Intalling software and keycodes

Factual Questions
1

**Disclaimer: By asking this question and starting this thread I am in no way advocating, promoting or encouraging any illegal activity including but not limited to illegal duplication of copyrighted software. Got that? :slight_smile: **

I shared the purchase price of Microsoft’s Office for Mac. You get three different Keycodes on the back of the box- so that you can register three installations since many people own more than one machine in their home. Keeps the three installations separate in terms of upgrades and tech support. Lovely idea.

My friend alledges that once the three Keycodes have each been used once for installs, you can not install the software ever again. I insisted that the CD ( which is storebought and totally on the up and up ), is a burned media and has no way of KNOWING if it’s been re-installed fifty times using the Keycodes on the box. After all, my license paid allows me a re-install if my computer crashes, right? It’s not a one-time license use.

Similarly, all three legal Keycodes on the back can be used by the three people who have installed the software and used one of the three Keycodes, so that they are permitted support and upgrades- and used over and over, in case of crashes or damaged software. That’s how it has always been.

I declined really getting into a hot fight over this, but here is the core question.

If not used to register the software over the internet, but only used to complete the installation for private use, how is it possible for the software to “know” it has been installed at all? To me, it cannot know, it is not a writeable media.

My friend disagreed, saying that at the large unnamed company where she works, a CD Install set for Adobe Acrobat can be used by 5 SPECIFIC employees with their ID #'s, but not by anyone else. I am guessing that the corporation has CD’s burned with pre-set ID info for a few people. ( this company is that huge, yes. )

To me the software is on a set burned CD, and is not alterable in any way. Use of the Keycodes in the legal and moral issue of course, but I am asking a basic question that has a factual answer, not opening up a debate over stealing. Can this software somehow know when all 3 keycodes have been installed on 3 discrete machines, and therefore interrupt an attempted 4th install on a 4th machine?

Cartooniverse

2

Your reasoning is perfect, without network connectivity there is no way to tell how many times a particular keycode has been used. Chances are your friend is operating in a network environment, possibly with a license server on the network or via registration with adobe’s website (I have to deal with software that has to be de-registered over the phone before it will install again, for example).

3

Not exactly connected with your specific situation, but I’ve seen situations where trial versions couldn’t simply be uninstalled and reinstalled for another trial period - presumably they left some registry keys hidden away somewhere.

I also have a piece of software that uses the C-Dilla license control system; you purchase a license key that is specific to yourself and the machine on which you wish to install it; you can’t easily move it around, but this system does ‘phone home’, so you’d simply not be able to install it on a machine that wasn’t net-connected.

There’s no way for a machine (which may not even have a CD recorder anyway) to write back to a pressed CD medium; unless the software pack comes with a supplementary software key floppy (I’ve seen this before), there’s no way for standalone machine B to tell that the software has already been installed on standalone machine A.

4

I’ll assume you’re talking about MS Office 2003 for this reply.

When you install, but do not activate, you get 30 days of usage for the software. You can not unistall and reinstall (without Operating system reinstall) and get another 30 days.

When you activate, Microsoft makes some sort of “PC Identification” and registers that key code to that PC. Too many installations to new hardware, and you will no longer be able to activate the software. Multiple installations (following OS rebuilds for example) are no problem. Microsoft is very reluctant to tell you how many times is “too many.” for obvious reasons.

An exception to this would be for volume licensing, though some versions require the activation, some do not, depending on how it is sold. The keys are not interchangable between different “pressed CD versions” (e.g. OEM keys won’t work on Volume license media, nor on Retail version media, etc.)

The Windows XP operating system activation works in a similar manner.

YMMV of course, though to be fair, you are already in technical violation of the EULA by installing on PCs that aren’t “yours” (3 keys, 3 PCs implied that they are all owned personally by you). Not that I have any problem with this of course. I ALWAYS register ALL software of course (in case M$ is reading this! :slight_smile: )

-Butler

5

Are you sure? After all, when you purchase a software license the actual computer is irrelevant. For example, if I own a PC that needs to be repaired and a friend loans me a spare PC that they own, I can install the software on that PC and use it with no violation. However, once I have my own PC back I am able to install the software on my machine and use it, but I must also uninstall the software from the loaner machine before returning it.

6

Whoah! Almost none of this applies in Mac software yet. Likely this is Office 2004, so even with MS we Mac users are ahead of the curve! There’s no activation on Mac MS products.

Even on XP with Activation, though, I wonder if System Restore would allow you to reinstall the Office suite every 30 days? My work-sponsored, $20 copy of Office 2003 is perfectly legal, so I haven’t bothered to try it…

7

Those smart floppies have almost all been replaced by Smartkey USB devices, Parallel port connectors, and some serial port connectors. No doubts that they are still in use, however.

Either way, the licensing agreement varies from software to software, and in the some cases, as with Microsoft Office, it can change from method of purchase. The explanation of Office activation and licensing can be found here. It explains how Office activation works, how the license is bound, and hopefully answers Cartooniverse’s questions.

8

Resident expert on product activation/licensing checking in:

Mac products do not have product activation as of yet.

However, the description by Butler is fairly accurate of the behaviour of software that requires product activation.

Now based on the EULA, the software is intended for use by the original installers only, so in the case of the Mac version, it can be installed by the 3 people, and only those three. The EULA does make allowances for removing and selling the license to someone else as long as it is completely removed and all codumentation etc is given to the new owner.

As for the issue of reinstalls, this is allowed by the EULA. With a non-product activation copy of course there would be no limitations. For a product activation copy you can reinstall on the same system over and over with no ill effects either. You have to re-activate but it’s quick and simple. If you reinstall after you have significantly changed your hardware configuration, or removed it off anothe rsystem to place it on a new system, that is also fine but you end up speaking to someone on the phoen to make sure you understand the rules of the EULA.

A lot more companies are using this type of technology, not oly Adobe, but people who make specific products for specific worktypes like Robodemo.

9

Dunno how to tell you this, but it’s for Office for Mac 2004. :dubious: There is in fact a lock between License Keycodes and installations. If three Macs are used, and all three Keycodes are used and registered on the Internet with MicroSoft, then that’s it. One is pirating after that, and not able to register or use downloads or support.

I used a Keycode. The second one listed. She used the first. She has another yet to use, and yet owns only one Mac in her home. Since she paid 149.00 for the software ( she is an educator, and got that release ), and I am handing her 50.00 tonight, I am sleeping fine on this one. I am installing it on my machine here, and have paid for the use of it on this one machine.

Anyway, I am in agreement with those of you who feel it’s physically impossible for normal End Users to have their use of the software imprinted or recorded by the Install Disks. They’re CD’s, life isn’t wired that way.

Now, I have spent the better part of today transferring my WordPerfect for PC documents into MS Word for Mac. Oye gevalt. A three step process involving a removable FireWire drive, WordPerfect, MS Word for PC 1997/ 2000, and finally Word for Mac 2004. Ugly, but translated fine in the end. Gack…

10

Don’t have to tell me – same thing I said. Office 2004. There’s no Office 2004 that’s not for the Mac, if that’s the distinction you’re trying to make…

11

iWorks does, though I hear it’s fairly benign.

12

Egad, sorry. I had in my head what Butler1850 had said, about it being the 2003 release. My apologies !!

13

Well let’s back up for a second. It may have some copy protection but i can say with 100% certainty it’s not the same as Microsoft Product Activation.

What’s the link you used to register the codes?

14

I don’t know anything about the specific software, but I’ll answer with a ‘no’ - it’ll install many times over.

OTOH, I have seen software that is meant to prevent such situations. It could, for example, register itself with MS without intervention. (This would require internet access, of course).

The other type I’ve seen (on a Win32 X emulator demo) uses the LAN to broadcast and check for more copies of itself. If someone else on the network is running it, it’ll refuse to run. (This requires only a local network).

15
      • Do note: there’s a story on the tech sites now (today) about how when you try to access any OS updates, Microsoft is going to require you to verify the status not only of your OS, but of any MS-published software as well. The big news today is the beta is live, and it automatically tosses an error and quits if your MS {non-OS} software is running on WINE…
        http://linux.slashdot.org/linux/05/02/17/1318212.shtml?tid=125&tid=109&tid=106
        ~
16

I installed Window Media Player 10 on my XP box last night, and while it told me I had to authenticate, when it came right down to it, it gave me the option to skip authentication. It wasn’t on WINE, though…

17

Sorry all, I was thinking a Windows environment. For the Mac world, I’ve no clue, as the lack of a 2nd mouse button has always left me baffled! :slight_smile:

You’re fine as a “practical” matter, though you may not be legal otherwise… depending on the EULA.

-butler

18

Do you have a cite for this?

god I feel so dirty having said that

19

Sorry I just realized I wasn’t clear. When I said “For this” i meant this portion:

not the portion about WINE

20

Sounds like a variation on the MS Palladium project when in the next version of Windows, only software specifically licensed by Microsoft and Intel will be able to be installed and operated.