with free speech. If this were somebody’s personal website, or a public forum or something like that, I certainly wouldn’t be trying to censor anyone. But this is a message board for which there are rules. The BBQ Pit exists for good reasons, and I think one of those reasons is to keep offensive statements out of the other eight forums. You’ll notice I never requested anyone in The Pit censor themselves, in this thread, or in any of the name-hating threads that have been mentioned as being here.
Achernar, the point you are missing is that the statements in that thread are not considered offensive by the vast majority of people. Most people are not so shallow that they confuse their appellation with their personality. Apparently, you are the exception. And that’s fine. Nobody has the right to tell you not to be offended by something. However, you don’t have the right to expect people to automatically behave in a manner tailored to your own idiosyncracies. This thing with names is your hang-up, not mine, not Green Bean’s, not MercyStreet’s. That means it’s your responsibility to deal with it, no one else’s.
And I say all this as someone with a name far more unusual and insult-prone than “Christopher.” I did, in fact, have people make fun of my name when I was growing up. It didn’t bother me then, it doesn’t bother me now, and I don’t need you standing up for my “feelings.” I mean, Jesus, you might almost have had a point if your name was Hunter, or Kaden, or one of the other names brought up in that thread. But your name’s Christopher, f’rchrissakes. I envy you if your life is really so smooth and trouble free that you can spare the time to go around taking offence on behalf of other people.
PS: People ranting about a corporate mascot is “hateful?” Get a grip, already.
Alright, this is a good point, and I think it’s very helpful of you to state it outright. But my experience contradicts what you’re saying. I’m not the only exception, even if I am the only exception who’s posted to this thread. A lot of people really do put a lot of stock into their names. Not everyone, I’ll be the first to admit, but enough people that it’s an issue. I agree that if it were just one or two, it would be a whole different story.
The next time you meet someone, try mispronouncing the same word repeatedly and see how upset they get. Then try mispronouncing their name repeatedly and see how upset they get. Do you really expect there to be no difference? Or consistently misspell someone’s name. Or forget their name. Probably not on the first try, but I bet it won’t take you long before you find someone that this really bothers. Names are important to some people. When someone asks, “Who are you?” what do you say? Why do you think parents agonize over what to name their children if it’s just a piece of information?
If you don’t like the word hateful I can use something else. Is ranting okay? If so, then read what I said eariler as, when people rant about certain topics, it’s offensive.
Thanks for the clarification, MercyStreet. Nice to know I lived through another day unwhooshed.
I think you are wrong, here, but I doubt there’s any way to prove it one way or the other.
Well, I think parents agonize over their children’s names because they don’t want to give them a name that they’ll be teased and humiliated with: in that regard, threads like that linked in the OP are doing a public service by highlighting names that are particularly stupid and steering prospective parents away from them.
At any rate, this is entirely different from what was happening in that other thread. If I came up to you, in person, and said, “Christopher? That’s a stupid name!” You’d have every right to be offended. That’s a direct, personal attack. That’s also nothing like what the linked thread was about. This isn’t a case of people popping up in random threads to make fun of specific people’s names: this is a thread created specifically so like-minded people could discuss a topic of interest to them without bothering anybody else. You’re like one of those people who hang around in smoking sections, coughing angrily at the smokers. You don’t like it, don’t read it. No one’s forcing their opinion on you.
If you don’t like the word hateful I can use something else. Is ranting okay? If so, then read what I said eariler as, when people rant about certain topics, it’s offensive. **
[/QUOTE]
Sorry, forgot to delete that last paragraph.
Quoth Miller:
I don’t think an attack has to be made to a particular person in order to be offensive. If I said, “Asian? That’s a stupid race!” would it make any difference whether I said it to an Asian person’s face, or with a group of like-minded people? I think not; it’s offensive either way. Now, in the interest of free speech, there are certainly places that it’s permissable to be offensive; In My Humble Opinion is not one of them.
Achernar said:
Do you think that we all have to agree in order to have a friendly community? Do we have to put the priorities of others above our own (in this case to give our opinions) in order to have a friendly community? Do we need to keep our opinions to ourselves? I think that would be a disaster. I have seen it happen. Someone at another forum who was very controlling insisted that we should be nice all of the time. The board became drivel and melted in the rain.
You certainly express yourself well. And I like it that you are sensitive to the feelings of others. It is reasonable in an emotionally healthy life to let people know what offends you. But then if they continue to say it, it is up to you to control your reaction.
We are responsible for our feelings and reactions. No one can “make” us feel any emotion unless they have our full cooperation. You cannot control us. You can control you. With that in mind, you might consider “choosing your battles” more carefully.
,
On a personal note, I am offended when a group of females is referred to as “ladies” rather than “women.” “Ladies” often implies that a certain kind of very polite behavior is expected. I grew up in a time when girls were taught to be “nice” instead of outspoken. Words do affect our thinking and our behavior. But if I make my feelings and reasons known about use of the word “ladies” and someone continues to chose to use it, it is not my business.
My opinion of anyone’s name is just that-- an opinion. It is not a decree from on high that someone is failing socially. And opinions certainly vary. My opinion of a name is not your business. In fact, my opinion of you is not your business!
What I hear you saying is that you are speaking up because some people either have been offended or may be offended when we don’t like their names. I can accept that as true. But even if I didn’t, you would still have the right to say it.
Someone’s name is just a label that your parents chose. Maybe they wanted to honor someone else by having a namesake. Or maybe they chose the name because it sounds beautiful to their ears or reflects their heritage. Maybe they choose it because it means “beloved” in another language. It says nothing about who you really are on a personal level.
you said:
So no one should use the term “ladies” on the other eight forums? That would be extremely unreasonable of me to expect that or to ask for that.
I disagree with you about the possible motivation to have “the Pit.” (But someone who knows is certainly encouraged to correct me.) Offensive does not equal jerky or aggressive.
My understanding was that you did indeed want us to censor ourselves in the “name-hating” thread. Was I mistaken?
My own father mispronounced my name! And the memory of it makes me smile to this day.
Some people have failing memories or confuse easily. I can’t know why they do it unless they tell me. They are the only authorities on their motives.
Zoe said a lot of good things I’d like to respond to. I moved a couple of quotes around to link them; please tell me if I juxtapose any unjustly:
If you reread the request I made in that thread, I think the answer to your questions will be clear: “If you’re not fond of a name, that’s fine, and by all means say so.” It was never my intention for people not to express their opinions, and although I tried to make it clear, I can see how this might not have come across that way.
Okay, I don’t think my reaction was uncontrolled, but maybe this isn’t what you had in mind. Even if this thread had not been started, I would not have pressed the issue in that other thread.
I never meant for this to be a battle. However, offensive language is important to me, and this message board is important to me, so I don’t think that this discussion is at all frivolous. I don’t feel like my time has been wasted.
If there are people who find ladies offensive, for reasonable reasons, then I think that using it is inconsiderate. Do you think that’s the case? I’m not just talking about your not liking a word. But certain words, because of the connotations they have unfortunately acquired, carry so much baggage that it’s not a good idea to use them unless you make it perfectly clear what you mean.
Okay, let me ask you the same thing I asked ultress a while back in this thread. Point out a post you consider offensive that’s not in The Pit. I’m curious what you consider offensive that you don’t think belongs only here.
Oops, what I said was unclear. I said, “I never requested anyone in The Pit censor themselves, in this thread, or in any of the name-hating threads that have been mentioned as being here.” I should have said, “I never requested anyone in The Pit censor themselves, in this thread, or in any of the name-hating threads that have been mentioned as being in this forum.” Sorry for the confusion. Yes, I did request that people censor themselves in In My Humble Opinion.
The ‘strong opinion’ I was speaking of was not related to the making fun of people’s names, it was to this thread and the fact that the thread in question did not contain any offensive posts. I didn’t read the thread in question, nor do I have a desire to. As far as pointing out specific threads that I have found offensive and have not responded to, that’s like stirring the stink. Why would you care what I find offensive when the majority of the board doesn’t find it so. And what does it matter if you find it offensive just because I do? But as an example, I am Christian, and many times others that are not will post things that get under my skin. But this is a public messageboard and I will not post a scathing reply to all the people that offend me because of my religion. Sometimes you have to take things with a grain of salt.
Bollocks cheerfully withdrawn.
Both my first and middle names were mentioned quite often in the thread, and with very few compliments. Did it bother me? NO, because others were expressing their opinions which was the point of the whole f*cking topic.
And finally, Achernar, we have venemously efficient moderators…I don’t think we need any self-appointed hall monitors.