In which my father is dying and I don't give a shit

It’s been a busy week, and though I’ve looked in on this thread, it’s taken me a while to find the time, and figure out how, to respond.

First off, thanks to everyone for your comments and support. I’ve told only a few selected friends IRL about this – the ones who really know about my dad. They’ve all been as supportive as you guys. :slight_smile:

This is what I wonder about for the aftermath. My mom has had her defenses up for so long – 40+ years – that I doubt that she will be able to relax enough to finally give herself a pleasant life, and who knows, maybe meet some nice old man who’ll treat her nicely, one that she can truly love, instead of the facade she’s been trying to maintain all these years. My sister and I have married good men (though it took her two tries – #1 was an awful lot like Dear Old Dad :rolleyes: – so maybe if the blinders fall away, Mom will see what a good partnership can be like, and realize that if we can do it, so can she. But I’m not hopeful; she’s spent too many years conditioning herself not to deserve good things. :frowning:

Yeah, see, this is what I dread more than the death part. I absolutely won’t cave, but I’m prepared for things to get pretty uncomfortable. Again, as above, I may end up pleasantly surprised, but I’m not hopeful.

If there is to be any sort of non-small visitation or whatever, I plan to ask a few of the abovementioned selected friends to come. I’ll be needing my buffer. And I imagine I’ll be saying a simple “Thank you for coming” or something similar to strangers who think I’m heartbroken. Let them think I already did my gnashing and wailing.

Oh, but it is normal! And exactly how it should be. Our friends who are dads are like that, and their kids are as lucky as you were. It’s the rest of us who had the abnormal dads. I won’t speak for anyone else, but it took me a long time to discover that my dad was not typical, and that lots of people have cool dads.

I hadn’t thought of it that way, but yes, you’re exactly right. :slight_smile: Thanks for the extra insight.

“Normal” is a can of worms of course. A thread I started awhile ago, kinda related:

There are fathers who provide the DNA and that’s pretty much it. Then we get to the batch that are assholes, and so on.

My two cents is that your feelings are organic—they didn’t come from nowhere. I think kids are predisposed to love their parents, probably as a function of evolution. It’s natural to bond to your caregivers and in a normal situation with time, an abiding love is bound to develop between parent and child. Hell, some kids would love Adolf Hitler if he just spent a little time with them. But you can’t draw money out of an account when nothing has been deposited in it.

Trust your feelings for what they are. Realize of course that everybody has a different relationship with him so they don’t have to agree with you. If they’re in denial or whatever, that’s their trip. The main thing is that you don’t blame yourself or feel unworthy etc. for someone else’s mistakes. He made his choices and didn’t need your vote.

I’ve been where you are and I feel for you, it’s not an easy road. I am pleased to hear you have friends there to lean on, who ‘get it’.

This is something that was very helpful to me. One day I came across an old photo of my Dad. It was before me or my siblings, before my Mom, the booze, etc. He was young, his eyes shiny and bright, he was smiling.

I had the photo matted and framed and hung it where I would see it every day. I could love this guy, even if I didn’t really know this guy. It helped to have a spot for all the unresolved, ‘wish I had a Dad to love’, feelings.

Whenever I looked into that old black and white photo I was reminded of what he was then, and what I was still, potential. Raw material and potential, all futures were possible still. A kind of powerful message.

This exercise somehow helped to free me of the conditioning that relationship with him had instilled in me. I live freer and healthier today.

We have a picture like that of Mr. S’s dad, when he and Mr. S’s mom were first courting. They both looked so calm and happy, and Dad-in-law was quite the Dapper Dan. (He still had a ciggie in his hand, though . . .) So different from the hideous creature in the pictures from his old age. Kind of like those Faces of Meth pictures, but spanning 50 years.

Mr. S and I were talking about this the other night. He was pretty sure that if you could have stripped away the alcoholism and depression and bitterness, his dad could have been a decent guy.

I have a few pictures of my dad as a child, and I vaguely remember one of my parents’ wedding day. But my mom says she threw out the wedding album long ago, in a fit of anger. No loss to me, but rather telling of what her life has been. Other than that I just have the pictures of him as the goon I remember.

Scarlett, so sad you have to go through that pain. I read these posts, and am so sad to see so many people having to grow up with damaged people raising them. As I did, too. I’m trying to understand and rectify it, now that my parents are aging. Mine haven’t been as horrendous as some said here, but, there was toxic abuse in diminishment and belittling.

Didn’t that sound fancy? I could never figure out why the anger and belittling came as a kid, and it hurt like hell. And I buried it like hell, too. So , here, decades later, still trying to understand my parent’s inability to nurture like a mature person, (they still don’t; a conversation means throw out a topic, and hear them spout out facts (smart educated folks), and ya just listen, because any personal connection is NOT There,even with their own kids.) Freaky, as I’ve learned out here in the regular world.

What I have learned, in trying to have a relationship in the course of what I see as decent: Honoring one’s parents, no matter how damaged and toxic, and wanting to find some peace with it all; I looked at myself as being pissed off and angry about being emotionally abandoned as a kid. I had a right to be, that’s what happened. Whatever happened to my parents to make them that selfish/damaged to do that to a kid: Jesus, what happened to them to make them that blind???

As an adult, I try to have compassion for whatever fucked them up that bad. It’s not to excuse bad behavior, but trying to understand why in their psyche they would become that damaged to not truly connect with their own children. In thinking, this seems a hellish mental state. It must be incredibly painful.

A hard row to hoe, and I know I’m incomplete in explaining compassion as a useful tool in dealing with this, but it is a work in progress for me. I suppose the best thought left to ponder is Elbows photos: What could we say that would break the barrier of pain held by, really, generations of dysfunctional forbears?

Scarlett, I totally hear you. I haven’t seen both of my parents in 6 years (my sister’s funeral excluded, where I didn’t even make eye-contact with them) and have no plans of seeing them again. I know they’ve been to hospital a couple of times, but my sibling know they should never mention them as if I cared.

It’s completely out of character for me and really un-christian, but I gave them far too many chances. I’ve “adopted” my best-friend’s parents as mine (for which they are very happy, my pal is abroad) and they are now my “official” parents: it’s them in the pic when I’m getting my Master’s degree and my third kid’s Baptism.

To the OP,

I once thought as you do about my mum. Now she’s gone, and I’ve done a total 180 on the issue.

It might be prudent to reconsider your conclusions.

best of luck

Well, that’s your experience. I’m pretty confident that mine will be different. (I’ve never enjoyed listening to him or being in his presence – quite the opposite. Why would I miss it when he’s dead?)

The more I think about it, the more I like this interpretation:

With lobotomyboy63’s permission, I may borrow that if it becomes appropriate.

My Mom married 4 times, and each new Dad was supposed to do the job the previous one couldn’t. They all sucked, but the 4th was Epic Fail.

Weirdly enough, I’ve come full circle to the original one, who is an impoverished alcoholic pothead who didn’t change one iota during the 10 years I didn’t have him in my life. Same shitty apartment, same cat, same job, same addiction. We talk on the phone every month or so for about 20 minutes. He’s not really all that bad. I’m a grown up now, so his addiction can’t hurt me.

Ever since I was a little kid, he never pretended to be anything other than he was. When I was 7 he told me flat out that he was always going to be an alcoholic because he preferred his drunken stupor to actually dealing with the painful things in his life. ‘‘You know your Daddy loves you, but this is just the way I am and you’re going to have to accept it.’’ Then he offered me a bottle of Peppermint Schnapps.

He dragged me to bars every single weekend. I was actually kind of spoiled – I’d get an unlimited supply of quarters for the jukebox and pool table and I’d tell the bartender, ‘‘Mountain Dew, on the rocks’’ and I’d dance around for the patrons. He was really proud of me and wanted to show me off, but he was fundamentally incapable of risk assessment. One of his girlfriends was a heroine addict who didn’t feed her children (including my half-sister) and would shoot up right in front of me. I remember once there was a domestic violence situation in which a friend-of-a-friend’s husband was banging on the front door with a shotgun and all of us children had to go hide in the friend’s attic so we didn’t get fucking shot. And he brought me back to that house more than once (it had a really cool fishtank though.)

This father is also the one who gave me stacks of Reader’s Digest to peruse, who taught me how to play chess and sing the National Anthem. I owe my creativity in part to him. Cardboard boxes became sprawling cities, water balloons with sharpied faces became fishes in the rusty bathroom sink–hell, I used to entertain myself for hours by pouring elmer’s glue on my hands, letting it dry and then peeling it off. He used to sing to me – ‘‘Dead Skunk in the Middle of the Road’’ was a favorite.

This father – my biological father – is the best father I have ever had, just as
your shitty father is the best father you have ever had. I know most kids only get one shot–I got four–but this is what we end up with, this is it. We can either take it and appreciate it for its good, or wash our hands of it and be happy we’re free from the emotional tyranny of childhood.

I was fortunate to learn early enough in my life that adults (or even older children) really don’t need their parents. The minute you accept that no adult actually needs blood relatives, the happier you’ll be. (*Everyone *needs a family–but who composes that family is another matter entirely.) This means you have the complete freedom to walk away, OR–and this has been my choice–once you accept that there’s not a need for them, you can simply enjoy them for what they are, without all that emotional fulfillment bullshit people go on about.

I love both of my biological parents very much. I chose to cope with my dysfunctional family members by deciding exactly what I will and will not be willing to tolerate–what actually hurts me and what is just less than ideal. My bio parents are two that I’m very happy to have in my life. Doesn’t mean I don’t get pissed off at them from time to time, but it does mean that I’ve let go of the need for retribution or atonement.

These are your last moments with the man you were fated to be born to. He’s the only Dad you get. How you choose to define those moments is entirely up to you. The only certain thing is that either way, there will be consequences, emotional ramifications, a legacy.

The last thing I will say is that my least favorite relative died completely unexpectedly earlier this year, and I was completely blindsided by the amount of pain I felt at his passing. Though we did grow up together, our relationship could be described as ‘‘awkard’’ at best, antagonistic at its worst. The most positive memory I have of him is the time I was a girl of 11 and put on my best dress so that I would look nice around his friends (they were 16.) The minute I walked into the kitchen he began to criticize my looks and mock me in front of his friends because there was a blue vein visible through my very pale skin. This actually made me run into the bedroom and cry. When he called on me for dinner, he found me crying, and for a moment (though he didn’t apologize) I could tell he was surprised that he’d actually hurt me. It’s pretty pathetic when your most positive memory of someone is the one time they felt bad for hurting your feelings. I was insecure about that damn vein for years (I can’t even see it now–isn’t it amazing how childhood magnifies the tiniest flaws?)

He died this year at 30 years old, just 5 years older than me–doing a stupid fucking thing and he should have known better. The strongest emotion I feel about his death is regret that I didn’t make more of an effort to reach out to him and understand him. His death still hurts months later, and is arguably one of the more life-defining experiences I have had. I would never in a million years have imagined that it would affect me this strongly. So just keep that in mind–death is a funny thing. You don’t know what kind of feelings it might dredge up. Regret is not my favorite.

My mom called tonight. Long story short, the old man has one foot in the grave and the other on a banana peel. He’s out of his mind, incoherent, combative. They found more tumors, he has pneumonia, and he’s on IV only, no food or water. A hospice bed is being prepared for him. From the sound of things, I won’t be surprised if he doesn’t make it to Thanksgiving.

I offered to make the calls to friends/relatives when the time comes, and she took me up on it. She’d already given me the list of contact information. She has lots of little-old-lady friends down there to lean on, and I made sure that she is doing so and will ask for help if she needs it. All the other arrangements are pretty much in order, cremation and such. That’s my mom for you. And (sigh of relief) it sounds like she pretty much knows what my score is on this whole thing and is OK with it.

Assuming he goes fairly soon, there won’t be a service until spring, when she returns to Wisconsin. It will be fairly public, not just immediate family. But by then it will be pretty much just a formality.

I’m still sadder about Madelyn Dunham. I was really pulling for her to live to see tomorrow. For the old man, I’m just watching the clock run down.

Even though he thoroughly disgusts you, you might say a prayer for release from his pain. Maybe your way is best though.

I had one nurturing parent and one parent that inflicted a lot of damage. I remained angry at the world until I dealt with the anger with my mother and cut the marionette strings. It’s a good thing I did. She is almost 96 and generally hell bent on…uh…she forgets.

Scarlett, if someone tries to criticize you for your actions or feelings, just say, “I don’t want to discuss that now.” And no matter what they say to you, just keep saying that. It’s nobody’s business but yours.

In my own situation, I’ve discovered that I can love and hate the same person at the same time. That’s a tough one.

IIRC it was originally my brother’s analogy; I’m sure he wouldn’t mind. :wink:

There’s a sentence in Spanish that we apply to my Gramps often: “mala hierba nunca muere.” “Bad grass (weeds) don’t ever die.”

Mr. S’s dad was the same way; too darn ornery to die. He smoked to excess, drank to excess, ate little and badly, worked too hard, and was bitter and depressed, and it still took several heart attacks and several kinds of cancer to kill him over about 10 years, at age 72.

Meanwhile, my paternal unit is going into hospice today. (I’m glad I won’t have to hear what would have been, I’m sure, some purely lovely comments out of his mouth about our president-elect. I’m sure he doesn’t even know.)

I’m not sure I have any wise words to help you situation. My parents had their flaws, but they were good people and they loved us. My dad died 14 years ago, my mom last month. She pretty much filled a large church, and it was gratifying to discover just how many friends she had. I managed to visit her once when she was doing ok in September, but she died while I was boarding a plane for my next trip.

I guess the best I have to offer is related to that. When mom would visit, I never spent enough time with her. My brother, my wife, kids, and I would laugh at how hard it was to get her to hang up on the phone. Now, of course, I wish I’d been more attentive. Figure out all the feelings you resent not having towards your father, and all the actions you regret not regretting, and use them as a lesson towards how to treat you mom. Angry that your dad was unlovable? Be extra lovable towards your mom. Angry that your dad belittled your ideas. Be extra supportive of your mom’s. Get something from your dad’s death, if nothing more than new wisdom on how to treat your mom and sister.

I came home this morning to a tearful message from my mother. He was shutting down, and they were saying it would be a matter of days, if that. She said I didn’t need to call her back, though I could if I wanted to, otherwise she would probably call me tonight.

I called her back, and she answered, very upset. She asked right away if she could call me later, because now it was going to be very soon. I asked if she had someone with her, and she said yes.

So I canceled my afternoon doctor appointment, and am waiting for what will probably be the last call.

}}}}}Scarlett{{{{{

(I think those are hugs.) It’s tough on everybody, regardless of the situation.

Thanks. Yeah, I’m a bit jittery, just sitting here waiting. The phone almost never rings at our house, so of course today it’s ringing off the hook: Mr. S calling on his breaks (which is fine), the car dealer wanting to know if everything was fine after our last oil change :rolleyes: , etc. I’m sure glad for Caller ID. At least I’ll have an idea when The Call comes.

Meanwhile I’ve cleaned up my office a bit and just started balancing my checkbook. And of course am surfing the Dope for something to do. Not sure whether I should tackle actual billable work.

Mom just called. He’s gone.

I’ll decline to give details, except to say that she was glad that the worst did not last long. As am I. Though his disease was self-inflicted, no one deserves to go like that. Hopefully now they can both be at peace.

She has an excellent support network of friends with her. I told her to go get a big hug from one of them and say that it was from me.

You’ve got my sympathies, Scarlett. I was raised by a set of fantastic grandparents, and occasionally visited by a mother who only showed up to make my life a living hell. I eventually had to cut off all ties with her, and only briefly mourned what should have been when she died.