If you don't send jobs overseas you'll be run out of business. Hah.

Yeah, free traders despise me. But if I cared what y’all free trade fanatics thought then I wouldn’t be posting this, now would I?

The “if you don’t send jobs overseas you’ll be out-competed by cheap labor” crowd deserves to be stung by this bit of irony. This company below did offshore their production and directly because of that, they got pretty close to run out of business. Let this serve as a warning to everyone who says this can’t happen!

A Cautionary Tale Of Outsourcing To China: There Is No Recourse, You Could Lose Everything


Time for the pony to learn a new trick.

This is a really shitty situation for Fellowes, and certainly acts as a cautionary tale about doing business in China with Chinese business partners, especially ones with political clout.

For those interested in an actual news story and not just a link to another message board, you can read about it here. More here.

Of course, this one story tells us very little about the more general issue of offshore production or business partnerships with offshore companies. But then again, look who the OP is; i don’t think anyone really expected a sensible, coherent argument.

Evidently this is not a universal experience. Otherwise the trend would have stopped a long time ago.

Sometimes doing business in China is a good idea. Sometimes it is not.

Wow. What a revelation.

The question of rule of law, is not a “sometimes its a good idea, sometimes its not”

The biggest impediment to China becoming an economic powerhouse was its lack of rule of law. It got Most Favored Nation status in 1980 and STILL noone would do business with China except on a cash and carry basis. There were routinely problems with Chinese banks reneging on letters of credit and Chinese exporters shorting their shipments.

At some point they got smart and realized that they could make a lot more money by enforcing rule of law rather than letting their people rip off their trading partners. And this started the flood foreign investment.

If people lose confidence in China’s rule of law, it will be a bloodbath for everyone there. As people pull out, Chinese partners will be more inclined to pull this sort of crap which will lead more people to pulling out.

American Apparel seems to be doing just fine.

Aww, it’s okay, little schnookums. No one here hates lil’ ol’ you. Sounds like you need a great big snuggly-bunny huggums!! Come on, everyone, let’s shower Jackie here with huggles!!!

{{{{{{Le Jacquelope}}}}}}

Not so fine – from yesterday:
Canadian investors rescue American Apparel

A lot of corporations go abroad to escape regulation and environmental laws. It is not all cheap labor.

So one example of a company having issues that were completely unrelated to your original argument vindicates you?

You mean “offshoring production to China can get you run out of business even faster than if you don’t” isn’t coherent enough for you? Or maybe your reading skills just suck that much?

I’m surprised you free market droogies didn’t wuss out again and froth out another bullshit claim that the article somehow contradicted me. As limp-wristed as your response was this time, at least it was something new! Hell that might have even been gasp an original thought!

Zing. That one also flew right over these guys’ heads.

China thinks it can become a powerhouse by bullying everyone else. Reneging on letters of credit, stealing intellectual property, all of this comes from their belief that they have the world over a barrel.
Oh, and Zoid? Really? You think this is isolated to one company? Google “intellectual property theft China” and prepare to get shocked.


I never said intellectual property theft in China was limited to a single instance, I said you only provided one example - and it still has nothing to do with your original premise and does nothing to support you original position.

Yes, Almond Joy has had success, Mounds has not.

Maybe you didn’t comprehend my original position?

I said, let this incident serve as a warning to people who think you can’t be put out of business by sending your manufacturing overseas. Let this incident serve as a warning to those who buy into the “if we don’t use cheaper labor overseas to do our work we’ll be taken out by another competitor who does”.

My original position was quite specifically spoken: that you can be put out of business by another competitor specifically because you offshored production. The example I posted showed exactly how this happens in reality.

I don’t see why I should post more examples - seeing as that people on the Straight Dope can’t even comprehend clearly spoken words and they routinely engage in spin doctoring and go through the most contorted gyrations to claim that any cite that discredits “free trade” doesn’t mean what it means. It’s like Newspeak University in here. When it comes to economics the posters at the Straight Dope are as insular, ignorant and uncreative as any group of people who manage to learn how to breathe and walk straight.

One of these days, soon, what few people remain in support of offshoring are going to wake up, go outside and realize there’s no country for you. Ideological extinction is not too big a word for what that mindset is facing.

When I’m president of my own Mormon super-galaxy, I’m going to sic my goon squad on the OP and shove my throbbing comparative advantage down his cite’s throat (I’ll even hire someone to read it thoroughly for me). Fuck protectionism in every form.

Will your super-galaxy have a strawman as big as Le Jac’s?

Is there really anyone out there that thinks that?

It is not just the free traders.


You keep the hell away from my Mormon super-galaxy.