If you're too dumb to figure out this form you shouldn't be allowed to vote anyway!

Enough said…

Picture of the ballot

Um…I saw the ballot. To someone with poor eyesite, they would INDEED be confused.

I agree. Poor eyesight, being tired, or distracted…

here is a larger picture of it


I agree. Just for the record I voted Libertarian, so I’m not a Republican.

If you are not 100% sure how to vote, find out the correct procedure. They can’t redo the vote now!

From what I heard (this is just office talk, mind you), the ballot was designed because they thought they making the text bigger would make it easier to read. In other words, they were trying to help the people with poor eyesight! Ugh!

At least one person discovered that they had filled out the ballot the wrong way, but when they asked one of the proctors for a new ballot, they were refused.

Several people are filing suit on the issue of this ballot, saying that the ballot design was illegal–apparently, Florida statutes forbid a two-page ballot; this was a two-page ballot. Seems pretty clear to me.

I also heard that Buchanon got five times the votes in Palm Beach county (the one with the misleading ballot) than he did in any other Florida county, proportionally. Coincedence?

After waiting in line for 90 minutes to vote, in turn being an hour late for work (I went at 8 am; I didn’t think it would be busy, and this is my first time voting), after being rudely treated by volunteers because I gave them the wrong info accidentally, after listening to several yokels in line explain that, a. I should not be allowed to vote because I am young and stupid; b. if George doesn’t win, they will get some “big fucking guns” and destroy the White House; and c. the “fucking pussy-ass” Democrats (myself included) are responsible for the moral decline of our country, and after getting pushed around, stepped on and just plain tired, then yes I can absolutely understand why others might have trouble reading the ballot.

Besides the fact, if someone is used to a one page voting ballot, I can easily see that they might have scanned to Gore, pluuged the hole, and voted incorrectly.

Is this really a Great Debate?

The purpose of a democracy (or a representative republic, if you will) is that everyone gets to vote. If we start IQing people before they can vote, as was suggested in the Pit recently, than that kind of undermines the whole idea, now doesn’t it?

Personally I favor mandatory IQ tests and subsequent facial tatoos for the not-so-bright. That way I would know when I am dealing with idiots like Hail Ants.

Hope that wasn’t too Pit worthy.

2 items

  1. Jeb Bush said that the ballots had previously been published for inspection…HOWEVER, the published ballots did not include the punch holes/alignment

  2. NBC mentioned that the ballots were designed by the local county clerk (I believe) to be easier to read for seniors…she is a Democrat…

[Moderator Hat ON]

Yes, it was pit-worthy. Do not call people “idiots” while you are in Great Debates. Thank you.

[Moderator Hat OFF]

What beagledave said:

Also - This style of ballot (“Butterfly”) has been used before in Florida. This is information I’ve heard, don’t know if it’s all accurate. (I am starting to doubt anything the news says after last night!!!)

If this ballot is illegal in Florida, how come they didn’t challenge it before the election? And what about the fact that a Democrat chose it? I think this issue is still very confusing. The commentators I have heard on the news (yes, the same news that announced Dubya winner last night!) think that these ballots will stay - everything was done according to Hoyle, the design was released and approved, etc. before the election started. There is a great doubt that a “recount” will happen.

Well, we will see.

Gadarene said:

Now that is, I believe, illegal. You are allowed to receive a new ballot if you have accidentally “spoiled” your first one – presuming it has not already been put into the ballot box.

Do you have specific details on this?

What about the fact that a Democrat chose it, Yosemite? No one’s saying that it was deliberately confusing, just that it was unreasonably confusing! The party affiliation of its implementor has nothing to do with that, though I suspect she won’t be won’t be finding much work in the Democratic Party from now on.

Personally, Nacho4Sara, I agree with Hail Ants. I looked at the ballot and it didn’t seem to be that hard to figure out.

If people were confused, they could have asked for a clarification.

Personally, it has always amazed me that I could walk into a polling place holding a joint or a Miller Lite, and I would not be allowed to vote because of being under the influence, but this country allows the obviously senile to cast their ballots.

Will there be a new election in Palm Beach County? I very seriously doubt it.

Since I’ve been playing with some numbers, here’s some interesting ones.

Flordia votes for Buchanan: 17,356 (about 6 million total votes)

Martin County votes for Buchanan: 108 (about 62,000 total votes)

Palm Beach County votes for Buchanan: 3407 (about 432,000 total votes)

Broward County votes for Buchanan: 789 (about 573,000 total votes)

Dade County votes for Buchanan: 561 (about 724,000 total votes)

I got these from CNN.

I don’t expect anyone to actually believe this because it is so bizzare, buy my own mother, resident of Palm Beach county, called as I was writing this post, frantic. She helped me with the geography, which is arranged north to south. Yes, she has poor eyesight. Yes, she claims she turned in a mis-marked ballot.

Yes, I want to kill her.

I don’t, actually. I’ve read so many articles on this stuff today, they’re all starting to blur together. It’s possible that it was covered on the Sun-Sentinel website; when I get home, I’ll look and see.

Definitely on that website, however, is a man talking about how, since there were two holes next to the Democratic box, he punched both of them–one for the president, and one for the veep. The holes, you see, roughly corresponded to the positions of Gore and Lieberman’s names.

DavidB wrote:*Now that is, I believe, illegal. You are allowed to receive a new ballot if you have accidentally “spoiled” your first one – presuming it has not already been put into the ballot box.

Do you have specific details on this?*

There is an interview currently running on NPR (I heard it on Evening Edition, I believe) with a young woman who had just that experience. She was confused after she punched her card and asked one of the people there for help. She was told that once the card was in her hand and had been punched it was a done deal and could not be discarded. The woman took the card from her and put it in the voting box.

…wait a minute, Evening Edition?..of course, what I meant was All Things Considered…in any case, if you go to http://www.NPR.org tomorrow you’ll probably be able to listen to it.

A Graph of Buchanan Votes in Florida

My mention of a Democrat designing this ballot is just to stress that there was no foul play involved.

Just heard this on FoxNews:

Apparently a relative of Pat Buchanan lives in this county, and during the last Presidential primary, this relative lobbied strong for Pat. Apparently (if this report on the news is accurate) Pat got something like 8,000 votes in this same county in Floriday. (West Palm Beach.) IF that is true, it does bring a new wrinkle into this thing.