I'm in UK; friend in US owes me substantial sum of money. WWYD?

In My Humble Opinion
1

I find myself in an awkward situation, and I’m at a loss as to what to do. I’m interested in the collective wisdom of the Dope as to what others would do in this situation, and what you lot think my options are.

I could make this a really long OP outlining the rather complex relationship between the two parties involved, but I’ll attempt to keep it brief.

I have a friend that I am very close to. (Or was until all this happened). He lives in the US, I live in the UK. He was very supportive at the time when my marriage broke down, invited me over and so on, and yes, there was sex involved. A few months after all that, he came to me for a loan. His story was that his soon-to-be-ex wife was dragging her heels over the divorce settlement, and he had a temporary cash flow problem until she paid him his share of the value of their house. I had no reason to believe that this was anything other than the truth; he was absolutely, definitely coming into a substantial sum of money in a few months.

At the same time, I had released equity (£35000) on my property to do refurbishment work. This work couldn’t start until communal repairs were organised on the apartment block, so I was temporarily cash rich with my equity sitting there. Of course, I am now paying a higher mortgage on this amount.

So it made perfect sense for me to transfer $10000 to my friend (£5120 at the time). One seventh of my equity. After all, I would get it back when he got his divorce settlement in less than six months time.

That was three years ago, and I haven’t had a penny back. Apparently, the house wasn’t worth what he thought it was, he got shafted in the divorce, yadda yadda.

I went ahead with my refurbishment work with a new budget. We are still speaking, but things are obviously a little strained.

It’s now over three years since I loaned him the money. I have pointed this out, and he just says he’s really sorry, but he just doesn’t have the cash and there’s nothing he can do about it.

So what do I do? Are there any legal angles available to me? (I have the full email correspondence that clearly shows this as a loan, with an agreed repayment schedule.) I could put pressure on him, but if I alienate him altogether, I’ll never see my money back. I wish I could turn back time and not do it in the first place.

Over to the Dope.

2

He doesn’t have any cash at all? Not even a spare $50 a month to begin paying you back? He’s talking bullshit. Definitely time to get the law involved.

3

Unless you can prove bad faith at the time of the loan request, this is almost certainly a civil matter. The police (in either country) aren’t going to get involved. Where did the loan take place?

Considering the jurisdictional as well as physical distance between you too, suing in the right jurisdiction may be non-trivial, and you may need to fly to the States to file paperwork and appear.

A consultation with an attorney may be in order for a debt of this magnitude. They may be able to put you in contact with an attorney licensed in the correct US jurisdiction who can handle the local matters. You still might have to fly over here and appear formally at least once.

Does he have assets you could garnish?

4

Three years and he hasn’t paid you even a measly 100 bucks? Unfortunately, he is not your friend any longer. He’s a guy who is humoring you until you ask for your money back. It’s clear he has no intention of ever repaying you and probably thinks you won’t be able to get it out of him transatlantically.

You need a lawyer from where he was living when you lent him the money. You’ll probably burn through half of it getting it back, but it will be worth it to make him pay his debts. It doesn’t matter that you hooked up with him; he’s not a $10,000 lay.

5

You sound like a good friend. :rolleyes: I suppose you never heard the saying don’t lend people money you need back. Anyway, I think it speaks volumes about you that less than 6,000 in your money means more than a friendship. Your payments were going to more anyway. That’s not his fault. It’s your fault for being foolish with money you knew was earmarked (and had to be paid back) for something else.

6

This board never ceases to amaze me.

7

Wow. What the fuck dude.

8

I don’t think I have any friends who I’d let steal £6,000 ($10,000) from me.

Unless you want to be my friend, Yara. I would need a small loan to get started, though.

9

I see you’ve not yet met our new friend, YaraMateo.

10

Another WTF?? :smack: post from YaraMateo. Shocking.

Anyway OP, think you’ll need to contact a US lawyer where your friend used to live and see if you can get some help that way.

11

Do you have any evidence of the loan? If not an installment contract then at least a simple demand contract payable on demand?

Without this, you basically gave a gift to the man. It’s enough money to warrant a free consultation with a US attorney in the state where the supposed loan took place. And if you could get some small payment referencing the loan, that would be supportive.

He may not have the money right now. You could do a credit check and gain some knowledge of his circumstances.

12

If he hasn’t made any effort to try to repay you after three years I seriously doubt he ever will and I don’t think you have much to lose by pushing the issue. I think you need to emotionally prepare yourself to be willing to cut ties with this guy so that he is not able to manipulate you into caving on giving him more time.
It would not surprise me if he tries to use emotional manipulation and your past relationship to try to get you to drop it when you make it clear that you’re serious about wanting your money back. Just remember, if he were a decent person with integrity, he would not be comfortable letting so much time go by without making any effort to pay back such a SUBSTANTIAL loan. Even if all I could afford was $5/month, I’d be trying to do something to repay someone who gave me that amount of money.

If you’re sure that you do have accurate information about his identity and his whereabouts, I’d definitely try talking to a lawyer about if there are any legal grounds to pursue this. After hearing what the lawyer has to say, I might also try one more time confronting him about the issue, asking him what his plan is for how he’ll repay you. If he tries again to give a lame excuse about not having ANY money to start a payment plan with, then I would tell him simply that you need the money back and that you’re sorry that it has come to this but you’ll be pursuing legal action. Maybe if you’re lucky he’ll be scared enough by the idea of legal action (I’m guessing that right now he assumes you would never actually go to those lengths) that he would cough it up without you having to actually go through the hassle of actually going through with it. But you know, I am the kind of person who would go after him legally on principle. There is no excuse for taking that amount of money from someone and making no effort at all to repay it.
Sorry that this guy turned out to be such a deadbeat!

13

I think after three years he’s never going to voluntarily pay it back. As I see it you have three options:

  1. Legal action - I have no idea how feasible this is and I suspect with 2 jurisdictions involved you could easily end up spending a substantial amount on advice with no guarantee of getting your money. As you acknowledge, if you do this, the friendship is definitely over.

  2. Break off the friendship, making it clear that 3 years with no attempt to pay you back, not even partially or in installments isn’t acceptable and is way above and beyond the call of friendship. You won’t get your money, but at least you don’t have to keep making nice with someone you’re angry with.

  3. Let it go, accept you will never see that money again and carry on the friendship if it really does mean that much to you. That’s a tough one - I do have friends that I could envisage giving that kind of money to and not expecting it back, if they were in desparate need, but most of them are the kind of people who would want to pay it back if they could.

And you’ve obviously learnt this the hard way, butYarraMateo (while expressing him/herself rather obnoxiously) is right about never lending to family or friends. Give gifts, if the person wants to pay it back when they can that’s fine and great, but loans area recipe for trouble. I don’t think there’s a realistic way for you to get this money back now.

14

He’s not your friend. If he were, he would have paid you back when he the divorce issue was settled. He’s a user and you were taken for a ride.

There is nothing “complex” about this or your relationship, and don’t talk yourself into thinking there is. He borrowed money with a specific payback event and timeline. If what he said were true (about the equity), he would have been making time payments to you after a profuse apology as to why he could not pay back the entire sum at once as per the agreement.

Bite the bullet and sue him in small claims in his area, if it covers 10k. If not, file the next level up. It doesn’t matter that you don’t live in the area to file. You can print out the forms and do it by mail. You will have to appear on the court date, but the cost is a small price to pay for getting a judgment against him. There are all kinds of ways to make him pay; wage execution, a collection agency, blah blah.

Don’t discuss it any further with him. You are wasting your breath. Just go ahead and file.

15

No, the friend who borrowed $10000 has decided that’s the price of his friendship, not the OP.

16

you have two options:
keep him as a “friend” & forget about getting your money back
OR
get your money back & lose him as a “friend”

I’d take out an ad in his local paper, nicely pointing out what transpired & noting the time element, & offer him a chance to respond…

either way, love, he’s not really your friend

17

Thank you all for the responses, which I have read and digested and have helped to clear up my thinking about the situation.

One response I will mostly ignore, except to say that yes, of course I know the saying about not lending money that you don’t expect to write off. I sat in a Skype video call with this man and carefully said to him “You know how you shouldn’t lend money you can’t afford to lose? Well let me make this clear right now - this is not money I can afford to lose!”. And he, of course, agreed and said once again that the repayment would not be a problem once he got his divorce settlement.

So, let’s assume I contact a lawyer in Florida (where he is) and start proceedings to reclaim the money. The case is found in my favour and he is commanded by the court (or whatever) to repay me. But he quite simply doesn’t have the money - what happens next? He gets declared bankrupt, financially ruined, and I still don’t get money? Or what?

He has no assets at all. He rents his home. He has two children, and I presume child support will always (quite rightly) take precedence over anything else. I think he lives outwith his means and sponges off his girlfriend quite a bit. Hmmm… there could be a pattern developing here.

I know exactly where he lives, what he does for a living, where he works, and even the names of his current and ex girlfriend, if I decided to make things really awkward for him.

Regarding the terms of the loan, I have an email chain where I say I want half back in six months and the balance within a year. This is, of course, followed by his agreement to these terms.

One other interesting point- the exchange rate has since shifted so that for me to get my money back would only cost him $8160. Nice terms for a loan, huh?

18

Let it go.

Even if you win in court, they don’t secure payment for you, only give you a judgment to enforce. It will cost, time, money, and aggravation. You may, eventually be able to put a garnishment on his wages, or a lien on his car. Maybe ruin his credit rating, but sounds like it might already be in the toilet.

Were I you, I would consider writing him a letter. Tell him you realize he doesn’t have lots of funds, but know he was aware you could not afford to lose this money. Tell him you are confident that he did not intend to screw over a friend. Tell him you expect him to begin paying you $50 a month, so you’ll know he is trying to pay something back.

Then, let it go. You’ve done what you can. You’ve learned your lesson. You’re not going to see this money again. You decide if this will affect your friendship, and how. (I would remind you, when people show you, who they really are, it’s your job to SEE!)

19

If the sex was happening at the same time he was being “supportive” of you through your divorce … ummm … yeah … you got played. Which sucks because you seem like a nice lady.

This guy is what we here in the south would call a “winner winner chicken dinner.”

This guy isn’t a friend. He got what he wanted out of you and now he has a new ATM. It’s time to get nasty - why should you care about alienating him when he’s been alienating YOU for 3 years?

I particularly like Becky2844’s suggestion, about the ad. If he won’t pay up (not can’t - WON’T - because it’s complete bullshit for him to say he cannot spare $5 a month to at least attempt to pay you back), embarrass the hell out of him.

You probably will never see your cash again, but whatever you do, don’t let him get away with it!

Rarr! Get him!

20

FYI, as I understand it, it’s actually better for you that he rents his home.
In Florida, you don’t lose your primary home due to bankruptcy, etc. That’s why someone like OJ Simpson could owe big money in a civil case, claim not to be able to pay it, and still keep a house.

If he owned his home, it would be an asset tied up in something you couldn’t touch.

Now, if you really want this resolved..
I live in Florida..and I know a guy, who knows a guy…

-D/a