People ask other people out on dates so they can audition to be their next SO. Of course that means getting to know one another, but you could do that just as easily as talking on the phone or emailing each other. A date is a courting ritual, and thus serves a purpose larger than just fact-finding. You’re assuming that in a first date situation, both parties are equally invested in each other. But that’s not often the case because a lot of times they barely know each other. And also, one person may have a lot more options than the other.
If you applied for a job you really wanted and asked the manager for an interview, would you expect him to pay your cab fare or gas mileage? If you found out he wasn’t even going to validate your parking, would you sulk about it or just accept it as the price of admission to the game of life?
If you really want that job you’re going to put on your big boy pants and do whatever it takes to get your foot in the door. Newsflash: This is no different than dating. Women dig guys who have can make shit happen without whining about money.
Not really on topic as far as gender roles in dating, but I don’t see anything wrong w/ basic chivalry, including paying for a meal on a date or otherwise. I still let woman off of an elevator first, and I always hold a door open. Sometimes I’ll even pull out a chair or open a car door for a lady. Are these things sexist? I figure there’s nothing wrong with being a gentleman, and I’ve been teaching my nine year old son the same thing. I was so proud the first time I saw him let a woman off of the elevator ahead of him.
Most girls in my age group are well on board with the going dutch thing. If they aren’t, generally speaking they aren’t the type of girl for me, so I’m not too worried about them not wanting a 2nd date.
I don’t view a potential date as Her Highness, Holder of the Vagina, Possessor of the Tits, Granter of Blow Jobs, and Defender of the Nookie who must be appeased. I view her as an equal who ought to equally desire a relationship. If she doesn’t, there are plenty of girls that do.
Why would he be asking me out if he doesn’t want the privilege of my company? If he just wants me to spend time with him without spending any money, then it makes no sense for him to ask to take me out to dinner, does it? He should simply ask me to take a walk around the block with him, if a $15 meal is so objectionable. But then he can’t complain if I say no to that. A walk around the block is nice if I know I already like you. If I don’t know that yet, then I may have to turn the you down. Thems the breaks.
Most of the time when a guy asks me out for the first time, I don’t know if it will be enjoyable. I hope that it will be, but sometimes it’s not. If I knew for a fact that he was a guarranteed good time, then we’d be well past the 1st date stage and therefore well past the stage wherre I’m trying to figure out whether the guy is relationship material.
I never look at a guy and think “free meal”. But if I look at guy and think “he’s too cheap to buy me dinner…and he’s going to whine about money everytime we go out”, then yeah, I decline. It’s horrible I know, but what can I say.
By the way, I spent last weekend in Seattle and had a blast spending money on my romantic interest. I guess some guys absolutely hate spending money, even if it’s on a woman that are trying to woo into bed. But I enjoy spending money on people I like.
Not necessary with his generation, who will undoubtedly meet his well-intentioned gestures with quizzical looks and/or annoyance. Waiting to let women off also creates unnecessary confusion.
Note that this is quite different from teaching him to offer aid to a person (not just a woman) in need of assistance. For example, helping an elderly man down stairs that has no guardrail or opening the door for someone whose arms are full.
Good for you. I don’t recommend you view women like this. Treating a woman as an equal has nothing to do with basic facts of life, though. All other things being equal, a guy who is generous with his money when it comes to dating will go further than one who demands on going dutch. It has nothing to do with putting women on a pedestal, and all to do with supply and demand.
***US? *** What “us” are you talking about? I knew one woman who was like that all through the 70’s and 80’s. My guess is that the only way she is no longer playing such hypocritical games is if she is now dead, comatose, or at least bedridden.
Nor was she unique in my experience.
1958? ***1958??? **** I could see maybe someone thinking that things started to change around 1967, or so.
Have you completely lost it?!
I meant the above as hyperbole. Please don’t try to hit me through the screen.
Have a nice day, Diana.
- Jack
The second mention of the year is meant to be read with the same tone Picard used the second time he says “The Academy?!” to the Star Fleet bigwig who asked him to transfer to its leadership because he needed someone he could trust to monitor it against the alien worm conspiracy.
I don’t want to spend no money. I want to split the cost. It’s not really a matter of the actual money. It’s the attitude of “I will deign you with my presence in exchange for a free meal” that I don’t like.
I don’t agree that wanting to go dutch on dates is a sign of cheapness. Trust me, I spend a fair chunk of change on clothes and what not for my appearance, and that is almost solely aimed at attracting the opposite sex. The dutch date thing is symbolic. It symbolizes that this date is a date of equals, not the classic man chasing woman dynamic. But yeah, if a guy refuses to do fun things or give spontaneous gifts, then I have no problem with you sending him to the scrap heap (assuming he’s cheap and not actually poor).
How about just as someone you like and want to be nice to? :dubious:
Seriously, is buying dinner such a huge deal? Will it leave you without milk money for the rest of the week?
I’d disagree. You wanna hang with the grownups, you’ve gotta bring your wallet. I’ll get you next time, but I’m not really interested in quibbling over the bill.
Supply and demand? That might have applied years ago, but not anymore. The set I ran around with (educated psuedo-yuppies) has a lot more chicks than dicks in it. Go look at any university enrollment in America and you’ll see that its 45% guys 55% girls. Socially, yes, men have to be more aggressive in initiating relationships simply because That’s The Way It Is[sup]TM[/sup], but in terms of flashing cash and what not. Nuh uh. The women, on average, in my generation are the ones that are going to have more money (until they have babies).
I’m not denying that I could flash some cash and pick up A Certain Type of Girl[sup]TM[/sup], but the ones I don’t just want to fuck aren’t generally impressed with that. They’re usually a “don’t call me a chick, chick”.
But what about the first part? When I buy a guy a drink, it’s because I like him, and want to do something nice that indicates that I’m interested in him in a way that I am NOT interested in everyone there that I didn’t buy a drink for.
A date is the same sort of thing. If I ask you out on a date, I’m paying. Not because I’m ‘chasing’ you, but because it differentiates it from a not-date.
I’ve never found it difficult to differentiate a non-date from a date or show someone I am interested in them. Is that really something that has happened to you? I know Seinfeld did the “Is this a date? No? I thought it was a date” thing but that always rang out as just a joke to me.
To be quite honest, if a girl bought me a drink I would be a bit befuddled as to why she didn’t just come talk to me. I don’t really know of guys doing the buy a girl a drink thing anymore. That seems to be something that my parents did.
Uh no. That would be proof that I am willing to spend money to attract strangers of the opposite sex.
See, now this is confusing to me as a woman. I have been asked out to dinner by men and then at the end felt extremely awkward when the check comes because I’m not sure if I should offer to pay my half or not. I thought the rule was that the person who does the asking pays, so I usually don’t offer. To be honest the questions that run through my mind during dinner can ruin the entire date: Should I offer to pay? If I do, will he be insulted? Will he think I don’t “get” dating? Will he think this means I don’t like him and don’t want this to be a “real” date? And now, thanks to the quote above, I will also be wondering if not offering will reflect poorly on my character.
