Not so much stupidity as ignorance, although it can be a fine line.
We’ve had to tell young cashiers that yes, New Mexico is part of the US, Canadian driver’s licenses are legit, and any passport from any country is also valid ID for purposes of purchasing anything.
I have also had to tell young cashiers that half dollars, dollar coins, and $2 bills are valid currency.
Yeah - we’re not allowed to use expired ID’s. Penalties include loss of job and legal fines. So… sorry. Please be outraged politely, the clerks don’t make the laws.
Again - we do not make the rules. Or the laws.
We are absolutely forbidden to use an expired ID. Period. I can not sell you alcohol, cigarettes, cough syrup, ammunition, fireworks, or anything else requiring proof of age if all you have is an expired ID. We also stumble over license renewals - now the DMV is issuing a black and white print/copy of the new ID. I am sorry - we are not permitted to use that as ID. I know the DMV told you that was just as good as a real license. If you get pulled over by a cop, yes it is. For anything else it is not. When I got my license renewed and the DMV clerk told me that I informed her that no, it’s NOT - you can not use it as proof of ID to purchase items.
I’ve had some VERY upset customers over this. Be as upset as you want to be - I need my job. Yes, I know it’s a pain. We go through the exact same thing when we get our licenses renewed.
If you do not like this (and I’m sure you don’t) please complain to the people in your state who make laws, and/or to the company that owns the emporium at which you were shopping. Please do not give the cashier a hard time over this.
I’ve heard this complaint many times before and I don’t really understand it. The whole thing was expired, not just your driving privileges. Non-driver ID cards expire too, even though there is no other status attached to them. Maybe the regulations are too strict and they should just not be asking as many people for ID at all, or there should be a grace period of a few weeks in states that do this by mail, but I’m not sure why people get mad when they’re not able to use an ID card that literally says it’s not valid.
Part of it is because the although the document has expired the identifying information has not - sure, the card is expired and it makes sense to have a driver’s license expire if the state is going require some sort of test or a new photo at renewal time * but that’s still my photo and birthdate on the license even if it expired yesterday .
And another part is because in at least some states , an expired license/ID is sufficient proof to get an new one. Really, probably in any state-I don’t know of anywhere that requires new proofs of residence, date of birth, and identity to renew a license at the expiration date. My state explicitly lists a license expired for less than two years as sufficient proof of identity to get a new one.
A third part is that most of these situations involve people who aren’t being asked for ID because someone is unsure of their age but rather because of a policy to ID almost everyone. No 21 year old is wondering why an expired license is no good.
Don’t get me wrong - they shouldn’t give the cashier or probably even the manager a hard time. They don’t make the laws/rules and those are the people who should get the feedback - but it’s bizarre that a license is not accepted as proof of my identity/date of birth the day after it expires, but (depending on the state) one that was issued when I was 16 and which consequently has a photo of 16 year-old me can be used as ID when I am 50 or 60 years old and look nothing like the photo. Or that the expired license that I can’t use to buy beer might be sufficient proof of my identity/date of birth to get a new license ( which of course I can use to buy beer)
* in my state, there have been times when an eye test was required to renew
This is a lot of it. The 21 year old isn’t upset. Nor is the person who no longer looks anything like that ancient photo. It’s the 45 year old who, due to cya rules of the store, being asked to prove he’s over 16, and who has a card that, dammit, still looks like him and contains a birthdate that didn’t change when the license expired.
I understand that it’s easier for the store to id everyone. But you know what, i haven’t plausibly looked under 16, or under 21, for a really long time. It’s annoying that you are asking me for id at all. It would be far more annoying if that stupid id check is going to mean i can’t get my stuff.
Also, expired IDs are often good enough. Back when you could get into Canada and Bermuda from the US with a valid birth certificate and a driver’s license, you could also do so with an expired passport. I even did it, once. The customs official asked me a few extra questions (including why i was using the expired one) but let me in the country without incident.
I’m honestly surprised that an expired drivers licence that still looks like the holder isn’t accepted as proof of age.
Where do you live that this is (expected to be) a common thing? I had to look up what it was (and thereby discovered that it’s similar to a local product here that’s pretty common, but made of plums instead of apples).
I, for one, thought apple butter was very common. We had it (home-made) all the time when I was a kid.
On the other hand, I looked for dried mushrooms yesterday at the supermarket we frequent. Couldn’t find it anywhere; nor could I find anyone who ever heard of it. One clerk suggested I buy a package of mushrooms and leave them out for a few days.
The picture on my license from forty years ago doesn’t look much like the one that’s on there now.
Yes, that isn’t really a factor if the license expired four days or four weeks ago instead of forty years ago. But it’s tricky to write the law to read ‘an expired document is OK for ID as long as the picture’s still recent enough’.
If it can only be so used when it expired less than two years ago, then you couldn’t use the one with your photo at 16 when you’re 50. At least, unless your state’s licenses are ordinarily good for 32 years but not forever, which seems unlikely.
Now it might make sense to rewrite the laws so that an ID expired less than two years can be used to buy age-restricted items – that is a nice clear line that laws can be written to meet.
Probably because it isn’t fair to expect the cashier to get into an argument about whether the picture still looks enough like the person presenting it. That’s quite a judgement call to stick the poor cashier with.
But that’s just shifting the goalposts. I can see someone trying to argue with the store clerk; “Come on. It only expired 25 months ago. That’s only one month past the limit.”
True. But the person might have had two years of being repeatedly reminded that their ID was expired; during which at least some such people would renew the thing.
Though I suppose that only works if cashiers are trained to mention it. And customers would then complain about the reminders.
I was a little nervous when traveling internationally twelve years ago. My passport picture was 8 years old. I had hair and beard both to my belt-line (yes, ZZTop). I had recently dropped 25 pounds, shaved my head like a cue ball, and taken my beard to a short, fashionable goatee. I looked nothing like my passport pic, but my passport was good for two more years.
Smoothest travel ever, not even a second glance or comment.
Arizona licenses don’t expire until you are 65 years old, no matter how old you were when it was issued and a new photo is only needed if the current photo is more than 12 years old. My NY license has to be renewed every 8 years - but I can renew online or by mail and that means I can have a very old photo on my license as I don’t need a photo at renewal unless I am changing the type of license. I had the same photo for at least 15 years until I decided to get an enhanced license - and I think my husband had the same one for twenty.
I wasn’t really outraged, and of course I was polite to the clerk. As has been discussed in other such threads – I was thinking of you when I posted, actually – it was entertaining to be a gray-bearded elder forbidden by a teenager to buy cigarettes. But I do get the rules, believe me.
My NY license has an updated picture; but I probably renewed it in person (lines are rarely long at my county office.) I’d assumed one had to send a photo if renewing online – I presume you do need to send proof of eye exam?
Darn, I was expecting the next line to be “And y’know what? I did fine without 'em, and haven’t had a cigarette since. I should see if that clerk still works there and thank 'em.”
Currently - but you can actually do that by having the exam done by an approved provider ( including a pharmacist ) who uploads the results to a database. However, eye tests were not required for some period of time - I think they were reinstated around 2000 and they were gone 5-10 years.
Not really. It’s fairly common to have some glitch while renewing, or just have a sheet of paper that says, “this person can drive, the new license is coming soon”. So tons of people have a slightly expired driver’s licence through no fault on their part, and would be annoyed that they can’t buy age-restricted products. Anyone whose license expired more than 2 years ago knows that they don’t have a valid driver’s license, and if they care, they’ve had plenty of time to fix that.
Because it’s not valid for driving, but in reality, if you’re 45, and show a driving licence that says you’re 45 when trying to buy booze or cigarettes, - even if it’s expired - you will fit the age on the licence.
So it depends on the local laws. If it’s “must show valid ID,” then the clerk has to see valid ID. If it’s “must see valid ID or otherwise reasonably believe that the purchaser is over age,” then the clerk is probably still wise to skirt on the safe side. But there are lots of people over 21 who don’t drive and don’t have a current passport.
I went to a liquor store with my brother when we were in our 20s and, granted, we did look pretty young. They checked our IDs at the door and he was denied entry because he didn’t have a driver’s license. His legal & valid Illinois ID wasn’t acceptable at this Illinois store, DLs only.
I was sitting in a bar in Oregon having a beer when a young guy came in with an Arizona driver’s license with some kind of expiration date far into the future and the bartender looked at it for awhile and then just said “nope” and gave it back to him. He was polite and said something like, “yeah, we get that a lot.”
After he left I told the bartender, who was a friend of mine, that the license was good. She just said something like “it’s my job and my discretion who I serve.” The bartender is always right.
When I was in Australia I asked for ketchup at a fish and chips joint. The young waitress looked at me like I was asking for a grass whip or a cotter pin or something. An older worker stepped in and said, “he means tomato sauce”.
He then went into the back for a minute, then emerged and handed me a thimble-sized paper receptacle containing about a teaspoon of inferior ketchup.