Having just witnessed a very disturbing thread elsewhere in the Pit (I think we all know what I am talking about) … I would just like to emphasize for anyone out there who, over the course of time, has lost sight of the forest for the trees:
This is a message board. It, and what people say in it, should have little more significance in your life than a “Seinfeld” re-run.
This is supposed to be about amusing enlightenment on the great and trivial questions of our time – isn’t it?
Anyone using this forum for reasons other than its intended entertainment purposes, and as a replacement for the things and relationships that really matter in life, is playing with fire, IMHO.
Not trying to get up on a soapbox and be sanctimonious here, but what I saw just a few minutes ago has me more than a little rattled.
“In much wisdom is much grief; and he that increaseth knowledge increaseth sorrow.” - Ecclesiastes 1:18
I’m with you, Milossarian. I don’t mean this as a criticism of OpalCat - obviously she has some serious problems and the SDMB just happened to be where they spilled over today. I’ve certainly seen and heard some pretty off-the-wall behavior induced by medications (even experienced some weird episodes myself).
I’m talking about the average posters who, IMO, take this board WAY to seriously. I’ve always read the BBQ Pit posts in a humorous light, and been suprised that some people appear to be genuinely angry. I’ve seen posters go ballistic in other forums (usually GD) when corrected or criticized, as though anything said on this board actually MEANS anything.
Why in the world should anyone care if someone that doesn’t even know them calls them an ignorant slut or whatever? Are the faceless people here so important to your life that you really care about their opinions?
If you don’t like what is said here, or the way it is said, to the point that it makes you angry or upsets you in any way, DON’T COME HERE. Why torture yourself? If you go out to a bar or a restaurant and don’t like the atmosphere, do you keep going back day after day?
If your ego is so fragile that criticism or flames on a message board seriously threaten your self-esteem or happiness, perhaps you should find a different hobby.
Some days you’re the dog, some days you’re the hydrant.
I agree. This seems to be a common problem across all message boards. Just speaking for myself… this is a place I check in to for a few minutes to take a break from real life. Not much worth watching on TV nowadays. Here there is some entertainment, some interlectual stimulation, interaction with people all over the world whom you’d never meet otherwise. Some people subsribe to these boards and they become the center of their existance… Get a life people! This is entertainment! Our opinions mean nothing in the grand scheme of life!
I saw the photograph before it was deleted and it shook me more than anything has for a while. But worse was the debating/attacking, etc. that folllowed.
Okay, this is a board, a bunch of words on a screen, but over time we get to know the people behind the words, at least to some degree. But even for total strangers, the free-for-all was pretty disturbing. And I can’t just write it off as by the relative “distance” of internet relating. Nothing in my experience quite compares to the personal tone of some of the attacks.
Yes, it’s a message board but the fact is that real–and even IRL–friendships have grown up here. And even if that definition of community doesn’t hold, I still can’t reconcile the myself to some of the casual cruelties and plain, mean obliviousness that happened.
It’s not “just a message board” to me. It was, when I first came on…I couldn’t understand why people got so angry about this thing or that thing, and my sentiments were the same. “Jeez, it’s just a message board, it isn’t real life.”
Even in the short time I’ve been here, though, I’ve talked to and met people that I consider my friends. Real friends, not just words on a screen…I’ve travelled for hours to meet some of these people, and I plan on doing it again in the next month. Boli (who lives just a few blocks away from me) has visited my house several times, and TVeblen stayed the weekend earlier this month. There are several other posters on my AIM and ICQ lists, whom I’ve gotten to know fairly well through private conversations, emails and chats at #straightdope. If it were any of my business to talk about it, I could name at least four couples who’ve paired off in the last few months. I don’t think it’s “just a message board” to them, either.
After spending so much time talking to various people, on and off the board, I don’t feel like I’m just hanging out with a bunch of strangers. I feel like I’m spending time with my friends. We’ve been supportive of each other when we were feeling low, and happy for each other when something spectacular had happened, and shared all the emotions in between. I’m deliriously happy for the four aforementioned couples, worried and sad about Opal, excited for Auraseer getting his new job and new apartment, proud of Manny for his new moderator position, etc.
::shrug:: I understand where you’re coming from, but again…the SDMB isn’t “just a message board” to me. I’m sure, not to a lot of people.
“…being normal is not necessarily a virtue. It rather denotes a lack of courage.”
Don’t misunderstand me, TVeb – I’m fully aware and I fully agree that attachments and relationships can grow beyond the “detached Internet level” in places like this. When it gets to the point where it replaces real life, it can become unhealthy.
It’s up to each individual to keep it in its proper perspective, I guess is what I’m saying. Knowing someone on-line is not knowing them. It’s like reading every tenth page of a novel.
“In much wisdom is much grief; and he that increaseth knowledge increaseth sorrow.” - Ecclesiastes 1:18
Wow! I had completely passed up those rants. I guess I look for rants on thoughts and ideas rather than people. Having researched it now I conclude that Opalcat overreacted. But when one is depressed that is common. I have been there. The HMO psychiatrist gave me prozac. I got a new manager at work. I simplified my life, got out of debt (took 3 years), relaxed more which led to new friends and new romances (complete with sex!!).
But I will never forget the desperation I felt. All through that I have read this MB. First on AOL up to now. I remember ragging on Lynn Bodoni about Mensa and she wittingly ragged me back. I never told any MB folk. Why? THis was one of the few releases I had at a very difficult time. I guess we all react to tough times differently, but this board is no substitute for therapy. What’s her name’s (I don’t remember, what do you think I am? In Mensa or something) comments did not seem any worse than others to me, but she touched a nerve w/ Opalcat. At that frame of mind, logic and reason sometimes fails.
Wow! I had completely passed up those rants. I guess I look for rants on thoughts and ideas rather than people. Having researched it now I conclude that Opalcat overreacted. But when one is depressed that is common. I have been there. The HMO psychiatrist gave me prozac. I got a new manager at work. I simplified my life, got out of debt (took 3 years), relaxed more which led to new friends and new romances (complete with sex!!).
But I will never forget the desperation I felt. All through that I have read this MB. First on AOL up to now. I remember ragging on Lynn Bodoni about Mensa and she wittingly ragged me back. I never told any MB folk. Why? THis was one of the few releases I had at a very difficult time. I guess we all react to tough times differently, but this board is no substitute for therapy. What’s her name’s (I don’t remember, what do you think I am? In Mensa or something) comments did not seem any worse than others to me, but she touched a nerve w/ Opalcat. At that frame of mind, logic and reason sometimes fails.
Fair enough, Milo, and I don’t disagree. And I’m too tired to be very coherent. My main point got lost in all my wandering around the north 40.
Even beyond the real friendships here–and defining “real” is very individual–somewhere along the line common decency has to kick in. Today’s example was extreme, but not unprecedented. Flaming and debating and shootin’ the shit is one thing, but going beyond and ignoring pain is another.
People are behind the words, and when it becomes obvious that the fray has escalated beyond good fun, debate and fighting ignorance then it’s time to cool it. That isn’t compromising positions or beliefs. It’s backing off of people who have had a sore spot struck.
Funny, I had just been saying more or less the same thing to my boyfriend last night.
This is not a safe forum for people to share personal needs and problems, neither is it designed to be. Over 4,000 people, the majority of them lurking strangers, read what is posted here. By sharing the things intimate and dear, you open yourself up to all variety of attack from all variety of people, as this board has its share of all types. Certainly some, if not most, people will be supportive, but there will always be that portion who are simply not encouraging, sympathetic people. Jerks? Perhaps. But they still have the right to be here and have their differing views heard. That’s one of the main functions of a message board–sharing differing ideas.
I have nothing against anyone here, nor should I. I don’t really know any of you, and as a result, what I share with you is “safe” and does not involve me personally in the sense that I’m sensitive about it.
What? I don’t get it. I know something of what happened the last few days with Opal, but what’s this topic? A really nasty flame by Opal, at Opal, about something completely different?
Tell me to forget it and I will, but I’m kinda curious.
I sold my soul to Satan for a dollar. I got it in the mail.
I will reiterate the notion that this is a public message board. Anyone who can’t check his/her ego in at the door, or who feels like their blood pressure go up a notch or two upon entering, really ought to find another place to visit.
David Duchovny once had a quote that he doesn’t visit his web sites because he’s either canonized or vilifed and neither is healthy for his ego. I agree with him. Message boards aren’t for everyone.
And, once again, I apologize for my part in this fiasco, even though it was done unintentionally.
Permit me to respectfully disagree with you, Milossarian.
This message board, despite the statements of some in many threads, is certainly a part of “real life”. I really see the words on my screen, I really read and (I hope) understand them, and, judging by the words placed in various threads, others do likewise.
I don’t know, and I am not asking, what proportion of each poster’s interaction with others comes through the various fora of the SDMB, as opposed to other message boards, other forms of arm’s-length communications, and face-to-face interactions of various sorts. Perhaps it is much, perhaps of little, but I do not think of any such channel is to be dismissed as not reflecting “real life”, certainly not if it is to be judged by a different set of criteria.
There does seem to be a tendency among certain posters, which I consider unfortunate, to assume that personal insults and challenges here are to be ignored, or at best treated lightly, presumably as opposed to those delivered in person. Whilst this is surely a narrowband form of communication, conveying in many cases far less information we should like, I should be reluctant to find that any poster would treat a corrupt mind with less than the disrespect it deserves because that mind is attached to a pair of winsome eyes in “real life”, or that a position that is carefully thought out and set forth is dealt lightly “merely” because it is delivered as lighted phosphors on a screen, rather than across a barroom table in a solemn and portentious voice.
Given that any one exchange is, I certainly trust, an insignificant amount of any person’s interaction with all others, it would by this line of reasoning that everything, yes, even an insult delivered across the dinner in a cold, contemptuous voice, ought to be neglected as not representing “real life”, but only a tiny fraction of that “real life”. I do not think that many would try to argue that position, here or elsewhere.
It is often said that “anything is possible”. In fact, very few things are possible, and most of them have already happened.
I disagree. Anything you interact with, changes you, be it a book, a game, or a message board. You will make an emotional investment in it. For some, that investment is little, for others, it is a lot. It takes time to read this board, and that there is an investment.
Some people react to video games, some people react to a football game, and others respond to the written word. To claim that it is just a message board is a truism yes. But to think that means that message boards have no real impact is a very limited view to take I think, even message boards that are of cork and on a wall have had very heated subjects debated on them. Do you think Paines(sp) Common Sense was never posted on a message board before the American Revolution? I don’t want to make it sound like I think that message boards have some sort of higher spiritual aspect to them, or that they in someway are part of the one true path etc. But they do require interaction, and that will change you.
>>Being Chaotic Evil means never having to say your sorry…unless the other guy is bigger than you.<<
The difference is, is that those who participate on a message board choose to do so at their own will. Most of our person to person (IRL) contact is something in which we usually don’t have a lot of choice. It is hard to avoid the person who flips us off and calls us an asshole when we cut him off in traffic. We have no control over the rude clerk at the grocery store. Unless we change jobs, we can’t change the shitty attitude of the person in the next office. Just like the “real life” you mention, there are all types of people here on the SDMB with all types of personalities. Not to sound callus, but it’s easy to take care of the problem that may cause heartache and sadness - JUST DON’T LOG ON TO THE MB. Problem taken care of. Simple.
I agree wholeheartedly that screen names are much more than words, that there are real people behind the monitor. I have come to know and respect many people here, and believe me when I say that I consider them friends. However, the SDMB has always been full of sarcastic humor and amusing flames and I for one hope it never changes (hell, just read a SD book). I don’t think it is a big surprise to anyone when a heated debate turns into a flame war and I don’t think it shocks anyone when a troll gets a good spanking. I think that part of the attraction to the SDMB is the sarcasm and biting humor along with the intelligence of most of the people.
If things written on a message board upset a person, then why participate? It doesn’t make much sense, does it? There are 90000 other message boards that are nothing but sweet, gooey, hug and kissy stuff. I participated on one for about 2 months and then had to leave before I started to vomit, but hey, there were a lot of people on that board so obviously it holds an attraction. Isn’t it a little . . . . uhhhh. . . . . dumb . . . to voluntarily stay in a place that makes you feel bad?
I am not referring to Opal, I have been on the SDMB with her for a couple of years and think she is great and can hold her own. The situation yesterday was unique and temporary and I hope she returns to the board soon. Get well Opal!
To some people, it’s not just a message board or words on a screen. You want to see some of the people and issues I wound up confronting in my time online?
Girl who was once raped and left for dead. Now married to an abusive jerk whom she cannot leave, and constantly thinks of killing herself.
Guy who was in the process of being kicked out of his parents house because they found out he was gay.
Girl who has an overbearing mother, leading her to put a knife to her wrist as others were chatting with her.
Girl who is sick with an ailment doctors could not figure out, and the fear she lived with every day because of it.
There are more.
On one occassion, I called in sick to work because I was chatting with someone who needed help, and guess what? My text helped.
It goes to follow if my text can help, it could also hurt.
Maybe some people do take the whole internet thing too seriously. Maybe I’m one of them, what with my reaction to some assholes here a couple months ago. Who knows…
What I do know is that this medium DOES mean a lot to some people, and for some it’s a refuge from the world around them. I refuse to take thm lightly, even if it’s not the most productive thing in the world, and situations like this would be exhibit A for my reasoning.
It feels curious to agree with Satan, but,hey, there ya go!
<<<<What I do know is that this medium DOES mean a lot to some people, and for some it’s a refuge from the world around them. I refuse to take thm lightly, even if it’s not the most productive thing in the world, and situations like this would be exhibit A for my reasoning.>>>>>>
This hit me last night after I got offline, I was still numb and I had no one to talk to about it. This is ‘just’ a message board to those that are often called trolls, that post something and split soon after. Yeah, I see that there are over 4000 people listed as members, but there is a core group that I’ve ‘watched’ since the summer, and noted the difficulties and problems, and I got the people behind those things without ever having seen them. It wasn’t ‘just a message board’ anymore.
We all live in a fast paced world and most of our communication is on the run. This has become a place with humor, debate, things that I’ve learned about the board itself, as well as my computer. Maybe it is a ‘just’ to those saying it, but I don’t think it ought to be forgotten that it isn’t necessarily the same for others.
I don’t say anything on here that I wouldn’t be able to say in person to anyone. Some of the flippant things that come out so easily at the tips of your fingertips might not be so easy to SAY when you see the other person’s eyes widen in pain…would you think? But, you see, THAT is what has to be understood here, you can’t REALLY check your ego at the door. It is with you, and the ability to be hurt is with you as well… I think that deserves some more thought, and alot more respect than its gotten.
I totally agree with you Satan, but the people I am referring to are those who get upset, pissed, depressed, and a dozen or so other feelings that aren’t so good, but continually come back for more.
If a person allows themself to let the words from a stranger make them feel bad, then isn’t it their fault if they stay?
If someone was hitting my hand with a hammer, I think I would move my hand.
It seems sad to me that a thread has to have been started to remind folks that 1.) there are people behind these glowing and non glowing phospors on the monitor screen and that 2.) words can hurt people.
I guess I’ve been hurt enough by words that I’m very conscious of that and I try to avoid doing it to others. Except in extreme circumstances. That’s why in the little time that I’ve spent here, I’ve avoided the pit. I never found the wars all that much fun. The Cyberian one on the old MB sure wasn’t.