Our current binge TV is Kim’s Convenience. it is a Canadian half hour comedy, centered around a family of Korean immigrants who run a convenience store. A good part of the humor is related to the English language skills of the mother and father. There are also several other characters of various ethnicities.
I think it is a very pleasant comedy. The family and friends genuinely care for each other. The family generally works together at the end, people are not mean-spirited… But I began wondering whether some people might consider it racist.
And - I guess - if it IS racist, is that a bad thing? Ought I not enjoy racist media?
I also enjoy it and don’t think of it as racist. Much of the humor is related to cultural differences but not necessarily negative stereotypes. The family dynamic which becomes apparent later makes it a much deeper show than your average 30min comedy.
I’m in the 3d season, and still enjoying it. I really get a kick out of the 2 neighborhood guys who stop by. They crack me up. But I realize I may be laughing at stereotypes.
Just wondered if this show I think of as a pleasant and positive comedy, some people would consider racist or otherwise inappropriate.
Exactly. I mentioned in another thread that most of the trick-or-treaters are black kids from the nearby apartments, and that the trick-or-treaters this year were neighborhood no-mask people because they were white.
Someone predictably was like “What’s their race have to do with it?” The answer is nothing at all, other than it’s a very good indicator of where they live in my particular part of Dallas.
I’m sure someone thinks that’s racist, just because I’m using race as an proxy for where someone lives, but it’s not making any kind of stereotyping, or assigning anything negative to them otherwise.
You don’t have to do anything. “Show about a minority group was actually written by a member of that group” is pertinent information to your original question, don’t you think?
Just to add to its bonafides, Korean families played a huge part in running convenience stores in Toronto from the 80s onward including the family of a classmate of mine.
I have encountered this particular phenomenon, which I have dubbed Schrodinger’s Offense, many times in the last few years. It’s when something you encounter is simultaneously offensive and non-offensive until you find out who the creator is upon which time you know it is one or the other.
I agree with this. Though I also think it’s a minefield to do both skillfully and charitably. Even with good intentions you may fail. And as a separate matter many folks discussing racial things don’t have good intentions. Rather the opposite.
But not everybody agrees that “racial” != “racist”.
Many folks argue that anything, anything, which acknowledges a stereotype serves to perpetuate it. And is therefore per se racist. In their view, the only acceptable response to stereotyping is to decry it as anathema. And never to indulge in it.
I have not seen the show, so I’m only commenting on social generalities. Not on how well the show succeeds or fails at handling this.
You can also understand how having an author or creator of the relevant ethnicity might go towards a presumption of benign intent on the part of the author/creator. Which, for some, but not all audiences, would make it OK.
I’ve heard this expressed as well, but I think the biggest problem with it is that it denies those not in the mainstream from telling their stories. Immigrant, outsider, pioneers all have stories to tell that need to acknowledge their differences.
BTW, I understand that you are not advocating that idea, just commenting on it.
Was Corner Gas racist? It was as white as could be, aside from Cst. Davis.
But that was a pretty accurate portrait of the population demo of most small Saskatchewan towns when I was growing up. May have changed since then with more immigration from non-European countries.
If Brent Butt can make a comedy that shows what his small town was like when he was growing up as a white kid in a primarily white environment, why can’t Ins Choi make a comedy about what his experience was as an immigrant Korean kid growing up in multi-ethnic Toronto?
I admit that I am likely dense, and blinded by my identity, but I still find this somewhat confusing.
I honestly do not wish to refer to anyone in ways that trouble them, but find it can be challenging to determine what is or is not offensive. The same joke - such as humor based on an immigrants language skills - might be offensive or not, depending on who came up with the joke, their reasons behind the joke, where and how it was published, who repeated the jokes and why…
Take Kim’s Convenience. Would it matter if the original play was written by a non-Korean? Do the Korean creator’s motivations matter? Perhaps he resents and wishes to ridicule his culture… How about if I - a white male - repeat a joke from the store?
Please accept that I am not TRYING to offend anyone, or tell anyone how to interpret things (other than my personal views/statements.) A part of me almost feels like I’m laughing at a racist joke, or other joke at someone’s expense.
Thanks for noticing the difference. Some folks have a hard time believing anyone can write something they’re not advocating for. To them, it’s polemic all the way down.
I don’t know that I agree with that. Or at least not completely.
The stories of a Korean shopkeeper can be real and can be told. But they’re stories about humans being humans, not about Koreans being Korean, nor shopkeepers being shopkeepers, nor immigrants being immigrants. It’s the group attributions that are troublesome, not the reality of human existence in human society. Or at least that’s the attitude of the no-good-stereotype crowd.
From this interview with Paul Sun-Hyung Lee (Appa on the show):
"Still, Lee bristles at the idea that Kim’s Convenience somehow promotes stereotypes of Korean immigrants, something that has been talked about since the series began.
“I took umbrage to that,” he says. “The word stereotype, I think, was misused in this case. I always say we are not stereotypes, we are playing archetypes. The difference is, with a stereotype it is one common trait that you blanket an entire group of people with. That’s it. That’s all they are, that’s all they will ever be. You can interchange anybody with a stereotype. With an archetype, it’s similar in that you’re bringing a blanket trait that is common to a group of people but that’s the starting point and you build from there. You get three-dimensional, realistic characters with hopes and fears and faults and strengths and that’s what we’re trying to portray in Kim’s.”
And this from Ins Choi and Paul on Q from CBC Radio: Ins Choi & Paul Sun-Hyung Lee on Kim’s Convenience - YouTube
For those of you saying 'Racist!" I respectfully think you’re misinformed.
Season 4 ep 1 does a great bit relevant to this thread. The Korean guy (Jung) and white boss (Shannon) go to a restaurant run by Chinese. After, the 2 Korean guys are making fun of the Chinese guys’ accents, and everyone is laughing. When Shannon joins in, they say she can’t do that accent. She asks why the Koreans can, because they are not Chinese.
Then folk make fun of an Australian customer’s accent. Shannon asks why the Koreans can make fun of him - they say because he is white. But the Australian dude was of color. Causing them to look to the Black employee.
Not sure I fully understand this, but that was damned funny!
