I second. When I went to high school, I lived a 3 minute bikeride away, and was always late for class, until I got a conduct mark. After that I was always on time.
I have friends who are chronically late, so I usually tell them to show up a bit earlier than intended.
Modern physics tells us that space-time is all part of the same thing and encompasses a standard set of dimensions. Imagine if you told your friend that you would meet at a certain place at a certain time every week at 5:00 pm. One time you arrive at 5:10 pm, another time at 5:20 and another at 5:15. You screwed it up every time and it is of very strong note that you were never there early contrary to the idea that you have no awareness of time.
Now imagine that you showed up at 5:00 pm each time but one time you showed up three buildings away once and on the roof of another building another. You seem to have no awareness of the dimensions of the universe. Your friends never have any idea where to find you in this multidimensional universe. You are a lost sheep causing grief in frustrated shepherds.
You can’t seem to navigate our universe in all its dimensions. That is nothing to be proud of or at least make excuses for. That is a fundamental flaw like not being able to operate your limbs properly. In those cases, you should acknowledge the egregious deficit and ask others with strengths in that ability for help in compensating for it.
It isn’t necessarily your fault per se but it is a cross to bear and a fundamental handicap that must be acknowledged. No one can help you if you don’t ask for help.
Yep, I’ve heard that in this and other threads. Frankly, it’s so alien a perspective for me, I can’t get my head around it. For me, chronic lateness is the equivalent of someone promising something, then deliberately not delivering. Over and over again. And in the process inconveniencing me. You may classify this any way you want, but for me it’s not respectful, and it’s hard for me to fathom how someone–even if he disagrees–can’t understand that perspective.
You probably feel the same way about me. Oh, well…
I’m not sure I “look down on” latesters, but I do know that I choose not to associate with them if I have any choice. And I have no problem with them feeling the same about me.
The late folks may not “disrespect” me, but I do feel as though they are wasting my time. I generally consider time spent waiting for people to be a waste of my time. Sure i can bring reading material or find other ways to spend my time, but given the choice I would nearly always be able to find something else to do someplace other than waiting for someone. It essentially keeps me in “suspended animation”, preventing me from being elsewhere and doing other things.
I have a very low tolerance for folks who waste my time, and try to avoid them whenever possible. If anyone is going to waste my time, it is going to be me! 
And this assumes that people are able to do so. Which means that it ignores that the inability to do so is scientifically linked to a disordered function of the brain. Which equates to ignorance.
And that would be because the punctuality contingent is ignorant of the fact that, particularly with ADD, the deficits do not present identically or consistently. Nobody knows exactly why yet though it likely has to do with fluctuating levels of serotonin, I’m thinking.
At any rate, getting on one’s high horse about this and acting morally superior about one’s punctuality and judgmental of others’ lack thereof merely writes you down as lacking in knowledge of current neuroscience. Not the greatest of sins, but not really a laudable position to hold, particularly after you have been put to rights.
I read to read a lot of long posts in a long thread to find one that made perfect sense. Thanks for writing it, Shagnasty.
This guy I used to work with always showed up exactly 7 minutes late. The reason: per the union contract, you couldn’t be written up for tardiness unless you were more than 7 minutes late. So, for him, non-punctuality certainly *was *a choice.
I agree. Punctuality is a social contract. I know I CAN pursue other activities while I’m waiting, but the thing is, we’ve agreed that we were going to spend THIS chunk of time doing THIS activity and I’ve planned my schedule around that. If I wanted to be reading or balancing my checkbook during THIS chunk of time, I would have told you that and we would have agreed on a DIFFERENT chunk of time to do THIS activity. Likewise, if this time was going to be inconvenient for you, YOU have the right to say you can’t make an engagement at the specified time. These things are negotiated up front.
Great thread.
I’ll just add that I have discovered a common element to nearly all the occasions that I have been very late for something – COMPUTERS. We have been so conditioned to think of the damned computer as a “timesaving device”, but the reality (at least for me) is that, at least several times a week, I find that I have been far too optimistic about how long a computer-assisted task was going to take. “Honey, I’ll be home in ten minutes, I just have to do this one quick little thing on the computer…” but then it doesn’t quite work, but you’re sure it should be easy to fix, so you try this, or that…or the thing is slow, or crashes, so you reboot… or… or… , and suddenly, forty minutes have gone by and the missus is furious.
No, ignorance would be to assume that anyone who is chronically late has such a disorder. In case you’re taking notes.
And here would be another example of ignorance, since you ignored the fact that the person I was responding allowed that “one time events” he could make on time. Not only some of the times due to the fluctuating levels of serotonin you detected in dart’s noggin over the Internet with your divining rod. His point was that for one time things he could, in fact, seem to regularly muster the effort or energy or focus or serotonin surge required to get there on time. If that wasn’t his point, I have no idea what distinction he was drawing.
Oh, is that what I did? After what post exactly?
Something I don’t think anyone has pointed out:
While punctuality may or may not be a choice, being smug, snarky, or self-righteous about it definitely is. And I notice that a large plurality of people who make an issue of punctuality do so with varying degrees of smugness, snarkiness, and/or self-righteousness.
A minority appeal to practicality (“we’ve got a lot to do tomorrow”, “we’re all depending on each other”, etc.). But the majority are neither smug nor practical about being on time. It’s what you do because it’s what you do.
I’ll ask you to point to a few examples of said smugness.
Yes. And what you are doing by being habitually late is stating in very clear terms that you consider your time to be more important than mine.
I tend to forget to note that I’ll respond to a trend I’ve observed which will be sparked by a particular post. I wasn’t necessarily addressing you specifically but rather the collective set of people who have descended upon this thread to issue, as
**Beware of Doug ** noted, opinions containing varying degrees of smugness, snark, and/or self-righteousness.
Fine if people being late bothers you (the general ‘you’). Not at all fine to make this an issue of moral superiority.
Where has anyone injected morality into the discussion? Who has claimed moral superiority?
And you also tended to forget the other points in my post, which I mention now only because you tossed out the “ignorance” bomb so blithely. Oh, right, I was point person for the “collective you” at that point.
Isn’t respect a moral concept?
-FrL-
Of course morality is in play, to the extent someone believes another is doing (or not doing) something he shouldn’t (or should). Certainly that implies some form of moral superiority, as any “I behave properly, and you don’t” position would. Since that’s the theme of this thread, it seems a bit, well, self-righteous to point out an air of moral superiority in a thread that essentially invited it. Or should only people respond who have no real opinion on the matter?
By the way, Frylock, I was directing that to the “collective you.”
Perhaps. But it is a bit of a stretch to state that someone has claimed moral superiority by simply pointing out that a particular habit is disrespectful. By that logic, anytime someone expresses displeasure at the behavior of another he is proclaiming moral superiority.
Ah, once again the “brain damage” canard. Unfortunately, the region of my brain that would need to be disordered to find this argument credible is functioning normally.
You are cordially invited to prove me wrong by citing these neuroscientific discoveries, though, and in particular the evidence suggesting the extremely high incidence of this brain disorder in the general population.