And since when has Christian meant nice, kindly, good etc.?
gex gex: That meaning for Christianity has been the intended one since roughly 30 A.D.
I hope that answers your question.
- Rick
unc: Please acquating yourself with the difference between “government entity” and “privately funded business not receiving federal funds.”
In the meantime, I shall acquaint myself with the proper spelling of “acquaint.”
featherlou
Civil rights laws for the most part (the ADA and transgender rights ordinances come to mind as exceptions) deal with categories, not specifics. They reference “race,” “religion,” “sex,” “sexual orientation” and so on, not specific races, religions, sexes or sexual orientations. It is just as illegal for a member of a “special interest group” to discriminate on the basis of a person’s protected class status as it is for “other people” to discriminate against them (see Regents of the University of California v. Bakke, 438 U.S. 265 (1978)).
As far as the ad referenced in the OP, the First Amendment allows for organizations with a religious purpose to hire in accordance with their religious beliefs (within limits). A church may refuse applications for spiritual leaders from people not of the faith of the church. A Christian book store is allowed to hire only Christians. The Boy Scouts may limit their membership to those who profess a belief in a supreme being. And so on. Working in a warehouse is hardly IMHO a job that requires one profess a particular faith.
IANAL and YMMV.
Yup, that’s why I stay out of Great Debates. Thanks for the info, Otto.
Otto: Most “transgender rights” ordinances merely prohibit discrimination on the basis of “gender identity”. As such, they are categorical, not specific. It would be illegal, under such an ordinance, to refuse to hire a person because they were not transgendered unless the position specifically required it as a BFOQ. (There are such jobs.)
I’m not too sure that the company is technically doing anything illegal. The question about being a Christian was not on the job application, and the OP mentioned that the Christian stuff was on the job description… once again, not illegal. Sounds like they’re skating on the thin edge of (il)legality…
I wouldn’t sue… why bother? To get a job where you’d be instantly ostracized by everybody else who works there?
JohnT, when the law says “bona fide occupational qualification” it means bona fide occupational qualification. Employers can’t get around antidiscrimination laws that easily.
I wonder: does this same protection (can’t not hire someone for a basic, non-religiously oriented job) apply to political affiliation? I would think it would – if you’re hiring someone, I would assume that you can’t just refuse to hire them because they’re a Democrat/Republican/Whatever unless that would substantially effect their job performance, right?
Just wondering…
Kirk
Nope, employers can discriminate based on political affiliation, sexual orientation, shoe size, hair color, and whatever else they desire as long as their criteria does not conflict with title VII, which prohibits discrimination based on “race, color, religion, sex, or national origin”. If it’s not one of those five, federal law does not apply and they can choose whoever.
State laws and city ordinances may include sexual orientation, age, weight, etc. but again, unless it is specifically mentioned the employer can discriminate at will.
Another thing, some people seem to be confusing the public employers, private employers, and private clubs. Public employers have to obey title VII and their own governmental hiring policies which tend to be less discriminatory. In some areas discrimination based on sexual orientation may be prohibited for state and city agencies but not private employers. Private employers have to obey the “race, color, religion, sex, or national origin” stipulation in title VII, but otherwise are free to discriminate however they please. Private clubs are not covered by title VII and can discriminate at will.
This is where some of the people in this thread are getting mixed up: employers and clubs. Private clubs such as Augusta National (the Masters golf tournament) can prohibit women from joining. That’s perfectly legal. However, if they start hiring they can not discriminate against women for their work force - even though they can still exclude women from their membership.
All this said, it seems like the guys in the OP are violating title VII. I can’t see this warehouse falling under the necesity provision (priests and such) or employing less than 15 people. Also, putting the question “Are you a Christian?” on page two of the application is just over the top. Somebody should sue them, as this is unbelievably blatant and goes far beyond what Chik-Fil-A ever did. Throw the book at 'em.
By the way, I’m a Christian.
KellyM, I’m curious as to what jobs would require the job holder to be or not be transgendered as a BFOQ.
Wow, you learn something every day, even in the 'Pit!
I stand corrected.
It most certainly would be. You don’t need to be a Christian to stack Christian books, any more than you need to be a gourmet chef to stack cookbooks.
JohnT, you may want to read the rest of the thread:
Here is an interesting question for the teeming millions that derives from this OP:
Is the company in question espousing Christian values?
If the motivation, as seems apparent, is to exclude non-Christians from employment opportunities within the company, is such exclusion consistent with Christian values?
How does a Christian reconcile that approach with the Golden Rule? Or have the Christians modified the Golden Rule to read:
“Do unto Christians as you would have them do unto you”?
Shemale escort.
Critical1, I can understand if you don’t want to go through the hassle of a court battle, but I would still contact these guys: Washington State Human Rights Commision. Pay especial atention to the part about “filing a complaint” and the FAQ’s section under “General Information”. They may not be able to do anything if you want to remain anonymous, but all it takes is a phone call to find out. Could be that is all you ever have to do to set things in motion.
The warehouse’s practice is against the law, but will continue unless somebody reports them to the proper authorities.
If this was an online job posting, you should complain to the operators of the posting service. They can get in trouble for allowing an employer to run illegal ads.
**
That’s kinda lame. IMO, political philosophy/membership is as fundamental as religion, if not more so. I, personally, don’t think people should be able to discriminate against ANYTHING that won’t effect an applicant’s ability to do their job. Particularly unchosen traits like sexual orientation.
Given that Chik-Fil-A has been sued before, I believe, for firing folks for being non-Christian, and is notorious for firing gay people for being gay. Anyone who eats at Chik-Fil-A is supporting one of the most rancid, evil and bigotted companies in America.
Kirk