Shoot, I missed that people can’t post at all at Night.
That’s an interesting wrinkle, I thought they just couldn’t vote.
Pleo might be right about asking about who can travel. I can’t. I’m in London and London only.
I’m not entirely sure what the benefits to travel are at all. There are, however, twelve people currently in London; plus two on the plane.
sacher, have you provided fake PMs to anyone?
[speculation]
I see no reason to believe that all the scum can travel, either. It’s entirely possible that there are scum who are stuck in the same city all game.
For that matter, we might have characters with a ‘deport’ power that can force someone to travel, even if they don’t want to, or don’t have the ability.
[/speculation]
I think the division between locations actually makes mass actions easier. Instead of getting all 20+ players to act, we only need to get 10+.
Again, it may be easier to think of this game as two separate mafia games, with some overlap. With the number of players here now in London, it’s more like mid game. Hence easier to actually do a mass claim. There may be reasons not to do a mass “travellers” claim, but orchestrating it is not one.
Perhaps. Also perhaps not.
Alright. Will you provide them to anyone who asks?
I find it very interesting that it’s the first hours of Day 1 and you’re already pushing for a mass claim. I don’t know what kind of roles there are in this game – but I am wondering if you may be looking for a specific person or particular citizenship as a target for your own power role. At the very least I find it suspicious, and would prefer to wait for a few days and have some more info before we try any kind of claim.
Perhaps. Also perhaps not.
What are you talking about? Pleonast hasn’t pushed for a mass claim. He(she?) just said it’s possible. In fact, just a little while ago they said:
You’re right. He’s being more subtle than just “pushing” – but he’s suggesting, and already trying to make it sound plausible. I don’t like it.
My initial thought is that the mafia will benefit from shifting resources as opportunities and threats arise, while the town will benefit from a narrowing of the suspect pool for any given night action.
As to whether it’s wise to reveal which of us can (or must) travel, it might disadvantage the scum by forcing them to decide straight away whether or not to lie about their travel abilities. On the other hand, the information would surely be of strategic benefit to them as they hatch their wicked schemes. Barring any better reason than I’ve come up with for the reveal, my instinct is to say keep the info to ourselves, at least until we have a better idea of how this is all going to work in practice.
Another thing I just thought of (although this should go without saying)…since we have multiple people (as there is now) who can’t even POST right now, I expect the “lynch the lurker” gambit won’t be used too much (which is good, since I always hated that reason anyway).
You’re right; Pleonast is making a subtle suggestion that we have a ‘mass’ claim. I don’t care for it much either. But I’ve come to the conclusion that Pleonast’s play style just doesn’t sit well with me in general, so I’m not the most objective judge when it comes to him.
Scum might benefit by being able to be flexible, but this would be at least partially offset by the fact that a Travel Day in effect causes a person to lose a Night, so they would be unable to take any actions for another Day.
I don’t see any advantage to any sort of mass revealing of travel abilities. I doubt very much that there is any correlation between alignment or powers. I think once again it comes down to not giving the Scum any more information than they already possess, until it’s necessary. Of course, I am against mass claims as a matter of principle…
Okay, let me see if I understand the travel rules right, with the example of a player who travels back and forth, and compare it with someone who does not travel.
Turn 1 - T00:00-T12:00: London/Day, Wellington/Night - Hero starts in London. [He can post and vote].
Turn 2 - T12:00-T24:00: London/Night, Wellington/Day - Hero sends order to travel.
Turn 3 - T00:00-T12:00: London/Day, Wellington/Night - Hero is in transit. [He can post but not vote].
Turn 4 - T12:00-T24:00: London/Night, Wellington/Day - Hero is in Wellington. [He can post and vote].
Turn 5 - T00:00-T12:00: London/Day, Wellington/Night - Hero sends order to travel.
Turn 6 - T12:00-T24:00: London/Night, Wellington/Day - Hero is in transit. [He can post but not vote].
Turn 7 - T00:00-T12:00: London/Day, Wellington/Night - Hero is in London. [He can post and vote].
Turn 8 - T00:00-T12:00: London/Night, Wellington/Day - Hero sends order to travel.
Posting opportunities: 5 (Turn 1 London, Turn 3 London, Turn 4 Wellington, Turn 6 Wellington, Turn 7 London)
Vote opportunities: 3 (Turn 1 in London, Turn 4 in Wellington, Turn 7 in London)
Kill opportunities for scum: 3 (Turn 2 in London, Turn 5 in Wellington, Turn 8 in London)
Be killed opportunities: 3 (Turn 2 in London, Turn 5 in Wellington, Turn 8 in London)
And a player who cannot travel:
Turn 1 - T00:00-T12:00: London/Day, Wellington/Night - Hero starts in London. [He can post and vote].
Turn 2 - T12:00-T24:00: London/Night, Wellington/Day - Hero stays in London.
Turn 3 - T00:00-T12:00: London/Day, Wellington/Night - Hero is in London. [He can post and vote].
Turn 4 - T12:00-T24:00: London/Night, Wellington/Day - Hero stays in London.
Turn 5 - T00:00-T12:00: London/Day, Wellington/Night - Hero is in London. [He can post and vote].
Turn 6 - T12:00-T24:00: London/Night, Wellington/Day - Hero stays in London.
Turn 7 - T00:00-T12:00: London/Day, Wellington/Night - Hero is in London. [He can post and vote].
Turn 8 - T12:00-T24:00: London/Night, Wellington/Day - Hero stays in London.
Posting opportunities: 4 (Turn 1 in London, Turn 3 in London, Turn 5 in London, Turn 7 in London)
Vote opportunities: 4 (Turn 1 in London, Turn 3 in London, Turn 5 in London, Turn 7 in London)
Kill opportunities for scum: 4 (Turn 2 in London, Turn 4 in London, Turn 6 in London, Turn 8 in London)
Be killed opportunities: 4 (Turn 2 in London, Turn 4 in London, Turn 6 in London, Turn 8 in London)
So in effect travelling lets you:
- Post more (2 turns out of 3 instead of the normal 1 in 2)
- Vote less (once every 3 turns instead of the normal 2)
- Kill less, if you are scum (once every 3 turns instead of the normal 2)
- Less chance to be killed (once every 3 turns instead of the normal 2)
Unless I made a mistake somewhere, is appears that traveling is not necessarily a bad thing. A player will vote less, and will also have less kill opportunities, but will however be able to participate more and you won’t be as much a target to be night killed.
This analysis assumes that players cannot be killed while in transit.
Sachertorte, can you confirm if players can be killed, or not, while in transit?
NETA: I see that I am not using T hours properly in my previous post. They should be cumulative, e.g. Turn 3 should start at T24:00 instead of being reset to T00:00, but I will refrain from editing as this is a minor detail.
But anyway, it just seems easier to refer as “turns” instead of hours.
About mass claiming: I am always against it. Unless the host didn’t do his job, mass claiming will help the scum more than the Town because our power roles will be targeted first.
About mass claiming only travel abilities: I am not sure yet. I liked the argument that scum would have to immediately state if they can travel or not, so they will have to stick to their word or be seriously questioned. There might be drawbacks to this, but I am not seeing them. My hunch still is to keep our mouth shut about it, until at least 1-2 turns are done, because we don’t have enough information and because I don’t like giving free information to the scum without immediate paynack and we don’t have strong reasons to believe this would help us.
I don’t blame Idle for saying he can travel, we could deduce this from him being in transit, which is also true for Plankton.
Since this is out, I’d like to hear opinions about what the best strategy for Idle is. Should he travel as much as possible, or stick to Wellington after he lands? I think that he should be moving a lot, based on my previous analysis, but I’m still interested to hear what everyone thinks.
And an interesting question: Why do we start with 2 players in Transit to Wellington?
Why none to London?
Why is sachertorte giving us, out of the gates, information that these 2 players can travel?
Does this means one of them is Scum and the other is Town? I’m not sure what to expect here. I’d be surprised if the two of them were Scum, but it may be 1-1 or even 2 townies.
One of the interesting twists that I didn’t notice until now is that a warrant for arrest can be issued but not carried out immediately if the person is in another location (it is effective upon their return though). Since the first day is always one of the hardest, those of us in London could issue a warrant for somebody traveling to or already in Wellington while still allowing them to play for a little longer in case we’re wrong.
Why would we want to do that on Idle, Plankton, or someone who has not talked yet, unless we have some case?
Issuing a warrant against a player would prevent a player from traveling and it could screw us, because he might be needed later in London, for whatever reason (1 more vote, power role or anything else that we cannot predict now for lack of knowledge).
And it appears that there is no way to cancel a warrant so we better have a case against one of them before making that our day 1 strategy, unless there’s a way to cancel a warrant.
Sachertorte: Is there a way to cancel a warrant once it is issued? I realize that there’s nothing in the rules, but I’d like to hear it from you. 
If it’s not possible per se, I can see someone having the power to cancel a warrant, maybe even a scum, and of course sachertorte is not gonna let us know about that.
But anyway, I am against your idea, Wolverine. I think it’s better that we try to find the best suspect here in London, rather than targeting someone who would be then prevented from coming to London, and this, without a good reason against him.
A player starts to travel from Wellington to London at Dawn in Wellington. That has not happened yet, so no-one in Wellington can possibly have started to travel.
I don’t think we can even begin to speculate yet.
So your proposal is to vote for someone who has not been allowed to post since the game started. Since they have not posted, we have no evidence that the chosen one is a member of the ICR (that’s International Crime Ring, Pleo.) Thus you are essentially choosing to incarcerate someone simply because… why? Don’t like their name? Revenge for a previous game? (That’s not applicable if you’ve never played with us before, obviously.)
Fundamentally that would be a random lynch, and one we get no information from. Far better to lynch someone in London, because we gain more information, and information is what we need.