But wait, I figgered Air Force boot camp was just a lot of putting & driver practice, with new recruits having to fetch the balls out of water traps.
- ducks & runs *
Silly Cranky, that’s Advanced Individual Training you’re thinking about…! [sub]…waits for inevitable pie-in-face…[/sub]
(emphasis mine)
I read that as you saying that by folding you were weak and that is simply not the case. Your next line says it all-
You had the strength, both of will and of character, not to escalate, but to do the right thing and back off. You showed much more strength by your lack of action than any thing you might have retaliated with physically.
Press charges and he will almost assuredly call you a pussy and a coward and all that stuff, but you’ll still be the one who is right. His friends (I recall you saying he had a “posse” or something) will probably join in with the name-calling and sniping, but as other said, document and press on. You are the one who is right.
That’s another thing, when you see HR, if you haven’t already, make sure to name names WRT his buddies that were doing stuff too. That way, if they decide to retaliate for him, they’re already known by the management and it’s a simple step to bust their ass too. If the HR doesn’t help out, as much as you might not want to, get a lawyer and sue. This is not a petty thing, like coffee in your crotch, this is work-place assault and not only do you have a leg to stand on, you’ve got two big fat shiny boots to kick some ass with. Go forth…
FIRST of all, DO talk to HR, the upper management, whatever – and that includes a lawyer if necessary. Not only will you stand up for yourself, you’ll send a message that this will NOT be tolerated for anyone else, either. You’ll be a hero to those coming after you who would also face the same treatment.
Second, your plaint reminds me of Junior High (hardly a good comparison, I know) but I was the school “Goat” because I was intelligent, somewhat shy, and physically not attractive according to the standards of the day. I remember my mother telling me “If you wouldn’t react, they’d leave you alone.” My reply was: “Mother, if I talk back to them, I’m reacting. If I cry, I’m reacting. If I tell on them, I’m reacting. And if I ignore them, I’m reacting. I CAN’T WIN!” Not very hopeful, I know, but the truth is these bullies will do anything to get to you, and will succeed. Ignoring them is the best reaction, because eventually they’ll get bored and go away. The trick is surviving until that happens. Another help is having some muscle/authority on your side.
Meanwhile, hang in there. I know this will work itself out, and what’s coming down the road WILL be better – it always is!!! My thoughts and meditations will be with you.
Dave, You’ve been given some good advice here and, IMO, some advice that you just might want to put on the back burner.
The incident you experienced certainly deserves the attention of management and perhaps even lawyers; from your description of the event, the perp is a jerk. My concern is with the venom in your description of your feelings.
If you haven’t done so already, it’s just a few short weeks before you’ll raise your right hand and swear an oath.
My concern is that just a few short minutes later you’ll want to raise perhaps that same hand and strike out at a DI for some indignity (however real or imagined) they’ve inflicted on you (mind you, we’re only talking boot camp here).
If your reaction CAN POSSIBLY reach the level of your OP, I’d recommend you do anything to back out of the AF ASAP. I, for one, would prefer the AF not spend a dime on someone with the mindset you displayed in the OP. Nor would I, as a Chief Petty Officer, want to have such a volatile personality aboard in my work center; you’d be too much of a liability in accomplishing any mission at hand, under any pressure.
I beg to differ, Uigi. As a 15 year Petty Officer 1st Class (SS/SW), Work Center Supervisor, and Recruiter (Seven Gold Wreaths), I’ve no issue whatsoever with AD. Any issues his repressed anger and general self-doubt may bring are compensated for by his obvious intelligence and apparent self control. The rest is a leadership issue. When I was active duty (not too long ago), I faced this challenge time and again, and I never failed to meet the challenge successfully. I’m no super PO, and while I was always ranked, I was never in the top 10. In short, if I, as an slightly better-than-average NCO, could handle it, I’m sure the Air Force can muster the same level of profesional achievement in their own NCOs. In my experienced opinion, based upon what I’ve observed of him in these boards (an admittedly limited source), and assuming his Recruiter has any clue whatsoever, military service is just the ticket for Dave, and he’ll have plenty to contribute to his chosen service.
Hey 'Uigi, Fuck off. No one has asked your petty officer opinion anyway.
Doors, you did the right thing. That fuckwad wasn’t worth it. But don’t bottle it up, go beat the shit out of an inanimate object (punching bag, garbage can, whatever). Then forget about it. Fuck him, who cares. 2 years from now you’ll a hell of alot better of then that shitbird anyway.
Tranquilis…
I think ya’ missed my point. I could easily understand if I’d heard this BBQ immediately after the event; no problem there, at all.
However, after this event AD had to wait some (unknown) amount of time before he was able to log-in/post the OP (are you with me?) and guess what? The venom (that’s my term) is STILL readily apparent. This, after an elapse of time and after some amount of thought to the matter, and some amount of thought to the wording/content/context of the OP.
Therein lies my skepticism that the military is “right” for AD,…regardless of how much credit his recruiter may garner in the process.
I’ll stick by my opinion on this one even if 24 years as Naval Aircrew, CV Battle Group ASW, FOTC and CDC Watch Officer, MOCC Watch Officer, and Leading Chief for a entire gaggle of different divisions that apparently will never count for much in some readers eyes.
AWC, USN (Ret)
Really I think you should show you rage more. People consider angry people powerful and ones that are afraid weak. Fear is no good in situations like that, and will only get you hurt.
What a potty mouth… Jeeez (But, heh, this is the Pit)
YES. Yes yes yes yes yes! (And no, this is not an organic experience)
If nothing else, having taken martial arts tells me how the average person will attack and what to do. Yes it does. However.
The confidence it gives you is worth more than the fancy moves you know after a year or so of training. Yeah, I can do lots of twirly kicks. But I also stuck with something long enough that I have this thing called a black belt. And you cannot take that away from me. (You seriously can’t . . . it’s hidden)
So yeah, knowing that I could kill someone with a marker is very cool. But the experience of the martial art is so much more than "these are pressure points and here’s how to . . . "
Airman Doors: penting up your rage: bad idea. You’ll want to get rid of it. I’m not about to suggest ways to do it because I don’t know what does it for you. I started chopping wood and now I lay concrete.
AD, I can’t tell you the rage I felt when I read your OP. #1) Someone’s assaulted someone who’s joining me in blue - therefore an aqcuaintance. #2) Someone else has to be seeing or at least observing this asshole’s behavior and isn’t coming forward. I believe it’s physically impossible to be an asshole to just one person. Aren’t there witnesses you could pull on your behalf? #3) If he lays a finger on you again, after you get everything documented, you have him by the balls. I’m not saying to give up and roll over, but defend yourself and know that you are in the right. Knowing I was perfectly correct in questionable activities was a “force multiplier” for me. . .
You’ve got buds that’ll stand up against this shit with ya. Remember that.
Tripler
And how big is this fuck? I don’t care. I’ll make him your bitch.
I would highly recommend that you take up martial arts after you finish with boot camp. Not so much for the fighting ability, and practice of engagement, but more for the discipline and self-control that a good martial arts instructor will give you.
Many years ago when I taught beginning Kenpo Karate classes, almost every new session a mother would encourage her 10-15 year old son/daughter to talk with me. Usually, Mom would also say that getting picked on was an additional reason why they wanted to study. My heart would go out to these kids. I would have a long chat one-on-one with these kids and tell 'em the following, if you stick with it for at least a year or two, you will
a) gain lots of self respect and esteem
b) be able to kick some serious ass (including breaking bones when you want to and knocking the wind out of someone when that is appropriate)
c) achieve a level of mental and physical control you never dreamed existed.
d) by the time you get a, b and c, I would put some big money on the table that you will not exude whatever it is that some people think make you a target. If you get into a confrontation like the one at work, you would either surgically put him down in a heartbeat or even more likely such confrontations will never even occur because the bully will recognize that you aren’t a pushover.
But martial arts are not the easy answer. You have to put in the hours for at least a year or two to realize the benefits. I would recommend looking into Aikido, which is a purely defensive art and might be a great philosophical match. The other thing I would recommend is a “family karate” style dojo. These type of places are usually like a big extended family and the values they teach are excellent.
I went to Human Resources today and filed a statement regarding this little incident. Their response to the situation was very much to the point:
“It doesn’t matter if you were the most evil bastard on the planet. He is not entitled to strike you under any circumstances.”
So, that being said, methinks the guy is about to be summarily dismissed. And not a moment too soon.
My next concern is how this situation is going to play out. I have been told by the Human Recources manager that I am still obligated to go in to work until this plays out. I have serious concerns about any retaliation resulting from this.
The reason they gave me is that if I don’t show up, I’ll be terminated for lack of attendance. They know what will happen if I go back. And so do I. So I told them that I am not inclined to go back to work on that shift. We’ll see how that ends up. I should just quit outright, but I’m not sure what effect that will have on things, and I’m determined to see this through.
Anyway, upon reflection, I’m much calmer now. I took care of the problem in the proper manner. I think that having done so has eased my anger.
And yet, I feel remorse. I know it was assault. I know it was wrong. I know I was feeling vengeful earlier. But the guy is going to lose his job over this. A mistake, made due to weak character. That’s too bad. I’m not going to tear myself apart crying over this, but I am cognizant of the fact that he is being punished quite severely for what amounts to an indiscretion.
But that’s neither here nor there. I’m satisfied at this point with the way the situation is being handled. Shortly this will all be a fading memory. And that’s probably for the best.
Thanks, everyone, for your support. I really needed it.
A few points:
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Dave: Stress is self-generated; stressors are not. Lasing out with fisticuffs is a chosen reaction. The military taught me that and it also taught me how to deal with my own anger/rage/stress.
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Kvallulf: From your comment in this thread, you evidently don’t know much about what a Petty Officer is or does. I say this as a Petty Officer First Class (Retired). Get back to us after you learn a tad.
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'Uigi: I don’t know when you retired; however, a few years back, the US Navy ceased ranking on the Evaluation Reports. At the same time as the numerical rankings on the front were discontinued, the so-called implicit rankings in the Remarks section of the Evaluation Reports were prohibited.
-
Back to Dave and the situation discussed in the OP: every employer should inform an employee when that employee is hired what the grievance procedures are. If, and when, Dave goes through Basic, he’ll be instructed in the Air Force’s procedures for same.
You feel remorse? You did with the law what you wanted to do with your fists! You should be proud of yourself!
And if you double-guess him laying violent hands on you as an indiscretion, then you are dead wrong. Nobody should have to even fear this sort of environment. Think of it this way - if you didn’t make a stand for yourself, who else would he have smacked around physically? What would it have taken before he was fired for this? Someone hurt or even hospitalized?
Good on you. Good job!
Tripler
Nope. I got your point, I just think you’re incorrect. I’ve had to deal with these kinds of situations, and more than once. They were never (thank God) caused by my sailors, but sometimes inflicted on them, and sometimes I was the CDO (yes, as a blueshirt, I pulled CDO [COMNAVBASE Philly]: I may be only somewhat above average over all, but my judgement and experience had the Admiral’s respect) who got to clean-up someone else’s mess. I’ve had my kids come to me two, three days after an experience like this, still trembling with anger, still horribly ashamed that they’d somehow been at fault, and you know what? They kept right on being good sailors. All it takes is a good NCO looking out for the troops. My shops produced more petty officers, and caught more commendary stationary than any two other shops combined at each command where I was a WCS. My troops busted their asses for me, and made me look good. I busted my ass for them, and made sure they were treated right, and advanced. AD is welcome on my watch; I’d make a proper PO out of him.
Disclaimer: I identify myself as only slightly above average because I always got gigged on Military Bearing: I frequently had a waistline defect. Straight four-oh otherwise. I’ve a host of other honors & responsible positions that I’ll not bore the board with, as they don’t apply to the issue at hand.
Monty
You sure that wasn’t aimed at me? I think I’m the only one that mentioned ‘ranking’. I was still on active duty (Command Career Counselor, in fact) when Iron Mike changed the process. I included the comment on my ranking that 'Uigi could better get an idea of where I’m coming from.
Does anyone else have the feeling that the sooner Airman Doors goes on active duty the better? I for one could stand a little vacation.
Oh, c’mon… This thread’s only 37 <Oops!> 38 posts long! 
And I for one am gettng a lot out of your existence here too…
Give the guy a break. I’m sure you’ve had bad days too, and nobody’s trying to get rid of you